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Windows 7: Microsoft exec admits new reality: Market share no longer 90%, it's 14

21 Jul 2014   #61
ThrashZone

Win-7-Pro64bit 7-H-Prem-64bit
 
 

Not to revisit the issue but the price of the slates is far too much and that just my opinion,

The other bottom line is they are still too big to be anymore potable than a real laptop,
So it's still a shot in the dark as to what this device is really good for anything not cloud related,
Kicking everything to the cloud is not a good business strategy unless you business model is to sell subscriptions and storage to these services which is a double edged sword but I suppose to be optimistic you would have a 50-50 % succeed/ failure chance if your lucky

800.00 for a slate it will not take long to see if sales boost or flop


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21 Jul 2014   #62
lffoar

Windows 7 home premium 64bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Lady Fitzgerald View Post
Jimbo, your long post compares apples to kumquats, especially your African stall holder analogy. No one here is saying no to all new technology; what we take issue with is new technology that doesn't improve our lives or workflows or isn't cost effective. For the cost of one bare bones Surface 3, I can buy two notebooks that are more powerful, have more storage capacity, a larger screen, a real keyboard, more USB ports, far superior multitasking capability, etc. While heavier and more awkward to hold than a Surface, I, and many others, don't need to carry a computer around with us all the time. Those of us who do most likely will find a smart phone to be far more practical than a tablet. Smart phones can be easily held and used with one hand. Try that with a tablet. Smart phones will fit in a pocket or a purse (or even a bra). Try any of that with a tablet.

I'm not saying tablets don't have their uses in business; they do. But not to the extent you seem to believe. And they certainly will not replace desktops and laptops any time soon for anything other than simple tasks, such as checking email and social media sites and simple internet surfing (and smart phones can do that with far more portability).
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21 Jul 2014   #63
Lady Fitzgerald

Win 7 Ultimate 64 bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by ThrashZone View Post
...The other bottom line is they are still too big to be anymore potable than a real laptop...
It's like the Kindle e-book readers when they first came out; they were just too big with the overly wide bezel and that silly keyboard at the bottom that would get used occasionally. They were way too big to fit in my purse so I got a JetBook Lite instead. Amazon has since pared them down in size and price. I recently got one of the less expensive ones that cut the purchase price by using adds for the "screen saver" on sale for $20 off (a bit over 28%). It doesn't have a front light but the cover I later bought for it, once I determined it was worth keeping, does.

Something the size of a Surface is fine for someone who carries a briefcase all the time but, then again, one of the ideas of a tablet is to help eliminate the briefcase.
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22 Jul 2014   #64
ThrashZone

Win-7-Pro64bit 7-H-Prem-64bit
 
 

With a device that large I don't see how a brief case wouldn't be used,
Now days kids don't carry a book more less a device this size unless it's in a backpack,
But as some have said we are not the targeted demographic

Although I use my laptop and a portable printer in the field quite a bit for on the spot invoice submitting I rarely ever hand write anything anymore,
And the biggest tick is I can do all of this without a internet connection,
Office is installed and not online in the cloud as Microsoft would have us use it

So I'm sure some people will find all of this slate and cloud stuff useful but it's just not the way I've ever operated,
I have a bunch of movies and music installed along with actual programs I can use when bored at an airport... without ever accessing the internet

So the only demographic I see Microsoft hitting on are the Mac crowd which wouldn't use a Microsoft product if it were free and at 800+ it's not free at all
Cheers.
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22 Jul 2014   #65
jimbo45

Linux CENTOS 7 / various Windows OS'es and servers
 
 

Hi, there

Why are we mentioning "Slates" here -- I'm talking about the Convertibles and the SP3 is just as competent as any current laptop - especially when it's in a docking station -- OK expensive but please people tell me what part of the spec is INFERIOR to a laptop. (Docking station gives 3 FULL USB3 ports too if you want a LOT of external devices).

Watching movies is easy too at airports -- even easier in "tablet mode" -- you can either read the movie off an micro sdHC card, internal SSD or external device -- on a 64GB micro SD card you can store about 40 Blu Ray quality (full 1080p) movies ripped at around 2GB each and the resolution is far better than using a typical standard laptop - plus battery life is longer too -- important now when boarding the plane - security might check if your device powers up - your laptop battery might be flat after 3 hrs use in an airport with no available power sockets !!. You don't have to have an internet connection if you don't want to use one.

Running apps (EXCEL etc) is fine too -- there IS a keyboard and you can use a wireless mouse - just like a laptop.

Operating it as a TABLET is only ONE way of using the device but given the usually poor screen resolution of a laptop (768 X 1366) I prefer any day the infinitely better screen resolution on the SP3 -- even on a small screen such as the Samsung S5 phone you can easily see the difference between 1080p (Samsung s5) and the 720p (Samsung S4) so on the SP3's screen it's really easy.

