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Windows 7: WLM 2012 Started Crashing when Sending Emails

25 Sep 2014   #11
nikki605

Windows 7 Pro x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Slartybart View Post
I couldn't determine if the HTML fix was included in superseded Security Windows Updates (WU) - I'm sure it was but rather than spend more time on that.

What is the critical update that you did not install?

Test turning off Norton mail scan - it's really a redundant feature of any AV program.
If the file is written to disk - the AV app should catch it during the write. If malware is already present on your system and it attempts to piggyback on eMail, then the AV app should catch it during a read.
AV apps all work differently and to conserve resources they might not test every read or write - that would really drag a system down, so they choose which paths/streams to test.

Anyway, if the move msgs from Outbox (essentially moving the problem from current msg processing) doesn't solve the issue - try disabling Norton mail scan. I might go as far as asking you to disable Norton as a test, but ... step-by-step and first things first.

I wouldn't leave your system unprotected, but would offer MSE as interim protection - again just to test.
Check my replies above - I think we are leap-frogging each other. There are no messages left in the Outbox when WLM crashes. The message gets sent and is moved to the Sent folder.

This MS update just showed up yesterday (I have all my systems set to notify me of updates, not to download and install them. Important - KB2998527 and Optional - KB2970228


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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25 Sep 2014   #12
Slartybart

x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x64 (6.1.7601) Win7_SP1 HomePrem
 
 

We're ok on posts ... we're just a bit out of sync

I'll slow down a bit (or type faster) so the thread stays linear.

Thanks - I'll see what the important update is, I'm not concerned with the optional one, but will check it anyway.
+ edit
Both WU concern Regionalized issues (Russian time zone and currency)

Neither should cause any problems related to the issue your machine exhibits. Install them a your convenience
- edit
My System SpecsSystem Spec
25 Sep 2014   #13
Slartybart

x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x64 (6.1.7601) Win7_SP1 HomePrem
 
 

Any change after making suggested changes?

No?

Try excluding the existing account in WLM (remove the check from the "include this account..." box)
WLM 2012 Started Crashing when Sending Emails-wlm-excludeaccount.png
Create a new account in WLM using the same credentials as the original account (login, eMail, password, etc)

Sync with only the new account.

This might move the problem out of the way since the new account in the WLM client is isolated from the old account.
Note that all mail on the web account will be resynched to the new WLM client account.


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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25 Sep 2014   #14
nikki605

Windows 7 Pro x64
 
 

It's going to take a while for me to make any changes and then see if the crashes stop. My wife is the primary user of that desktop system. I am typing this post on my laptop. Neither one of us have been on our PCs much today. She has not sent or forwarded any emails today, so no crashes.

I will turn off Norton scanning emails to start.

Let me explain how we use WLM. No messages go through the mail.live.com servers. Think back to WinXP & Outlook Express days where OE was strictly an email client. That is how I am using WLM under Win7. I have 7 accounts set up - 4 through my ISP (Verizon) & 3 Gmail accounts, all POP. The Windows Live account I have set up is strictly for contacts & calendars which are synced with my Windows Phone through the cloud. No email goes through that account. I don't do email from the Windows Phone.

Also, the few message rules I have set up (safe senders & blocked senders) can be found in the Registry. I've found them before for exporting to another system.

Of the 4 crashes, I can only trace one back to the specific email account (Gmail). It wasn't something I was keeping track of, but I will start now.

With Norton scanning turned off, all I can do is monitor. We don't send a lot of emails, but when I have time I can try just sitting here sending/forwarding a bunch to the email account I use on this laptop.

By the way, the crashes occur right when I click the Send button on an email. But as I stated earlier, when WLM restarts, the message has been sent.

Thanks,
Gary
My System SpecsSystem Spec
25 Sep 2014   #15
Slartybart

x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x64 (6.1.7601) Win7_SP1 HomePrem
 
 

Thanks Gary,

It helps to have a good understanding of the use. It saves a lot of suggestions that would never apply (Imap, etc).

You seem to have a firm grasp of the way things work and where things are stored, that certainly helps. If I ever give directions or type in short hand, please don't hesitate to ask "What does that mean Bill?".

