Full, Upgrade, Retail or OEM

OEM / Retail

I believe OEM versions are distributed to resellers ... as in machine builders and retail versions are distributed to real people. That being the case, I think we can all count on getting retail versions. I would sure hope so!

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This is not quite true is it....? I have bought all my OEM versions of XP from on-line retailers!!

kevvyb said:

This is not quite true is it....? I have bought all my OEM versions of XP from on-line retailers!!

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Might not be true - that's why I said "I believe"....

And yup - me to. Places like viosoftware.com, newegg.com, etc. These are all retailers... true in that they are retailing (selling to you). But, they are also (and more correctly) resellers.

No worries though. I would love for someone who knows more about all this to step in and provide some real, solid knowledge to the question.

another forum said:

The US pre-order offer is an upgrade which, by implication, is restricted to one machine. The E version (for us) is a clean install but it requires a qualifying operating system (XP or Vista) to be currently installed. So, like the US version, it is tied to one machine and to me that means OEM.

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Does this person know what he is talking about? Sounds like he does but I think, if I am understanding correctly, this contradicts what I thought and what has been said here.

Actually you can CLEAN install with a "UPGRADE" version.
The upgrade version is also CHEAPER. You can also buy OEM from almost any computer online RETAIL store.
so you have the option of any version,
1. OEM = FULL bought from Store= you get no support,
2. RETAIL = Ful l= cost more and you get SUPPORT,(read the warranty very close.)
3. OEM from store bought with computer = you get company support from the Computer manufacture.
4. Upgrade is cheapest version of FULL = No support = is fully operational, with option (a.) upgrade or (b.) clean install.

Actually the UPGRADE or OEM w/o support are the BEST Buys... You will get better support from a Online Forum than you will from some STORE.

Thanks. Had not realized the distinction between retailer and reseller was virtually non-existant.

Let's hope that when these actually become available one of these 'resellers' or retailers will actually know themselves what they are selling before I have to make a decision to purchase or not!

from another forum said:

According to the Microsoft UK store the pre-order version will be a full retail version - I called them. Btw, the number is 00800 2727 0909, choose option 4. Opening times are 9am-6pm, Mon-Fri & Sat 9am-1pm (I think).

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I think I'll give them a call as well just to see I get the same answer.

Snuffy said:

Actually you can CLEAN install with a "UPGRADE" version.
The upgrade version is also CHEAPER. You can also buy OEM from almost any computer online RETAIL store.
so you have the option of any version,
1. OEM = FULL bought from Store= you get no support,
2. RETAIL = Ful l= cost more and you get SUPPORT,(read the warranty very close.)
3. OEM from store bought with computer = you get company support from the Computer manufacture.
4. Upgrade is cheapest version of FULL = No support = is fully operational, with option (a.) upgrade or (b.) clean install.

Actually the UPGRADE or OEM w/o support are the BEST Buys... You will get better support from a Online Forum than you will from some STORE.

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Thanks a lot. Can I ask one other question? How many times can you re install with the upgrade?

I had a problem one time and I had to do a system recovery. Well the disks I created for system recovery malfunctioned and I had to call hp and have them send me hp recovery disks because I bought my computer with Vista installed. If you can not re install from the upgrade, I am worried that it's possible that the system recovery discs may malfunction again.

Separate question.

Would the HP system recovery disc that I have work in the upgrade process?

Okay I called Microsoft about this. You can re install as many times as you want, but it's only good for one pc.

One PC at a time is my understanding. So you can install on one PC, then if you decide you want it on another PC, you just remove it from or install something else on the old PC and reinstall your upgrade version of 7 on the new PC. I think you can move it to as many different PC's as you want, as long as it is only activated on one PC at a time. I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong about this.

OEM = May be cheaper. But there are reasons for that. No Support. One License tied to One PC. That PC dies, the license dies with it. Can not be transferred (legally) to any other system.

Also, it is mostly tied to the Motherboard anymore. Doing numerous upgrades are ok, may have to call to reactivate (see below).

Retail = Can be installed/Activated on one PC at a time. If that PC dies, you go buy/build a new one. You do not have to purchase the OS again. you already have it. You may have to call MS to get activated again, but it will not be any problem to do so. You get MS Support.

With that said. I have been refused to reactivate an OEM copy before, even though I never told them I moved it to a different machine. They flat out refused, several calls.
I have also had them reactivate OEM copies on new systems without any questions at all. It depends on who you get on the phone, and weather the license gets flagged (blacklisted).

