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Windows 7: Random BSODs and applications crashes on a fresh Win7 install

24 May 2012   #81
R4ndom

Windows 7 home Premium 64bit
 
 

Yesterday I took everything off and reinstalled - the cards, fans, RAMs, CPU (removed thermal component, applied new, resat, etc) and other connectors - gpu, MB, etc.

I left BIOS on default, except for memory timings, because for some reason BIOS sets it to 1T instead of 2T, and timings 9-9-9-24-33 instead of 9-9-9-20-33. I didn't change voltages, everything went fine. I ran prime95 for 6 hours straight and it detected no errors.


Today I start the PC, prime95 again and it spits out Rounding was 0.5, expected less than 0.4 ... prime froze my PC, so I had to reboot manually. So, I go to BIOS and I see that MB again set the command rate to 1T! I changed it back to 2T, reset the other timings, bumped CPU voltage to 1.45 instead of 1.40 standard, vddnb to 1.350 and I'm running prime again.

I also had a couple of BSODS these days, but won't upload them, as in the meantime I reset/resat everything. Anyway, this time it was "memory management" errors as reported by WhoCrashed, not whea anymore.

You mentioned that CPU idle power may be too low - what would be the remedy to that - I already changed the pwoer plan in windows to balanced, as when set to high it results in a very annoying high-pitched tone coming from around CPU-PSU area.

As for apps crashing, well, basically everything crashes and what's strange, this is very ofthen NOT logged by the Windows event manager (which has also crashed these days). It just crashes, but is not followed by the usual windows message: the programme has stopped and it gives you the choice of restarting it, closing, looking for help online.

At some point it was firefox which would fail every now and then, but among apps listed by you, apart from Fx, there's call of duty modern warfare - IW3MP, sopcast - but this hasn't crashed for a really long time, Prime, irfanview - also haven't seen any crash in weeks, windows explorer, recently I get quite often the following error: .NET Runtime Optimization Service (clr_optimization_v4.0.30319_64) - Service reached limit of transient errors. Will shut down. Last error returned from Service Manager: 0x8000ffff.

There was also an appcrash called livekernel event, which seems to be connected with GPU - but this was also before I resat the GPU.

Now among other apps crashing there's also skype, open hardware monitor, svchost.exe_SysMain, error side by side with a code 72, and there are also crashes of SCII, without any particular reason, but especially when I quite the application. Then MsMpEng.exe, svchost.exe_wuauserv, WinFlash.exe, PnPDriverImportError.

In Windows event viewer under windows logs/system I can see a multitude of errors (sometimes several times every second) connected with Service Control Manager with the following text: The service Computer Browser depends on the service Workstation, which cannot be started due to the followin error: the dependency service doesn't exist or it has been marked for deletion. Then this line is followed by another one: The service Workstation depends on the following service: MRxSmb20. This service cannot be installed.


As for the error reporting text, it's all the same in the phrases you quoted, so I'll translate the first, as the only thing that changes is the app names.

Quote:
2012-04-21 11:33 Application Hang Program firefox.exe w wersji 11.0.0.4454 zatrzymał interakcję z systemem Windows i został zamknięty. Aby zobaczyć, czy jest dostępnych więcej informacji dotyczących tego problemu, sprawdź historię problemu w panelu sterowania Centrum akcji.
Identyfikator procesu: c88
Godzina rozpoczęcia: 01cd1fa6ff9f4216
Godzina zakończenia: 18
Ścieżka aplikacji: D:\Mozilla Firefox\firefox.exe
Identyfikator raportu: ce425251-8ba5-11e1-a87b-14dae9c5e52a
Code:
Programme firefox.exe version 11.0.0.4454 (I now run 12.0) stopped interacting with windows and was closed. To see if there's more information available concerning this problem, please check the problem history in the Problem Reports and Solutions control panel. 
Process ID: c88
Start time: 01cd1fa6ff9f4216
Termination time: 18
Application path: D:\Mozilla Firefox\firefox.exe
Report ID: ce425251-8ba5-11e1-a87b-14dae9c5e52a
Thanks again for your time, for the chronicle BIOS is now set as follows and running Prime95:

