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Windows 7: Random Shutdown No BSOD Strange HWMonitor temperatures

09 Aug 2014   #1
BBall

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
 
 
Random Shutdown No BSOD Strange HWMonitor temperatures

Need Opinions and some assistance. I"ve been having shutdowns for quite some time and I decided to take a different route with my troubles. I'm uploading a screen shot of the HWMonitor information. As you can see Things are quite peculiar in my world. Before I RMA anything else I would like to see if it's Possible to fix my troubles here at home without having to worry about the hardware itself. I already know I need a new CPU/heatsink fan as it's running 300 RPM below the advertised speed, it's been a while so I can't RMA it.




Attached Images
Random Shutdown No BSOD Strange HWMonitor temperatures-capture.png 
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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09 Aug 2014   #2
Mellon Head

Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
 
 

Those are high package temps. Is that screen shot with the computer at idle? Or are you running something CPU intensive in the background?

A couple of questions:

1. Is your CPU fan/heatsink clean and free of dust?
2. Have you checked your BIOS to make sure that the CPU fan speed isn't set to "Silent" mode, or some other low speed mode? My mobo BIOS defaults to a low speed for the CPU fan and I have to set it to run at a higher speed if I want any kind of temperature control.
3. What kind of airflow is in your case? Do you have any intake/exhaust fans. Are they working and clean? FANIN1 is not running very fast either. Mine typically run at 1200 - 1500 RPM. I have to set those in the BIOS as well.
4. What is the typical room temperature in the room where your computer is?
5. What is the model of your CPU cooler?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
09 Aug 2014   #3
BBall

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
 
 

The PC is running at Idle.with the Case side off. I just re Applied the Acrtic Clean and I even Went as far as purchasing the artic clean kit with the Prepping solution as well to make extra sure. I know it probaly wasn't needed but I things are getting a little crazy. The heatsink/Fan Combo is the Gemini II M4 the larger Older Model. I know the fan is suppose to be running up to 1900 on it but the fan will only reach about 1700 RPMS and I have the cooling in the BIOS set to aggressive.

I'm thinking I need a better cooling system a better fan or to re apply the grease again. I had see some people who spread the grease themselves with a credit card. But I'm afraid it woudl cause the grease to leak everywhere. (doesn't help that today my air conditioner is kaput. )

The case is a Roswell challenger from Newegg.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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09 Aug 2014   #4
Mellon Head

Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
 
 

The case is fine, but I think you need a better cooler. Maybe something like this:

Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO - CPU Cooler with 120 mm PWM Fan - Newegg.ca

or this:

Cooler Master Seidon 120V ? Compact All-In-One CPU Liquid Water Cooling System with 120mm Radiator and Fan - Newegg.ca

if you want to get a little more exotic.


It looks like your CPU is running so hot that almost any stress is sending it over the edge. I don't know if you need to reapply the thermal paste, unless there was a problem with the application, but here's a quick tutorial on how to do it, if that's any help to you:

How-To: Properly Apply Thermal Paste and Install a CPU | Maximum PC

Those A series chips can get warm. I don't recommend doing too much with that PC until you get a better cooling solution and can get those temps under control.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
09 Aug 2014   #5
BBall

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
 
 

Well I know the Gemini II was recommended over liquid coolers from Tom's Hardware. I ordered a better fan for it, I also turned off Power!NOW on the Motherboard Applied Grease using a card making sure the whole of the top was covered of the processor was covered with a thin film of grease. I have found the Gemeni to be a Big pain to Install, Where the screws push through the Motherboard and you have to screw it in from the Back which causes a bit of wiggle when installing. From what I understand about AMDs these days. They don't use a actual Temp measure anymore but some messed up mathematical equation at least that Is what I've heard from reading the Tom's Hardware Forums. Additionally looking at the 2. The only real difference is it's Built differently Both has 4 aluminum Pipes. So a Really Good fan Could Push the Gemini up to the Point of that Hyper212

I have also uploaded 2 HWINFO64 readings. So you can really see the baffling confusion. At this point I think it's a Trial and error movement.

Since applying the Grease and turning off Power!now I was about to get about 30 mins off of Borderlands 2 without it crashing and it didn't crash I simply stopped the game. So it could have been turning off PowerNOW! on the Motherboard or could have been applying the grease better to give a better heat transfer. The application of the Grease I was able to drop the package temp about 3 degrees while idling. Once the New fan gets here in a few days I will have to see.