The Answers when activating are.... at all times, weather a new install or not
usually gets you less hassles. This may have changed though since it has been a while since the last time I did numerous daily activations.

Hard Drive Replacement due to failure

Only this one

They may start asking for Serials, Model, Manufacturer of the PC. This can break the deal under certain circumstances. Generally, try to go with the whole (Self Built scenario). Good Luck.

Clean Install is always the best.

You can purchase OEM licensed OS as a system builder.
Generally they are not meant for the general public, but it is a gray area.

While the Upgrade Clean Install trick if you have no previous Windows to authenticate the upgrade install is neither confirmed or denied at this time with 7. It will probably work. But I would wait till it is confirmed before relying on that as an option.

I did not read all the posts but it did not make sense to me to buy a 7 upgrade license without having a previous valid xp/vista disc and key, even if the installation is possible. There is no real advantage to buy a 7 licence exept to be legal and to encourage Microsoft. I mean, if you don't want to buy the licence you really need, use any torrent site and download it free instead.

pominator said:

I did not read all the posts but it did not make sense to me to buy a 7 upgrade license without having a previous valid xp/vista disc and key, even if the installation is possible. There is no real advantage to buy a 7 licence exept to be legal and to encourage Microsoft. I mean, if you don't want to buy the licence you really need, use any torrent site and download it free instead.

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Its about supporting them for deveoplping the product...Microsoft may be one of the wealthiest companines in the world but they have every day people like you and me who work to get money for their families. You taking Windows 7 for free is taking part of their paycheck. Would you like for someone to take your paycheck? If you like the product buy it...to support it

Tepid said:

While the Upgrade Clean Install trick if you have no previous Windows to authenticate the upgrade install is neither confirmed or denied at this time with 7. It will probably work. But I would wait till it is confirmed before relying on that as an option.

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Why would this not still be available, the options has been available on ever peice of software that I can remember of. from Win 3 upto and including Vista. Why would they remove it now.

bigcitycat said:

Would the HP system recovery disc that I have work in the upgrade process?

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Yes, but you would not need your recovery disk to upgrade. The win7 upgrade disk will clean install. If you want all the programs from the HP RD, then you can move from or install first then upgrade. (My Acer RDs), allows me to copy and install from the disk what part I want, I do not have to total install from.

Mostly remember the Version OEM, UPGRADE or RETAIL depends on where you buy if you get SUPPORT or NO Support.
OEM means manufacture adds there stuff to the original retail version.
(This version has Trial stuff added if from Manufacture plus drivers for there devices)
Retail allows you to Clean install or upgrade with. (This cost more $)
Upgrade allows you to Upgrade or Clean install with.(This cost less $)

v8ornot2v8 said:

Thanks for the info - that's great to know. I don't have my initial disk for VIsta. Thanks!

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I don't believe you have to have the disk, the product key will do. Download Belarc Advisor or some other tool and extract and save your current product key.

P.S. I save recycled PC product keys for this reason. You never know when one might come in handy....

pominator said:

I did not read all the posts but it did not make sense to me to buy a 7 upgrade license without having a previous valid xp/vista disc and key, even if the installation is possible. There is no real advantage to buy a 7 licence exept to be legal and to encourage Microsoft. I mean, if you don't want to buy the licence you really need, use any torrent site and download it free instead.

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a) Downloaded torrents are OFTEN (NOT ALWAYS!) hacked copies that are infected with spyware. Be careful there Typhoid Mary.

b) An illegal copy may not pass the Windows Authentication test and will not be elligible for optional downloads/upgrades. (MS has wavered on the issue of security updates in order to control viruses and spyware - see point A above, not sure where they stand now).

c) $$$ for legal copy versus time spent jumping through hoops keeping an illegal copy running and updated/upgraded.

Your call. There will always be pirated copies available. How much is your time worth? $120 for a legal Home Premium Upgrade license, IMO is not a bad deal. It is not free, but it is not bad....

P.S. Also many users will do the traditional "wait for SP1 before upgrading" tactic. At which point the Upgrade Licenses may be on sale at lower prices.

Muad Dib said:

a) Downloaded torrents are OFTEN (NOT ALWAYS!) hacked copies that are infected with spyware. Be careful there Typhoid Mary.(Not always but it is possible.)

b) An illegal copy may not pass the Windows Authentication test and will not be elligible for optional downloads/upgrades. (MS has wavered on the issue of security updates in order to control viruses and spyware - see point A above, not sure where they stand now) .(The illegal copies usualy have WPA bypassed and usually upgrade but not always)

c) $$$ for legal copy versus time spent jumping through hoops keeping an illegal copy running and updated/upgraded. (This part is always TRUE.)