CPU v = 1.45
RAM v = 1.65
vddnb = 1.350
OCZ Ram clock = 1333MhZ
RAM timings = 9-9-9-20-33 and CR 2T
CPU Temps as recorded by Open Hardware Monitor:

CPU - max 54C
Core temp - max 43C
after 2 hours of prime95 - so far no errors


My System SpecsSystem Spec
.
24 May 2012   #82
Dave76

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Windows 7 Ult x64 - SP1/ Windows 8 Pro x64
 
 

Just checked a FX-4100 review, at full load the CPU should be at ~ 1.368v

Did you increase the CPU Voltage to 1.45v?
I mentioned this previously, just confirming.

What does the CPUZ CPU tab or HWiNFO64 Sensor say for voltage when at idle and under load?

Not any need to raise the CPU voltage any higher than this, you can disable "Cool 'n' Quiet" in your BIOS.
This is what reduces the CPU frequency and voltage when you don't need the full power, when you turn it off the CPU will stay at full frequency and voltage.
You can test this by recreating the crash scenario, do anything that usually causes a crash.

Let us know the Prime95 results.

Download and run OCCT, if it crashes it will save a file with graphs including voltage levels.
If it crashes upload the graphs here.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
24 May 2012   #83
R4ndom

Windows 7 home Premium 64bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Dave76 View Post
Just checked a FX-4100 review, at full load the CPU should be at ~ 1.368v
You mean this review? AMD FX-4100 Quad Core 3.6GHz Bulldozer Processor Review - AMD FX-4100 Turbo Core Details and CPU-Z - Legit Reviews

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Dave76 View Post
Did you increase the CPU Voltage to 1.45v?
I mentioned this previously, just confirming.
My MB set it on auto @ 1.440 at stock speed of 3600MhZ it would seem, so quite above the stock voltage. As I thought that was the stock voltage, I added 0.1 as suggested.

Here AMD FX-4100 - CPUs - CPU-Components as in my case, the MB also sets a higher voltage, strangely enough it's a lower version of my MB. Another thread I found AMD FX 4100 BE thread in this case it's a gigabyte board that overvolts the fx-4100.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Dave76 View Post
What does the CPUZ CPU tab or HWiNFO64 Sensor say for voltage when at idle and under load?
The readings are as follows for CPU vcore set @ 1.450 in BIOS:
BIOS HWmonitor - 1.476
HWmonitor64 - minimum 0.964 @ idle and 1.413 @ load
CPU-Z - minumum 1.044 @ idle and 1.476 @ load
Open Hardware Monitor 1.032 @ idle and 1.488 @ load

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Dave76 View Post
Not any need to raise the CPU voltage any higher than this, you can disable "Cool 'n' Quiet" in your BIOS.
This is what reduces the CPU frequency and voltage when you don't need the full power, when you turn it off the CPU will stay at full frequency and voltage.
You can test this by recreating the crash scenario, do anything that usually causes a crash.

Let us know the Prime95 results.

Download and run OCCT, if it crashes it will save a file with graphs including voltage levels.
If it crashes upload the graphs here.
Should I then leave CPU voltage @ 1.450 although I saw people getting up to 4.6GhZ with that kind of voltage? Apart from C'n'Q I saw other options in BIOS like C6 state - what should I do with that?

Unfortunately my problem is precisely that I cannot recreate the crash scenario, as it happens randomly, sometimes during idle periods, sometimes just browsing, sometimes just launching an app provokes a crash or BSOD.

For the moment I ran Prime95 with In-place large FFTs test and it didn't hang during something like 2 hours. I'll try the other 2 tests and post the results.

