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Windows 7: PC will Cold Boot but won't Warm boot?


13 Oct 2013   #1

Windows 7 Ultimate x64
 
 
PC will Cold Boot but won't Warm boot?

Hello,
Last week 2 memory slots in my PC quite working. While trying to determine if it was the RAM or the slots (suppose memory controller is more correct) I Cleared CMOS, swapped memory modules & right about then the PC quite restarting. Click on restart & windows shuts down, monitor goes blank but the PSU never powers off. Before I would hear the PSU power cycle just before the PC restarted. At least I think it was the PSU, a mechanical restart with a fan. There's only one case FAN & the heatsink fan, but I don't think that's it. I suppose it could be the case fan.

It does however shutdown just fine. Click shutdown & Windows shuts down & powers the PC (PSU) off.

Since the memory slots were toast I purchased a new MB, that did correct the memory issue - all RAM is now accounted for in Windows. However the restart condition persists. I updated the BIOS, cleared CMOS again & removed/replaced the battery. I made triple sure that all connections are secure.

Power scheme is set to balanced & I have never enabled hibernation on this PC.
In the BIOS Remote Wakeup & Auto Power On are disabled. ACPI mode is S3 & AC recovery is OFF.


A little research on Shutdown vs. Restart indicates a Shutdown results in a Cold Boot whereas a Restart results in a Warm Boot:
For a shutdown and start the last thing is turning off power to the system board. When the system is turned on the CPU boots and passes control to the bios. For a restart the last thing is issuing a warm boot command to the CPU. The CPU then passes control to the bios.
Shutting down (cold boot) cuts the power to memory, which would clear things like RAM and such. It also cuts power to the peripheral devices, whereas restarting "may or may not" completely do this. When you restart your PC, the hard drive does not stop spinning. You must remove power completely from a computer to make everything truly clear.


It sounds to me like during a restart the command telling the PSU to restart is not getting there. During a shutdown the command to the PSU telling it to power off is getting there.

I'm not even sure what to look at. I suppose the PSU could be the culprit but something in the BIOS seems more likely.

thanks for any help

My System SpecsSystem Spec
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13 Oct 2013   #2

Desk1 8 Pro / Desk2 7 Home Prem / Laptop 8.1 Pro all 64bit
 
 

Mate try this I think you have a PSU issue.
PSU- Jump Start

for a reference
PowerSupply 101: A Reference Of Specifications - Power Supplies as you will seethere is a +/- 5% variance that can make all the difference so 11.4v is way toolow and 12.6v way too high.

Plus remember correct bolts do not mean correct current (amps - in turn watts)


Now while you are reading the second ref in section 2 there is a Power_Good text now if you do not get any or very low volts at pin 8 (grey cable) then there is something wrong with the PSU because that lead tells the timer chip to start the machine if and only if the self test in the PSU comes up good.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
13 Oct 2013   #3

Windows 7 Ultimate x64
 
 

Thank you my friend from down under. Have relatives visiting your fine continent right now.

I will give that a try tomorrow. Looks a bit much to start this late in the evening.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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13 Oct 2013   #4

Desk1 8 Pro / Desk2 7 Home Prem / Laptop 8.1 Pro all 64bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by newpgm View Post
Thank you my friend from down under. Have relatives visiting your fine continent right now.

I will give that a try tomorrow. Looks a bit much to start this late in the evening.
Thats nice they will really appreciate how laid back it is here - depending on where they go of course.

Now the PSU mate do not try messing with the PSU itself just test the leads and again correct volts doesn't mean correct current. Think of a car with a near flat battery it will show up a nice 12 or slightly more volts but not have enough charge to crank the engine an supply enough current for the ignition.

Plus Scott Mueller (he wrote that text) has always said that PSU's are a major source of problem that folks often overlook.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Oct 2013   #5

Windows 7 Ultimate x64
 
 

I am at a loss

Since I was planning on upgrading the PSU at some point went over to Microcenter & picked up a Corsair CX500 Builder series & wow is that thing noisy. Something definitely wrong with it. But this did not help with the restart issue.

Have mucked about much in the BIOS trying to luck upon something that may be at fault & found one thing -
in the Boot Device Configuration menu it says "A device enclosed in parenthesis has been disabled in the corresponding type menu". Not sure what that means but they are all enclosed in parenthesis: 1st boot device = SATA, 2nd boot device = CD/DVD & 3rd boot device = Removable Device. At the bottom Boot Other Device also in parenthesis. I cannot remove the parenthesis surrounding these Boot Devices?

Perhaps I should mention too, because I was embarrassed initially to admit this, it's possible the reason the two memory slots quite working last week is because while spraying out the case with a brand new can of Dust Off a large blast of wet stuff came out. Thought maybe that is what damaged the MB in the first place. Is it possible my RAM may be damaged too, although all of it is now recognized?

It does however successfully restart when I Save & Quite the BIOS. F10 to save changes & exit BIOS then the PSU power cycles & the PC immediately restarts. Why won't it do this when I restart the PC. I have to hold the power button down for 10 seconds every time. & each time it starts back up just fine, no message about Windows failed to shutdown properly.

thanks for any assist
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Oct 2013   #6

Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
 
 

Just a few questions to help us determine what exactly happened.

1. Did your issue start after you sprayed liquid on your Motherboard?
2. After you replaced the Motherboard, did you use the old RAM sticks?
3. Did you replace the Motherboard, with the same exact brand and type?
4. What brand, model of Motherboard is installed?