Our WLM setups are similar - I have nine accounts setup as POP3 that span various mail servers, (Yahoo, Gmail, AOL, Outlook.com, Comcast, Vze, and a few private domains - No accounts are IMAP or HTML). We both are running x64 boxes and both have the same version of WLM.

Let me echo back what I think you said about the issue:
You compose and send a msg (stored in the outbox - not actually sent)
WLM crashes (not a system crash) when you hit send
the msg is actually sent even though WLM crashes
You can receive mail without WLM crashing as long as there is nothing in the outbox
In your testing, can you determine if a specific mail server is related to the crash. I don't think it will matter since the crash seems to happen before the msg leaves the machine - in other words I don't think it will matter is the server you're sending mail through is Gmail or Vze.

Since it's only about 10% of the time - this will take some trial and error. It would be much easier if it always happened.

A few other simple tests you can try are
1) Send in text only - not rich text or HTML (including any replies or fwds).
This is what the KB I referenced earlier fixed - as it has been superseded, the KB said you didn't need it. I might spend more time researching that and I'll let you know (put it on the back burner, but might revisit based on the results of your testing).

2) In Options->Mail->Advanced tab->Maintenance button: change compact after xxx runs to 1, then close and re-launch WLM triggering the compact. After that change it back to the default of 100.

3) Disk Check
DO NOT scan and fix bad sectors this time (you might based on what this run reports back)
The image in step 4 shows the options you should run. The system will ask you to run at the next boot - answer yes and then restart.
Look in the Event viewer for Chkdsk logs.
Check Disk (chkdsk) - Read Event Viewer Log

That's all I can think of (besides the suggestions given before)

It's my pleasure working with you.

I'll read what you post, when you get the chance to test and post the results.

Thanks,

Bill
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My System SpecsSystem Spec
26 Sep 2014   #16
nikki605

Windows 7 Pro x64
 
 

Here are answers to some of your questions. Since my wife was the one using the PC, I can't give you keystroke by keystroke sequence of events except for the one when I was sitting next to her and witnessed.

Let me echo back what I think you said about the issue:
Q. You compose and send a msg (stored in the outbox - not actually sent)
A. She was replying to a message that was in the Inbox. It had been received through the default Verizon.net email account. The reply was going to go back out through the same Verizon.net POP3 email account.
Q. WLM crashes (not a system crash) when you hit send
A. Yes, that is correct. Not a system crash.
Q. the msg is actually sent even though WLM crashes
A. Yes, that is correct.
Q. You can receive mail without WLM crashing as long as there is nothing in the outbox
A. WLM has never crashed receiving messages. Messages don't remain in the Outbox longer than a fraction of a second, typically, depending on size. Sent messages appear in the Sent items folder, as did this one after WLM restarted after the crash.
I did mainframe computer maintenance starting back in the 1960's before PCs existed. So yes, I've been around computers all my working life.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
26 Sep 2014   #17
Slartybart

x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x64 (6.1.7601) Win7_SP1 HomePrem
 
 

Thanks, this will be hard to narrow down.

Keep the thread up to date on what suggestions you have completed and the resulting status (err codes and or msgs)

I've helped people where even a reinstall doesn't help - then the big hammer comes off the tool belt

Bill
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My System SpecsSystem Spec
26 Sep 2014   #18
nikki605

Windows 7 Pro x64
 
 

I did the WLM compaction and then the Disk Check. Both completed without error.

Gotta go help my wife put the groceries away.

We haven't had a reason to send any emails yet today.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
26 Sep 2014   #19
nikki605

Windows 7 Pro x64
 
 

I just forwarded 7 msgs from 2 different Verizon.net accounts - no crash.

You're right. This isn't gonna be quick.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
26 Sep 2014   #20
Slartybart

x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x64 (6.1.7601) Win7_SP1 HomePrem
 
 

Thanks Gary,

Try to grab as much information as you can when WLM chokes.
If it happens on a particular reply for forward, turn on WLM troubleshooting -General and eMail (Options->Advanced->Maint and forward or reply again.

You might look in the Event Viewer at that time - See if there are any entries that might shed some light on the issue. You don't have to dig through the Event logs now - you could if you want, but it's easier to find things as they occur.

Are we having fun yet? You bet we are.

Watch, it will never happen again!

Bill
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My System SpecsSystem Spec
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 WLM 2012 Started Crashing when Sending Emails




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