As for OCCT, which of the 2 tests should I run and with which settings? As for voltages reported by OCCT graphs, they have unfortunately the same flaw as HWmonitor64's i.e. 12v is reported to be around 8, which, as you had mentioned would cause that my system wouldn't even boot up. these screenshots are generated every time you stop the app, so I think it's not only when it crashes that you can see graphs - they're saved by default in my documents when exiting the app. Do you want me to upload the screenshots anyway, even if there's no crash?

Thanks!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
.

25 May 2012   #84
Dave76

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Windows 7 Ult x64 - SP1/ Windows 8 Pro x64
 
 

The different CPU voltages are concerning, just leave it where it's at now.

Let's disable C 'n Q for now, this controls CPU frequency and voltage depending on use. Which seems to be more likely considering the description of the crashes you're having. With this disabled your CPU will run at max frequency and voltage at all times, this will tell us if there are issues when the CPU frequency/voltages change.
The C6 states are sleep/hibernate settings, may check them later.

Your crash scenario seems to indicate that it might be when the CPU frequency/voltage change it causes a crash, so test by disabling C 'n Q.

Run OCCT - Large Data Set, not LINPACK.
Even though it may be giving false voltage readings, watch the Voltage graph for changes in the CPU, +12V, +5V and +3.3V, readings. You are looking for drops and fluctuations, these may be causing the crashes.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
27 May 2012   #85
R4ndom

Windows 7 home Premium 64bit
 
 

Hi,

After some testing (still with C'n'Q enabled) and other options left as described in my previous post, I didn't have a single BSOD or app crash for 2-3 days. This however only lasted until this morning, where I had a lovely BSOD again - dump attached, without any apparent reason - I was browsing the net, that's all.

The event viewer reports the following:

Code:
Event name: APPCRASH
Reply: unavailable
Cab file ID: 0

Problem's signature:
P1: svchost.exe_SysMain
P2: 6.1.7600.16385
P3: 4a5bc3c1
P4: sysmain.dll
P5: 6.1.7601.17514
P6: 4ce7c9db
P7: c0000005
P8: 000000000003d9dc
P9: 
P10: 

Attached files: 
C:\Windows\Temp\WERFFB2.tmp.appcompat.txt
C:\Windows\Temp\WERFFE1.tmp.WERInternalMetadata.xml
C:\Windows\Temp\WERFFE2.tmp.hdmp
C:\Windows\Temp\WER1E6.tmp.mdmp

These files may be available here:
C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\WER\ReportQueue\AppCrash_svchost.exe_SysM_91bbaabfdaa7ebd4bf6f962c64299c3c345759_cab_0f9a02cd

Analysis symbol: 
Solution re-check: 0
Report ID: a0816db0-a7da-11e1-9bd6-14dae9c5e52a
Prime95 passed all the 3 tests - all in all 18 hours of continuous testing. Same for OCCT - passed both tests which ran for around 10 hours each (separately from Prime95 - i.e. not at the same time).

Today I disabled the C'n'Q and I had to disable the C6 states as well, otherwise it seems the voltages would change according to the load.

I attach the OCCT screenshots - can you observe anything unusal? this is still from when the C'n'Q and C6 were enabled.

I'll run today OCCT with C'nQ disabled, although again, crashes never happen with PC under load.

thanks!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
27 May 2012   #86
zigzag3143

Win 8 Release candidate 8400
 
 

Just in passing.

You have a driver installed that is known to cause memory management crashes called asacpi.sys. Yours is from 2005


Asacpi.sys

The pre 2009 version of this driver is a known BSOD cause.
Quote:
Please visit this link: Asus tek computer inc. -support- drivers and download p7p55d le

ASUSTeK Computer Inc. -Support- Drivers and Download P7P55D LE
ASUSTeK Computer Inc. - Motherboards- ASUS P5K-VM

Scroll down to the utilities category, then scroll down to the "atk0110 driver for windowsxp/vista/windows 7 32&64-bit" (it's about the 12th item down).

