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Windows 7: folder properties says 2.67Gb, *.* properties says 6.41Gb

19 Aug 2016   #1
eglovesasailor

Windows 7 Home Premium on 2 PCs, one 64 bit, one 32 bit
 
 
folder properties says 2.67Gb, *.* properties says 6.41Gb

Hi;

I have a folder of home videos that I back up to a USB key with Syncback. The key is nearly full and I'm trying to reduce the size of that folder. But here's the thing; If I right-click on my 'Home videos' folder and select 'Properties', it tells me I have 564 files in 85 folders, taking 2.67Gb.

However, if I open the folder and search for *.* to show all the files, then select all, right-click, 'Properties', it tells me I have 2224 files in 249 folders taking 6.41Gb. Still, at the bottom of the Windows Explorer window it says 649 items selected.

This is the case on both the folder in My Documents on the PC and also the matching folder on the USB key.

Treesize also shows 2.67Gb for both folders.

In fact as far as I can figure, what with everything else on the same USB key, there wouldn't even be room for a 6Gb folder.

I've tried showing both hidden and system files and folders but there's nothing extra to see.

Can anyone please explain this anomaly? I must be doing something wrong but I can't figure it out!


My System SpecsSystem Spec
.
19 Aug 2016   #2
Eric3742

Windows 7 x64
 
 

Let say, there is txt file and it say is file and have text "1 2 3" work in the text file exclude the ".

On the desktop, right click to select "New" and select Text Document.
Name the file.
Open the file and type in this, exclude "; "1 2 3" and save close the file.

Select the saved file and right click select Properties.

Look at the properties, it mentioned that there the file size occupy 5 bytes.
Meaning there are 5 characters, count include space.

Next, look at;
Size on disk = 4.00 KB (4,096 bytes)

So, for a file with up to 4,096 bytes, it occupy 4.00 KB
This means no matter whatever the size of the file (content) which is up to 4,096 bytes. it use 1 block of 4 KB size.
If the file use 4,097 bytes, it will occupy 2 block of 4 KB = 8 KB.

It is those small files size that occupy 1 block of 4 KB.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Aug 2016   #3
eglovesasailor

Windows 7 Home Premium on 2 PCs, one 64 bit, one 32 bit
 
 

Hi, and thanks for your reply!

Are you saying that my 2.6Gb of files are actually taking up 6.4Gb of disk space? That, for example, my 40Mb home movie is taking up 100Mb of disk space?

I can see how the extra unfilled blocks can make a difference to small files, but I don't see how this applies to large video files. In all the video file properties I've looked at, 'Size:' and 'Size on disk:' are mostly the same. Certainly not a 150% difference.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
.

20 Aug 2016   #4
Eric3742

Windows 7 x64
 
 

In the HDD, divided each block with up to 4KB or 4096 bytes, this is for NTFS system.
Hence, the big file may only have 1 block not fully utilize, that's all
To calculate the actual size divide by 4096 bytes, as this is 4KB per block.

This is NTFS is 4KB and it is different from FAT32 and FAT16

It is not 2.6GB of files taking 6.4GB disk space.

It is the actual number of files which total is 2.6GB

This is much very different, as you are seeing the other way.

If there is 2224 files in total is 2.6GB size.

But out of the 2224 files, there are 1000 files which the actual size is 80 bytes.

1000 files x 4 K per block = 4000 KB of size on disk.

But if each files is about 80 bytes size, then the actual size is 80 x 1000 = 80,000 bytes actual occupy.

It actual occupy on 80,000 / 1024 = 78.125 KB.

Result: 1000 files size is 78 KB
Size on disk is 4,000 KB

The other 1224 files do not occupy much.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
20 Aug 2016   #5
eglovesasailor

Windows 7 Home Premium on 2 PCs, one 64 bit, one 32 bit
 
 

Hi;

you seem to be explaining to me how a file can be up to 4kb larger that it appears.

You are saying that 1000 x 80 byte files will occupy 4 Mb. Well sure, but these are not 80 byte files. they are 40 Mb video files, some of them. An extra half-empty block on the end of each one surely doesn't explain an extra 4Gb on a 2 1/2 Gb folder. Or am I missing something?

Also none of this explains why it tells me I have 2224 files in 249 folders when actually I have 564 files in 85 folders. Where are these other files and folders? I can't find them.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
20 Aug 2016   #6
Eric3742

Windows 7 x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by eglovesasailor View Post
Hi;

I have a folder of home videos that I back up to a USB key with Syncback. The key is nearly full and I'm trying to reduce the size of that folder. But here's the thing; If I right-click on my 'Home videos' folder and select 'Properties', it tells me I have 564 files in 85 folders, taking 2.67Gb.

However, if I open the folder and search for *.* to show all the files, then select all, right-click, 'Properties', it tells me I have 2224 files in 249 folders taking 6.41Gb. Still, at the bottom of the Windows Explorer window it says 649 items selected.

This is the case on both the folder in My Documents on the PC and also the matching folder on the USB key.

Treesize also shows 2.67Gb for both folders.

In fact as far as I can figure, what with everything else on the same USB key, there wouldn't even be room for a 6Gb folder.

I've tried showing both hidden and system files and folders but there's nothing extra to see.