Plugged into a docking station with keyboard, mouse and nice large external monitor it out classes any laptop I've used in the last few years -- I haven't tried Apple but if we restrict ourselves to PC's then my statement is what I've experienced.

AS I keep re-iterating this is NOT a pure tablet - and other people will come out with similar (and probably) cheaper products --early adopters always pay more !!!. I remember my first CD player would have cost around 1200 USD in todays money!! and now it's throw away technology !!. Did I regret buying it -- not a bit and the millions who bought much cheaper CD players and CD's during their heyday should be eternally grateful to the "early adopters".

Any real old timers here might remember what the initial PC cost together with the unbelievably large 20 MB hard disk !!! - yes MB not GB or TB. Due to that takeup you've had decent cheap performing PC's for years. !!!

Cheers
jimbo
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22 Jul 2014   #66
ThrashZone

Win-7-Pro64bit 7-H-Prem-64bit
 
 

Surface/ Slate same animal and you've been saying what the surface is for and whom many times,
I just called it a slate by accident
Cheers.
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22 Jul 2014   #67
Lady Fitzgerald

Win 7 Ultimate 64 bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
...please people tell me what part of the spec is INFERIOR to a laptop. (Docking station gives 3 FULL USB3 ports too if you want a LOT of external devices...
The SP3 by itself has only one USB 3.0 port. My new $600 notebook has two USB 3.0 and two USB 2.0 ports without having to use a docking station. Btw, that docking station has only the bandwidth of the single port so if you wanted to run, say, three external HDDs, they had better be in powered docks or the docking station had better be externally powered. Also, your speed would be throttled.

The SP3 doesn't have a separate number pad on the keyboard. My notebook does. Believe me, it frequently comes in handy.

The low end SP3, which cost pretty much twice as much as my notebook, has only 64GB storage whereas my notebook comes with 500GB. The SP3 does have models with up to 512GB of storage but they cost more. Granted, SP3's storage is a SSD and my notebooks stock storage is a HDD but I can replace the HDD with SSDs up to 1 TB (I have a 500GB SSD for my notebook).

The SP3 has a 12" display. My notebook has a 15" display. At my age, even with trifocals, my old eyes greatly appreciate the difference!

The low end SP3 comes with 4GB RAM. My notebook comes with 6GB RAM. 8 GB RAM is available on the SP3 for a higher price.

The SP3 doesn't have an ODD like my notebook does. And yes, I still use them...frequently.

Granted, the SP3 has 9 hours battery life opposed to my notebook's 4 hours but I seriously doubt I would ever use my notebook on battery for more than hour or two. If I have to amuse myself for any longer than that, I have my e-Book reader which has even longer battery life (I don't remember how much but it's measured in weeks instead of hours); I would much rather read a book on a portable device than watch a movie on one to kill time.
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22 Jul 2014   #68
jimbo45

Linux CENTOS 7 / various Windows OS'es and servers
 
 

Hi there.

Travelling with a 15 inch screen is actually quite a nuisance -- the 12 inch display is fine for on the road. Try working or even watching a movie with a 15 inch laptop with the lid open and a decent distance from your face on a UK long distance train (especially Virgin Trains who operate service from Glasgow, Carlisle, Manchester / Liverpool and London). Even Business class has fairly narrow seats -- and they seem to get SMALLER with each refurbishment of the Rolling Stock

A numeric keypad isn't standard on a lot of laptops either - it's really an individual taste whether you want / use / need that feature.

The Docking station is powered - however I doubt if most people connect 3 external HDD's to their laptops at the same time - especially if they have the 2TB small passport type of drives - so USB3 throughput is likely to be less than maximum anyway.

It IS expensive and of course for a lot of people not a suitable device. - For others it DOES work and all I was saying that it can quite easily suffice instead of a laptop.

Anyway nobody HAS to use it -- I just think though in future we will see a lot more of these "Convertible" or multi- function devices -- just look at a smart phone -- actually using a Smart phone for making / receiving calls is probably only a TINY fraction of the way these devices are used. !!! For me the nr 1 issue is PORTABILITY and if you travel as much as I do you'll appreciate that -- and being stuck in Airports for hours at a time is not that unusual an occurrence - you can't spend the WHOLE day drinking Beer in Airport taverns unfortunately !!!.

Each to their own -- I think the Brit saying is "Horses for Courses".

Cheers
jimbo
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22 Jul 2014   #69
Lady Fitzgerald

Win 7 Ultimate 64 bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
Hi there.