And I have to apologize. the actual Cooler I have. http://www.coolermaster.com/cooling/.../geminii-s524/


Attached Images
Random Shutdown No BSOD Strange HWMonitor temperatures-capture2.png Random Shutdown No BSOD Strange HWMonitor temperatures-capture3.png 
My System SpecsSystem Spec
10 Aug 2014   #6
Mellon Head

Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
 
 

I see what you mean by baffling. The CPU temp reads one thing and the package temp is much much higher. Maybe we just have an out of whack sensor.

While we wait for your new fan, have you tested the RAM with something like Memtest86+? It's probably a good idea. At least it never hurts to test RAM now and again, and it might shed some light on the crashes.

Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool

Let it run overnight and see if any errors pop up.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
10 Aug 2014   #7
Layback Bear

Windows 7 Pro. 64/SP-1
 
 

Could you post a complete picture of HWmonitor?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
10 Aug 2014   #8
BBall

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Mellon Head View Post
I see what you mean by baffling. The CPU temp reads one thing and the package temp is much much higher. Maybe we just have an out of whack sensor.

While we wait for your new fan, have you tested the RAM with something like Memtest86+? It's probably a good idea. At least it never hurts to test RAM now and again, and it might shed some light on the crashes.

Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool

Let it run overnight and see if any errors pop up.
done it already. I Know it's not the ram. Let it run for 24 hours and nothing. Initially, I thought it was the Video card because the my GTX250 wouldn't cause a crash where as the GTX650 would. Recently after I was able to get it RMA'd the problems persisted..though the screen particles and artifacts went away. So that is when it hit me. The 650 uses more power then the 250 and may be causing more heat in the system which was pushing the system over, that with a Poor fan on the cooler, and a maybe needed better greasing.

Additionally, I've Learned there is such a different in the temps because AMD uses a mathmatical equation now instead of a actaul physical temp gauge. Kind of stupid I agree.

(argus monitor)" 1. the temperature sensor does not read real physical CPU temperature, so that there can be a rather large temperature difference between the measured and real CPU temperature -- especially if the CPU is idle. "

Also when it comes to AMD CPU's what is PowerrNOW! I was afraid of messing with it in the Bios, But seeing as there's no option for cool&Quiet in there. Powernow seems to have something to do with Processor based Power events. Afraid to put it under a full load with it off if it has something to do with processor heat. Though I never had my machine set to shut off when it overheats (recently set that in my bios) sooo Maybe it wasn't a heat issue? So confusing!

I will screenshot a larger HWMonitor when I get home from the ballpark in a few hours.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
10 Aug 2014   #9
matts6887

Windows 7 ultimate 64-bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by BBall View Post
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Mellon Head View Post
I see what you mean by baffling. The CPU temp reads one thing and the package temp is much much higher. Maybe we just have an out of whack sensor.

While we wait for your new fan, have you tested the RAM with something like Memtest86+? It's probably a good idea. At least it never hurts to test RAM now and again, and it might shed some light on the crashes.

Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool

Let it run overnight and see if any errors pop up.
done it already. I Know it's not the ram. Let it run for 24 hours and nothing. Initially, I thought it was the Video card because the my GTX250 wouldn't cause a crash where as the GTX650 would. Recently after I was able to get it RMA'd the problems persisted..though the screen particles and artifacts went away. So that is when it hit me. The 650 uses more power then the 250 and may be causing more heat in the system which was pushing the system over, that with a Poor fan on the cooler, and a maybe needed better greasing.

Additionally, I've Learned there is such a different in the temps because AMD uses a mathmatical equation now instead of a actaul physical temp gauge. Kind of stupid I agree.

(argus monitor)" 1. the temperature sensor does not read real physical CPU temperature, so that there can be a rather large temperature difference between the measured and real CPU temperature -- especially if the CPU is idle. "

Also when it comes to AMD CPU's what is PowerrNOW! I was afraid of messing with it in the Bios, But seeing as there's no option for cool&Quiet in there. Powernow seems to have something to do with Processor based Power events. Afraid to put it under a full load with it off if it has something to do with processor heat. Though I never had my machine set to shut off when it overheats (recently set that in my bios) sooo Maybe it wasn't a heat issue? So confusing!

I will screenshot a larger HWMonitor when I get home from the ballpark in a few hours.

Keep in mind; just because you let memtest run for 24 hours doesnt necessiairly mean there arent any issues. There could still be issues with one or more ram sticks as it can take several passes sometimes for memtest to detect any issues with the ram; Also; if you have not already done so; i would take the time to dust/clean out the inside of your case. And one more thing that comes to my mind is the thermal paste for the fan heatsinks can degrade over time; which is a issue i ended up having not too long ago; so its a good idea to make sure to check that every now and then as well. Just my .02 here.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
10 Aug 2014   #10
Mellon Head

Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
 
 

The OP has just installed new thermal paste so I don't think it's a degradation thing.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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