Can anyone please explain this anomaly? I must be doing something wrong but I can't figure it out!
Taking part by part.

Using this "folder and search for *.* to show all the files"

Result: "649 items selected"
This means that you have selected 649 items on this particular folder.

*.* to show all the files, then select all, right-click, 'Properties', it tells me I have 2224 files in 249 folders taking 6.41Gb

This means everything, that is; files on this current folder + Sub Folders & files, + more sub folders & files, etc.

In TOTAL All meaning there are 2224 files;
and also there are 249 folders.

What the Properties say is that EVERY things inside this current folders.

Some folders may have 10 files, other folders may have a number of files.
There are in total 249 folders that contain 2224 files.

Inside the folder there may have some folders, and files include all folders and sub folders.

Then out of the 2224 files, i use 1000 files as an example.

Properties usual mean everything from the point you selected.
Hence for 649 items selected, it can be files and folders and sub folders, etc.

Take a good look at each individual folders including any sub folder plus other sub folders.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
20 Aug 2016   #7
eglovesasailor

Windows 7 Home Premium on 2 PCs, one 64 bit, one 32 bit
 
 

My Home videos folder contains 50 items. 7 folders and 43 files. Of course, as you say, the folders contain sub-folders.

*.* shows ALL the folders and sub-folders and all the files they contain. That's exactly what it does, isn't it?

Now I see 636 items including 83 folders and sub-folders, and 553 files. This agrees with when I right-click on the Home videos folder itself and select properties.

So it seems to me that in my Home videos folder I have 553 files and 83 folders, including all sub-folders and their contents. Properties of Home videos folder tells me this, *.* also tells me this.

Do you agree with me so far?

The unexpected information (that I have 2224 files in 249 folders taking 6.41Gb of space) comes when I select ALL 639 items in that (*.*) window, right-click and select properties.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
21 Aug 2016   #8
Eric3742

Windows 7 x64
 
 

To make it simple.

Open Windows explorer at root directory.
On the left panel, select the C: (drive) and then Select "Program Files"
Once you are in "Program Files" you will see all the programs.

Next, just select any folder and follow by Ctrl A (control-A is to select all folders & files on current folder selected).

On the bottom, you will see 29 items (in my case) as yours may be more or less depend on what is installed.
Click anywhere outside the right panel (none highlighted), and then Count one by one, and include any hidden files & folders.
So, the number of all the items tally with the bottom figures exactly, right.
What you select will be indicated below of the explorer.


Next; Properties.

Do Ctrl-A to select all the files and folders on this "Program Files" folder.
Right click and select Properties.

As you can see, the number of items do not tally with the Properties info, as files and folders counted separately.

Properties do include ALL items (files & folders) on current folders AND include all sub-folders & files.
This mean the COUNT, is Total of all items from the point you selected the current folder files AND all sub-folders items.

-----1st post----------
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by eglovesasailor View Post
Hi;

I have a folder of home videos that I back up to a USB key with Syncback. The key is nearly full and I'm trying to reduce the size of that folder. But here's the thing; If I right-click on my 'Home videos' folder and select 'Properties', it tells me I have 564 files in 85 folders, taking 2.67Gb.

However, if I open the folder and search for *.* to show all the files, then select all, right-click, 'Properties', it tells me I have 2224 files in 249 folders taking 6.41Gb. Still, at the bottom of the Windows Explorer window it says 649 items selected.
Your 1st para indicated 564 files in 85 folders.

Then your 2nd para indicated 649 items selected.

So, 564 files + 85 folders = 649 items. As items meaning both files and folders included.

Properties will indicated actual number of files and folders separately.

Using Properties to select files and folders, it included ALL as using *.*
For 2224 files in 249 folders taking 6.41 GB.


Properties:
Top section indicated the number of files and folder separately.
Hence it indicated that there are 2224 files and 249 folders.

Size: This is refer to actual size of 2224 files together.
Hence it is 2.67 GB.

Size on disk 6.41 GB
But actual space it occupy on the HDD.

In conclusion, out of 2224 files, there are many files with a few bytes.
Your HDD do have a lot of small files.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
21 Aug 2016   #9
TechnoMage2016

Windows 7 Ultimate, SP1, x86
 
 

Little knows fact:

There are two ways that a folder's size may be expressed:

One is the actual bit count of the files contained therein.
Two is the space it takes up on the hard drive. (which will be greater)

The two are not the same. So don't get all hung up on the numbers.
After all, they are only numbers!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
21 Aug 2016   #10
eglovesasailor

Windows 7 Home Premium on 2 PCs, one 64 bit, one 32 bit
 
 

Eric3742:

Thanks for your valiant efforts mate. Unfortunately you seem to be answering some question that I am not aware of, while at the same time not answering mine.

I appreciate your time and certainly don't want to use up any more of it, so I suggest we leave it there, as I don't think you have really understood my question, and I certainly don't see the relevance of your answers so far.

TechnoMage2016:

I believe you are talking about 'Size:' and 'Size on disk:'. Correct? Hardly a little known fact, as it's right there every time you check a file's properties. But thanks for your input. I shall take care not to get 'hung up on the numbers', whatever that means. You're right I'm sure, they are only numbers. One is pretty much the same as the next, right?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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 folder properties says 2.67Gb, *.* properties says 6.41Gb




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