Travelling with a 15 inch screen is actually quite a nuisance -- the 12 inch display is fine for on the road. Try working or even watching a movie with a 15 inch laptop with the lid open and a decent distance from your face on a UK long distance train (especially Virgin Trains who operate service from Glasgow, Carlisle, Manchester / Liverpool and London). Even Business class has fairly narrow seats -- and they seem to get SMALLER with each refurbishment of the Rolling Stock

A numeric keypad isn't standard on a lot of laptops either - it's really an individual taste whether you want / use / need that feature.

The Docking station is powered - however I doubt if most people connect 3 external HDD's to their laptops at the same time - especially if they have the 2TB small passport type of drives - so USB3 throughput is likely to be less than maximum anyway.

It IS expensive and of course for a lot of people not a suitable device. - For others it DOES work and all I was saying that it can quite easily suffice instead of a laptop.

Anyway nobody HAS to use it -- I just think though in future we will see a lot more of these "Convertible" or multi- function devices -- just look at a smart phone -- actually using a Smart phone for making / receiving calls is probably only a TINY fraction of the way these devices are used. !!! For me the nr 1 issue is PORTABILITY and if you travel as much as I do you'll appreciate that -- and being stuck in Airports for hours at a time is not that unusual an occurrence - you can't spend the WHOLE day drinking Beer in Airport taverns unfortunately !!!.

Each to their own -- I think the Brit saying is "Horses for Courses".

Cheers
jimbo
The only laptops I've seen without numeric keypads are the netbooks.

Not everyone travels by plane or train. I pretty much drive everywhere I go. It may take longer on really long trips (if I cross more than a couple of States and the plane goes directly to where I am going) but it's cheaper and more comfortable, I have my own vehicle when I get there, I can carry more with me, my luggage doesn't get mishandled or lost (not to mention I can pretty much put what I want in my luggage), and I can travel on my own schedule. On short trips (under 500 miles), driving is actually faster than flying since I don't have to get to an airport early, then cool my heels for hours waiting for my flight, then, when I arrive, I don't have to wait for my luggage to show up, wrestle it to car rental, get a car, then drive the rest of the way to my destination (planes don't always go to where I go). This is not to mention the hassle of the constantly changing airline rates and regulations, overbooking, flight delays and cancellations, and the increasingly draconian TSA regulations and inspections. I refuse to fly until the airlines quit playing games and the Gestapo (TSA) backs off. If I have to cross an ocean, I'll go by boat and enjoy the cruise. Train travel in the USA is pretty much a joke.
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22 Jul 2014   #70
Boozad

W7 Pro x64 SP1 | W10 Pro IP x64 | W8.1 Pro x64 VM | Linux Mint VM
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
Hi, there

Why are we mentioning "Slates" here -- I'm talking about the Convertibles and the SP3 is just as competent as any current laptop - especially when it's in a docking station -- OK expensive but please people tell me what part of the spec is INFERIOR to a laptop. (Docking station gives 3 FULL USB3 ports too if you want a LOT of external devices).

Watching movies is easy too at airports -- even easier in "tablet mode" -- you can either read the movie off an micro sdHC card, internal SSD or external device -- on a 64GB micro SD card you can store about 40 Blu Ray quality (full 1080p) movies ripped at around 2GB each and the resolution is far better than using a typical standard laptop - plus battery life is longer too -- important now when boarding the plane - security might check if your device powers up - your laptop battery might be flat after 3 hrs use in an airport with no available power sockets !!. You don't have to have an internet connection if you don't want to use one.

Running apps (EXCEL etc) is fine too -- there IS a keyboard and you can use a wireless mouse - just like a laptop.

Operating it as a TABLET is only ONE way of using the device but given the usually poor screen resolution of a laptop (768 X 1366) I prefer any day the infinitely better screen resolution on the SP3 -- even on a small screen such as the Samsung S5 phone you can easily see the difference between 1080p (Samsung s5) and the 720p (Samsung S4) so on the SP3's screen it's really easy.

Plugged into a docking station with keyboard, mouse and nice large external monitor it out classes any laptop I've used in the last few years -- I haven't tried Apple but if we restrict ourselves to PC's then my statement is what I've experienced.

AS I keep re-iterating this is NOT a pure tablet - and other people will come out with similar (and probably) cheaper products --early adopters always pay more !!!. I remember my first CD player would have cost around 1200 USD in todays money!! and now it's throw away technology !!. Did I regret buying it -- not a bit and the millions who bought much cheaper CD players and CD's during their heyday should be eternally grateful to the "early adopters".

Any real old timers here might remember what the initial PC cost together with the unbelievably large 20 MB hard disk !!! - yes MB not GB or TB. Due to that takeup you've had decent cheap performing PC's for years. !!!

Cheers
jimbo
Can you highlight the parts that would have saved the English economy?
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 Microsoft exec admits new reality: Market share no longer 90%, it's 14




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