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Windows 7: UAC's..question

15 Mar 2010   #1
scouse6

 
UAC's..question

Why is it that after installing a program and giving the ok to UAC to proced,I have to give UAC permission every time the program loads.???
For example Superantispyware, asks UAC's permission everytime.
Many thanks


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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15 Mar 2010   #2
manhunter2826

Windows XP - Now Windows 7 Home Premium (64-bit).
 
 

Take a look at this thread also:
UAC Notifications

...and welcome to the forum :hello:
My System SpecsSystem Spec
15 Mar 2010   #3
Victek

Windows 7 x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by scouse6 View Post
Why is it that after installing a program and giving the ok to UAC to proced,I have to give UAC permission every time the program loads.???
For example Superantispyware, asks UAC's permission everytime.
Many thanks
.
UAC by design does not "remember" previous choices. This is to make sure that the system level event that's occurring in the present is being initiated by you and not malware. In other words because a program like SuperAntiSpyware is accessing areas of the system that are protected Windows wants to make sure this access is being given intentionally ( every single time ). It's understandably annoying because we don't want to keep repeating ourselves, but unfortunately Windows can't know where the request is coming from. Symantec has a UAC tool for Vista that "remembers" choices, but unfortunately doesn't offer a Windows 7 compatible version.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
.


15 Mar 2010   #4
Johnson

XP Pro and Windows7 32 bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Victek View Post
. This is to make sure that the system level event that's occurring in the present is being initiated by you and not malware. In other words because a program like SuperAntiSpyware is accessing areas of the system that are protected Windows wants to make sure this access is being given intentionally ( every single time ).
Hello Victek,

My understanding of UAC is:

With UAC enabled, the user runs as a standard user. When a program is executed that requires user elevation to admin, UAC asks and if given permission, temporarily does so.

UAC is not a HIPs, nor a execution monitor as such, and if UAC caught a specific piece of malware, it would be purely coincidental. UAC does not distingiush between malware and the user - it's all the same to UAC. All it does is give a heads up.

The rational for UAC is to "force" users to run as standard users and not as admins which a great many are wont to do.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
15 Mar 2010   #5
Victek

Windows 7 x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Johnson View Post
Hello Victek,

My understanding of UAC is:

UAC is not a HIPs, nor a execution monitor as such, and if UAC caught a specific piece of malware, it would be purely coincidental. UAC does not distinguish between malware and the user - it's all the same to UAC. All it does is give a heads up.

The rational for UAC is to "force" users to run as standard users and not as admins which a great many are wont to do.
.
You're correct that UAC does not distinguish between malware and the user, but that's not by design, it's because it can't. I've read that UAC is not meant to be a security barrier, but practically speaking what other purpose does it have? Why put up with it if not to gain some security against malware attacking the system with admin privileges?

UAC has the same weakness as a security program that requires user input - too many users cannot properly evaluate the prompts and usually click "yes" to make them go away. UAC doesn't force users to run as standard/limited users if they have admin accounts. The only way to do that is to actually use a Limited User Account which forces the user to input admin credentials in response to UAC prompts. In my experience in the business world the LUA is used as much to prevent the user from making changes to the system as to protect it from infection. It's a control thing.

I don't think we disagree about how it works, but it's debatable what purpose it serves
My System SpecsSystem Spec
16 Mar 2010   #6
Johnson

XP Pro and Windows7 32 bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Victek View Post
but practically speaking what other purpose does it have? Why put up with it if not to gain some security against malware attacking the system with admin privileges?
To limit the damage. If a piece of malware ran within standard user parameters, you wouldn't hear anything out of UAC.

My questioning of your answer to the OP is that the impression left was that UAC was an anti malware app, which I think both of us agree it is not.

We're agreed actually, UAC is another layer of security.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
16 Mar 2010   #7
darkassain

Windows 7 Ult x64(x2), HomePrem x32(x4), Server 08 (+VM), 08 R2 (VM) , SuSe 11.2 (VM), XP 32 (VM)
 
 

techincally even if you are running as a admin the application still needs to elevate privileges (which is why most software that has been developed in the past few years that would normally need to be elevated does it in two steps...)

one is through a service which has already admin (or if the programmer chooses system level) privileges with another program acting as gui and passing instructions to the service to do

i believe that at first that it was a way for compatibility (older apps that needed to) while mantaning security at the same time.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
16 Mar 2010   #8
jav

Windows 7 Ultimate x86 SP1
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Victek View Post
UAC doesn't force users to run as standard/limited users if they have admin accounts.
Actually, in a way it forces you to run as standard user as it gives you Standart User token as your main token. And according to inheritated Privilage rule everything run by you will inheritate your permission (standard user permissions as your main permisssion are got from standard user token) unless you specifically run it as admin (UAC prompt) and allow it to use admin token....

Anyway we can go for a long discussion about it....


Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by scouse6 View Post
Why is it that after installing a program and giving the ok to UAC to proced,I have to give UAC permission every time the program loads.???
For example Superantispyware, asks UAC's permission everytime.
Many thanks
I think this should help you: Elevated Program Shortcut without UAC Prompt - Create
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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 UAC's..question




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