If the new PS is too loud, exchange it.

This brand of compressed air you used, is it recommend for use on circuit boards?

John
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Oct 2013   #7

Windows 7 Ultimate x64
 
 

Hi johnsmith45jock & thanks for responding,

Yes the problem began after spraying liquid. The first problem was 4GB RAM was missing, I determined by swapping modules in/out & around that Slots 2 & 5 were not functioning. The PC was not restarting @ that time either.

Then replaced the motherboard with the same exact model = Dell 0R849J & used the old RAM sticks. Windows now recognizes all 12GB RAM & I was hoping that would fix the restart issue too, but sadly did not.

I can find nothing in the BIOS (altho I'm fairly new to PC fixin) that would keep it from restarting, except as I mentioned before regarding the Boot Device Configuration menu "A device enclosed in parenthesis has been disabled in the corresponding type menu". Was going to do some searching tonight & try to figure out what that means & why I cannot remove the parenthesis. Altho they're really brackets & not parenthesis.

Returned the Corsair CX500 PSU. Might as well stick with the stock Dell PSU since it's not at fault.

The compressed air is brand name Dust Off Professional 12oz Electronics compressed gas Duster. I have used this brand many times to blow out the case & was holding the can upright. Perhaps in the future I will point the initial blast somewhere other than in the case. Actually little afraid to use it again. I did not occur to me until the following day that the compressed air might be at fault because one would assume the makers of the Dust Off would not put something in there that would damage electronics. Especially since it says Electronics compressed gas right on the can.

Slots 5 & 2 are right in the middle but the spray hit the RAM residing in Slots 4 & 1. You'd think Slots 4 & 1 would be dead. When I first posted about this on Tom's Hardware it was suggested that I had killed the memory controller. So I purchased a MB. This is Tri-Channel RAM. I just ordered 3 sticks of Corsair XMS3 6GB (3x2GB) DDR3 1333 MHz hoping the RAM might be the problem. This machine doesn't support 1333MHz but Guess it won't hurt to let it down clock to 1066MHz.
This pic is front to back so I was sitting behind or spraying from the back side.



thanks for the help


Edit: Decided I probably do need a 500W PSU. Have a Sapphire HD 7790 Dual-X GPU which indicates 500W minimum & the Dell PSU is rated 360W. However the Sapphire 7790 uses 85W whereas the ATI Radeon 4850 that was initially in there used 110W. That's why I thought the 360W PSU would be fine.

Will give Corsair another shot on the PSU, my understanding is they make good products.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Oct 2013   #8

Desk1 8 Pro / Desk2 7 Home Prem / Laptop 8.1 Pro all 64bit
 
 

First the wet stuff was probably the propellant or the compressed air turning back into liquid form as the nozzle is kept open too long the low temp will do that it has to be done in quick bursts which to me defeats the purpose unless it is in very unaccessible spots.
Now a lot of folks say vacuuming is bad but to be honest I have never had a problem with it if you think about it it is only dragging air and therefore dust across the surface - just in different directions. My method is to fit a bare copper wire down the outside of the vacuum tube to pick up any static produced this is attached to your wrist band etc etc



You probably need to do a memtest now try this

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/105647-ram-test-memtest86.htmlthisone you will need to make a bootable disk set the BIOS to optical (or USB ifpreferred) boot the machine and let it run for at LEAST 8 passes unless theerrors come up straight away. Takes fair time to complete and some leave itrunning overnight.
Before you do that do this

Now as for the slots to clean them use astrip of old credit card about 1/2 inch wide nip the corners off one end - preferably round them offhold apiece of thin lint free cloth over the end dab on some form of alcohol - isopropyl alcohol (what we swab the skin with before an injection) is good and GENTLY swipe along the slots.

This can also be done for the GPU slot/s.


Attached Images
 
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Oct 2013   #9

Windows 7 Ultimate x64
 
 

Came across that memtest last week but went with the Dell Diagnostic (F12) memory test, only allowed it to run for an about hour tho. Figured that was probably good. Sounds like I didn't let it go long enuff.

The PC is apart right now, PSU removed & I just happen to have picked up some 90% Isopropyl Alcohol last week to clean the RAM with. Will use your credit card trick on the slots & run memtest86 when reassembled.

Edit: since this is a new MOBO, think I'll forgo the slot cleaning.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Oct 2013   #10

Windows 7 Pro. 64/SP-1
 
 

Because of this title and the fact that you have changed so much hardware.
If I'm getting in the way just run me off.

PC will Cold Boot but won't Warm boot?

This means to me temperature is causing expansion of something.
Does you motherboard have on board video? If it does try running your computer without a video card.
Normally temps of the power supply cause this problem but I believe you have replaced the power supply.
What power supply are you using at this time.
Any thing that expands with excess heat can cause a power to power or a power to ground short can cause this problem.

To me cold boot means the computer is completely off and has rested long enough to come down to room temps.
Warm boot is the computer is properly turned off but is still warm from previous running and then booted again.

Are we on the same page with the boot thing?

If you run your computer until it reaches normal running temps will it do a reboot with or with out problems?
The reason I ask because most computers on reboot do not shut down the fans and power supply. I just jumps to the bios and reboots the operating system.
With a cold boot you are using the power button on the tower and on a reboot you are not. Therefor a simple power button or its connections on the tower can cause this problem.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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 PC will Cold Boot but won't Warm boot?




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