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Windows 7: Windows 10 and telemetry: Time for a simple network analysis

15 Feb 2016   #1
Golden
Microsoft MVP

Windows 7 Ult. x64
 
 
Windows 10 and telemetry: Time for a simple network analysis

Quote:
There's been a lot of discussion recently about the telemetry data that Windows sends back to Microsoft. There's also been a lot of bad data out there, data that can make it easy to draw some of the wrong conclusions.
Quote:
Getting that understanding means a lot of work, capturing and filtering and analysing data. But once you've done that work, it looks as though Microsoft is doing just what it says: taking the data it needs to improve PC applications and services.
Windows 10 and telemetry: Time for a simple network analysis | ZDNet


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15 Feb 2016   #2
Layback Bear

Windows 7 Pro. 64/SP-1
 
 

Now that article made sense.

Microsoft did things right except they didn't
ask the owner of the computer for permission.
To be honest, I think a lot of programs probably gather information and don't ask for permission as they should.

The part that is hard to understand for me is when a government agency or Google ect does such a thing it's bad and when Microsoft does it a good thing. What is being gathered I don't think we really know. We know what they say they are gathering and why.

I probable just to dumb to understand or to stop such gathering of information from my systems.
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15 Feb 2016   #3
lehnerus2000

W7 Ultimate SP1, LM18 MATE, W10IP VM, W10 Home, #All 64 bit
 
 

Telemetry isn't the real issue.
It is being used like a "straw man" to provide cover for any other data "acquisition".

The real issue is all the other code (e.g. Apps, Cortana):
  • What is it collecting?
  • Where is the data being sent?
  • Who is buying it?
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15 Feb 2016   #4
groze

W7 32 bit, Linux Mint Xfce 18 64 bit
 
 

Some people in the comment section of the article still don't believe it, this is a freelance journalist.

One thing, I like is that he confirmed it was encrypted.
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15 Feb 2016   #5
pbcopter

Windows 7 Ultimate x64 SP1, Windows 8.1 Pro x64, Windows 10 Pro x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Layback Bear View Post
Now that article made sense.

Microsoft did things right except they didn't
ask the owner of the computer for permission.
...
I think the EULA constitutes the asking.
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15 Feb 2016   #6
Lady Fitzgerald

Win 7 Ultimate 64 bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Layback Bear View Post
Now that article made sense.

Microsoft did things right except they didn't
ask the owner of the computer for permission.
To be honest, I think a lot of programs probably gather information and don't ask for permission as they should.

The part that is hard to understand for me is when a government agency or Google ect does such a thing it's bad and when Microsoft does it a good thing. What is being gathered I don't think we really know. We know what they say they are gathering and why.

I probable just to dumb to understand or to stop such gathering of information from my systems.
Actually, when you install Win 10, you give Microsoft permission when you agree to the terms in the EULA.
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15 Feb 2016   #7
Layback Bear

Windows 7 Pro. 64/SP-1
 
 

I understand that a EULA has been agreed to and it does give permission in a backhanded way.
Where the line is drawn is what I confused with. Who and when does the line move to what can or will be gathered.

Today (A), (B), and (C) is collected. What is to stop Microsoft from gathering (D), (E) and (F) tomorrow? Is their a limit on what can and can not be gathered down the road?
Where is the line drawn; is their a line?
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15 Feb 2016   #8
Berkey

Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-bit SP1
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Layback Bear View Post
Now that article made sense.

Microsoft did things right except they didn't
ask the owner of the computer for permission.
To be honest, I think a lot of programs probably gather information and don't ask for permission as they should.

The part that is hard to understand for me is when a government agency or Google ect does such a thing it's bad and when Microsoft does it a good thing. What is being gathered I don't think we really know. We know what they say they are gathering and why.

I probable just to dumb to understand or to stop such gathering of information from my systems.
Probably the funniest point in any argument I see on various forums when it comes to the telemetry debate. People will claim that others are wearing tin foil hats and will bash the thievery and deception that google uses, yet when MS tells people they are collecting data for the betterment of the OS, its accepted blindly.


Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Layback Bear View Post
I understand that a EULA has been agreed to and it does give permission in a backhanded way.
Where the line is drawn is what I confused with. Who and when does the line move to what can or will be gathered.

Today (A), (B), and (C) is collected. What is to stop Microsoft from gathering (D), (E) and (F) tomorrow? Is their a limit on what can and can not be gathered down the road?
Where is the line drawn; is their a line?
I think 10 is a decent OS and the telemetry situation isn't as big of a problem for me as others, but you are right about where the line is drawn (Picard from first contact anyone) You want to know how many times I accessed my calculator or photoviewer, so be it however, any specific information about my files, pictures, videos and documents should never be analyzed. I don't think that they are and wouldn't suspect they will in the future, but people and business have been known to push envelops past the point of no return. We've agreed to the EULA, but is there an ex post facto or amnesty clause in there somewhere to either protects us from or justify their potential for such happenstances?
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15 Feb 2016   #9
Berkey

Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-bit SP1
 
 

One thing I don't understand is in one sentence he states,
Quote:
Without unencrypting the telemetry packets Microsoft receives, we're not going to know exactly what data it receives.
and the very next he says
Quote:
But they're small and relatively infrequent, so are unlikely to be packed with your personal data
So the assumption is that it is unlikely that they are collecting personal data, based only on the size of the data being sent? Again, I'm not one that thinks MS is doing such, but it seems a lot of people are challenging those who claim MS is actually collecting to prove such, which they cannot. However, in a counter argument, I don't see a lot of people proving that MS isn't collecting private data as they also cannot.

This author, why I respect his work and effort, is making a pure assumption that the data being sent is not private data without actually seeing said data, but rather judging its size. Not saying the are collecting, but if you cannot fully prove they are not (which would be impossible unless working from the inside of MS I suspect), then you cannot say, at least beyond the shadow of a doubt that MS isn't collecting private data. Regardless of the size, that doesn't prove they are not collecting private data to some degree, but it also does not prove that they are.

Remember, the Earth was once flat because it was assumed and accepted, until actual proof was presented to say otherwise. Until MS officially comes out and details these connections and that the data being sent actually contains we all, both those claiming foul play and non-foul play, can truly only assume what is or is not occurring.
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15 Feb 2016   #10
Clairvaux

Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit (OEM)
 
 

Unfortunately, asking for permission and giving out EULAs to "sign" does not mean a thing, because we know that Microsoft lies. It asks the permission to do one thing, and does the opposite :

When did ?Download updates but let me choose? change? @ ********
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