Download and install it.

Go to c:\windows\system32\drivers to check and make sure that the asacpi.sys file is date stamped from 2009 or 2010 (not before).
My System SpecsSystem Spec
27 May 2012   #87
R4ndom

Windows 7 home Premium 64bit
 
 

Thanks, I updated the driver and the current version is from May 2009.

I start again OCCT 4.2.0 version with large data set option.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
27 May 2012   #88
R4ndom

Windows 7 home Premium 64bit
 
 

The OCCT finished without errors and ran for 6 hours, I attach the screenshots.

This was done with C'n'Q and C6 disabled as well as all hibernation/sleep options disabled in windows.

I set the voltage a bit lower in BIOS before launching the test - 1.3875.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
28 May 2012   #89
Dave76

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Windows 7 Ult x64 - SP1/ Windows 8 Pro x64
 
 

The first OCCT files shows low voltage spikes on the CPU VCore graph, seems to be random.
The voltage should be steady with some fluctuation, there seems to be a lot of voltage variation.
My OCCT CPU VCore graphs are flat single lines, yours are showing fluctuations from 1.37 to 1.48 with low spike to 1.25.
Your second CPU VCore is showing fluctuations from 1.315 to 1.41.
This is telling me the power is not stable.

Let's confirm with a shorter test, so we can see the fluctuations better.
Run two more OCCT tests, one with C'nQ enabled (same settings as the first previous test), then the second test with C'nQ diabled (same settings as the second previous test).

Leave it at idle for 5 minutes, then run the same test as before, but for 1 hour only.
I want to get a better look at the CPU VCore voltages.

Here's what mine looks like:
Attachment 213934

Yours:
Attachment 213935
My System SpecsSystem Spec
29 May 2012   #90
R4ndom

Windows 7 home Premium 64bit
 
 

Hi,
I haven't had time to do the test you suggested, I'll post the results as soon as they're done.

Today however I saw a strange thing. When I logged into windows, I checked the event viewer (became almost a habit now for me) I saw more than a 100 entries marked as "windows error reporting" and "appcrash" "apphang" and "bex", however their "level" was indicated as "information" and not "error" with an exclamation mark. But the thing is that NONE of these apps was launched at the time windows reported errors! At least not all of them, as I don't know which windows services were running at logon. The list is long, but I'll give a few examples.

svchost.exe_SysMain, sysmain.dll - these two at least 20 times within 1-2sec intervals, then iw3mp.exe - this was not launched at all, explorer.exe (apphang) although I didn't experience any hang, SopCast.exe - wasn't launched, PRIME95.EXE - wasn't running, i_view32.exe - wasnt' running, firefox.exe - wasn't running, WinFlash.exe, Skype.exe - wasn't running, pidgin.exe - wasn't running, Mahjong.exe - never launched it since I installed windows, java.exe, iexplore.exe, Explorer.EXE, Dwm.exe, Microsoft Windows.NetworkDiagnostics.1.0, and so on. So now it's getting even funnier, as things crash even before they're launched

So I tried sfc, it said it couldn't repair certain files. I booted from WinDVD to scan it with offboot/offwindir command. It said the same, it couldn't repair certain files. I looked at the CBS.log file and here's what I found:

Code:
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002ee [SR] Verify complete
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002ef [SR] Repairing 6 components
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002f0 [SR] Beginning Verify and Repair transaction
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002f1 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:76{38}]"Rights-Management-Client-v1-API-DL.man" of Microsoft-Windows-Migration-DownlevelManifests, Version = 6.1.7601.17514, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002f2 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:50{25}]"VaultCredProvider.dll.mui" of Microsoft-Windows-Security-Vault.Resources, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture = [l:10{5}]"pl-PL", VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002f3 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:36{18}]"Amd64\BRM7840N.GPD" of prnbr006.inf, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type = [l:24{12}]"driverUpdate", TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002f4 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:36{18}]"Amd64\hpc4600t.vdf" of prnhp005.inf, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type = [l:24{12}]"driverUpdate", TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:11, Info                  CSI    000002f5 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:20{10}]"aeevts.dll" of Microsoft-Windows-Application-Experience-Common-Logger, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_INTEL (0), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002f6 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:16{8}]"WMIC.exe" of Microsoft-Windows-WMI-Command-Line-Utility, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_INTEL (0), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002f7 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:36{18}]"Amd64\BRM7840N.GPD" of prnbr006.inf, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type = [l:24{12}]"driverUpdate", TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002f8 [SR] This component was referenced by [l:186{93}]"Microsoft-Windows-Printer-Drivers-Package~31bf3856ad364e35~amd64~~6.1.7601.17514.INF_prnbr006"
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002f9 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:36{18}]"Amd64\hpc4600t.vdf" of prnhp005.inf, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type = [l:24{12}]"driverUpdate", TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002fa [SR] This component was referenced by [l:186{93}]"Microsoft-Windows-Printer-Drivers-Package~31bf3856ad364e35~amd64~~6.1.7601.17514.INF_prnhp005"
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002fb [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:20{10}]"aeevts.dll" of Microsoft-Windows-Application-Experience-Common-Logger, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_INTEL (0), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002fc [SR] This component was referenced by [l:202{101}]"Microsoft-Windows-Foundation-Package~31bf3856ad364e35~amd64~~6.1.7601.17514.WindowsFoundationDelivery"
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002fd [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:76{38}]"Rights-Management-Client-v1-API-DL.man" of Microsoft-Windows-Migration-DownlevelManifests, Version = 6.1.7601.17514, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:12, Info                  CSI    000002fe [SR] This component was referenced by [l:242{121}]"Microsoft-Windows-Client-Features-Package~31bf3856ad364e35~amd64~~6.1.7601.17514.Microsoft-Windows-Client-Features-Update"
2012-05-29 17:32:13, Info                  CSI    000002ff [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:50{25}]"VaultCredProvider.dll.mui" of Microsoft-Windows-Security-Vault.Resources, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_AMD64 (9), Culture = [l:10{5}]"pl-PL", VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:13, Info                  CSI    00000300 [SR] This component was referenced by [l:266{133}]"Microsoft-Windows-WindowsFoundation-LanguagePack-Package~31bf3856ad364e35~amd64~pl-PL~6.1.7601.17514.Windows Foundation Language Pack"
2012-05-29 17:32:13, Info                  CSI    00000301 [SR] Cannot repair member file [l:16{8}]"WMIC.exe" of Microsoft-Windows-WMI-Command-Line-Utility, Version = 6.1.7600.16385, pA = PROCESSOR_ARCHITECTURE_INTEL (0), Culture neutral, VersionScope = 1 nonSxS, PublicKeyToken = {l:8 b:31bf3856ad364e35}, Type neutral, TypeName neutral, PublicKey neutral in the store, file is missing
2012-05-29 17:32:13, Info                  CSI    00000302 [SR] This component was referenced by [l:202{101}]"Microsoft-Windows-Foundation-Package~31bf3856ad364e35~amd64~~6.1.7601.17514.WindowsFoundationDelivery"
2012-05-29 17:32:13, Info                  CSI    00000303 Repair results created:
Can you make anything out of it? I googled for some names, but apart from WMIC.exe I couldn't find much info... explorer.exe file is listed many times and at least with 2 different spellings - is it normal?

edit: I found this How to use the System File Checker tool to troubleshoot missing or corrupted system files on Windows Vista or on Windows 7 should I try it? could it be that my Win install DVD is corrupt and so are the files, which in consequence causes all the mess I've been experiencing with my pc? if so, is it possible to check the integrity of the DVD to confirm or rule out that it's the culprit?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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