Your call. There will always be pirated copies available. How much is your time worth? $120 for a legal Home Premium Upgrade license, IMO is not a bad deal. It is not free, but it is not bad.... ($49.00 is better and if the License was for 3X.) still better.

P.S. Also many users will do the traditional "wait for SP1 before upgrading" tactic. At which point the Upgrade Licenses may be on sale at lower prices.

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(This to me is a myth. Reason: SP1 & SP2 on Vista made things worse, IMHO)(OS's are like cars, they always say: I want that but its new, wait until it tried and tested.)(Chevy-GM is responsible for that)

IBM said no to the first mouse, ATT said not that Video phones, Germany had Flying sausers n WWII, not aliens. Salesmen sell you what they think you want, by convincing you that is what you want.

Zidane2424 said:

Its about supporting them for deveoplping the product...Microsoft may be one of the wealthiest companines in the world but they have every day people like you and me who work to get money for their families. You taking Windows 7 for free is taking part of their paycheck. Would you like for someone to take your paycheck? If you like the product buy it...to support it

Click to expand...

a) Downloaded torrents are OFTEN (NOT ALWAYS!) hacked copies that are infected with spyware. Be careful there Typhoid Mary.

b) An illegal copy may not pass the Windows Authentication test and will not be elligible for optional downloads/upgrades. (MS has wavered on the issue of security updates in order to control viruses and spyware - see point A above, not sure where they stand now).

c) $$$ for legal copy versus time spent jumping through hoops keeping an illegal copy running and updated/upgraded.

Your call. There will always be pirated copies available. How much is your time worth? $120 for a legal Home Premium Upgrade license, IMO is not a bad deal. It is not free, but it is not bad....

P.S. Also many users will do the traditional "wait for SP1 before upgrading" tactic. At which point the Upgrade Licenses may be on sale at lower prices.

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I think i've been misunderstand or I have misunderstand some of the initial posts. grouchpunk08 was explaining how to install a Windows 7 upgrade without having a prior XP or Vista license. It's not fully legal as far as I know. That's why I tell that it would be better then to take an complete illegal copy, if the person don't want to aquire the license it really need to. What's the point to be semi-legal? In other words, their is many fully working and trustable copy on torrent site, so if you don't want to pay the license you need to, just don't buy it at all. It's kind of weird to me to buy a upgrade license and then to "hack it". I did not tell this to encourage people to pirate things at all, I will buy a license to support Microsoft myself.

Snuffy said:

(This to me is a myth. Reason: SP1 & SP2 on Vista made things worse, IMHO)(OS's are like cars, they always say: I want that but its new, wait until it tried and tested.)(Chevy-GM is responsible for that)

IBM said no to the first mouse, ATT said not that Video phones, Germany had Flying sausers n WWII, not aliens. Salesmen sell you what they think you want, by convincing you that is what you want.

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Note: I never said the "wait for SP1" was rational, I just said it was a common tactic. Especially in business. And there are many who disagree with you regarding Vista SP1 and SP2 making things worse, Especially SP2!

Personal Opinons. I think Vista SP2 is far worse than SP1. infact i use a lesser version of SP2 than (18005) final.

Bizarre conversation with MS UK Store

Great.

MS rep themselves told me this pre-order version was 'full retail' then in next breath told me it was 'upgrade' and did not seem to appreciate the contradiction.

Then I asked if I needed to have a valid qualifying operating system already installed to install it. Was told yes. Vista or XP. Merely a valid key will not do. I am assuming that because I called the UK store that they were giving me answers relevant to the E version but who knows.

They did give me the mantra about the 'clean install'.

I was also told that if I wish to reinstall that I would have to reinstall the old o/s first each time.

Did not even get into the fact that I have an OEM version of XP and if that would count as qualifying to install this pre-order Win7 E.

Also did not get into question of whether I could install on new hardware if I should need to in the future.

Figured these questions would be way too hard if they cannot answer the first. And would I now believe anything they say anyway?

Rep referred me to the website address (which I was already looking at) and said that all the details were there. Clear answers to my questions are not there on that site as far as I can see.

BEWARE Other people have had different answers from MS Store UK. MS cannot unambiguously tell you what they are selling you!

If anyone works it out definitively would be very interested but if MC cannot tell us, who can?

Maybe I'll stick with XP awhile more. Well done MS!