Windows Mail

Greg S · 27 Jun 2010

poppa bear said:

Greg S said:

I'm getting the same thing. I thought that it may have something to do with WinMail sharing the connection with the supposedly more secure IE8 and it's not able to break the connection but that's not the case although it still may be. I've changed all connection settings possible in WinMail and still get the crash. I think I tried Working offline from IE8 which did cause WinMail to be offline but when going to the Receive Mail button, the option to Go back online caused a crash.

Unfortunately I think it's a lost cause. Whatever the direct cause the general problem is WinMail is a hybrid so it could be any one of a number of things.

I'm inclined to go along with PB's observations. Our fully functional WinMail is slowly dropping as fully functional as the term goes. Having said that, 1) I don't use the Spamatola filter and 2) I never work offline so I'm still content with the condition of our Windows Mail in Windows Seven but, I'm more than likely and eventually going to make the move to the dreaded Windows Live Mail. My holdout has nothing to do with me being Old School which I am but it has to do with MS's apps which in my opinion love to get their meat hooks into you deeply in ways I don't like. I'm not saying Wndows Live Mail is like that but my wife and kids have some that are. One in particular is MS Office. You talk about an updating Pimp, this thing is constantly soliciting new updates. If I had to run something that updates once or twice a day other than a security app, well I wouldn't and don't. Anywho, PB or others, I may be calling on you to hold my hand through this transition some time in the near future.

poppa bear · 27 Jun 2010

Greg S said:

I'm inclined to go along with PB's observations. Our fully functional WinMail is slowly dropping as fully functional as the term goes. Having said that, 1) I don't use the Spamatola filter and 2) I never work offline so I'm still content with the condition of our Windows Mail in Windows Seven but, I'm more than likely and eventually going to make the move to the dreaded Windows Live Mail. My holdout has nothing to do with me being Old School which I am but it has to do with MS's apps which in my opinion love to get their meat hooks into you deeply in ways I don't like. I'm not saying Wndows Live Mail is like that but my wife and kids have some that are. One in particular is MS Office. You talk about an updating Pimp, this thing is constantly soliciting new updates. If I had to run something that updates once or twice a day other than a security app, well I wouldn't and don't. Anywho, PB or others, I may be calling on you to hold my hand through this transition some time in the near future.

Totally agree with your sentiments. In general terms I hate Windows Live anything, and only through necessity have I moved over to WinLiveMail. I've been using it for about a month now, and a few days ago downloaded WLM Wave 4 Beta, and I have to admit I've been pleasantly surprised. It seems they have been listening to the feedback.

A few of the main points of aggrevation in the earlier versions were the need to sign on to Windows Live when opening WLM, and having every account listed in the left panel. There is a switch so you never have to sign in to Windows Live, and while all the individual accounts are still shown in the left panel, they can be minimized to just the account name with no sub-folders showing. Also, the Quick Views folder in the left panel can be used similar to Local Folders in WinMail, with all emails from all accounts shown in this folder.

It has mega buttons and switches, and can do most anything you want. It's format is very similar to that of Office 2007 in that it has 4 Tabs across the top, and a Ribbon with icons for each tab. The Ribbon can be hidden if so desired. There is also a Quick Access bar, which can be customized. In the top task bar, there is a Drop Down Menu accessed through a button on the top left side. Here are some images of how I have mine set up.

1. This shows Drop Down menu accessed from top left button with Options clicked.

2. This shows the Home Tab with the Accounts Poppa & Bern in left panel minimized and Quick Views folder acting as master folder for all accounts. The Quick Views folder can be customized by right clicking the name of the folder.

3. This shows the Folders tab.

4. This shows the View tab.

This shows the Accounts tab.

The main adjustment is in becoming accustomed to the new layout and finding the location of the various functions. Overall there are a lot more features than WinMail, and a lot more options for different settings such as view, etc. On the home page under Tools there is a Send/Receive button, which can execute this function for all accounts or any one selected account.

I'm still learning but overall am very pleased with the functionality of WinLiveMail. The more I use it the more features I'm finding. Hope this helps anyone making the transition over from 'ol faithful,

WinMail. If someone hasn't already done so, I think it might be a good idea to start a thread for discussion of WinLiveMail Wave 4 Beta, and to offer assistance for those starting the transition.

Cheers PB

roncerr · 27 Jun 2010

I bet this Win Mail on 7 Tutorial, with nearly 700 posts, gave MS a shove in the right direction. Thanks for your post #317 and to the others whom you credit.

Yajiro · 27 Jun 2010

Thanks for the help poppa bear. It was indeed my mistake. For some reason I thought I should double check my account settings before even testing it and a website I checked said to turn authentication on for Comcast e-mail. Must have been really old information.

Setting up windows 7 with all my old programs and settings must be making me crazy. Not sure how I missed that easy mistake. Once again, great tutorial though.

poppa bear · 28 Jun 2010

roncerr said:

I bet this Win Mail on 7 Tutorial, with nearly 700 posts, gave MS a shove in the right direction. Thanks for your post #317 and to the others whom you credit.

Thanks roncerr. I was wondering if you'd spotted the availability of WinLiveMail Wave 4 Beta? And yes, I totally agree, this tutorial gave M$ a much needed kick in the butt to move them in the right direction.

I neglected to give credit to xsmile in post #317. He researched the regedits that allowed .eml email type files to be opened on desktop.

Credit is also due to yourself roncerr for:

1. Pushing me to pursue the compulsory sign-in to WinLive issue in WinLiveMail; and the need not to be signed in to access contacts, so WLM could be used as mail client and not a web based mail program. The results of this investiagation culminated in my post #655 How Contacts/Sync function works in Windows Live Mail found here.

2. Which led me to make these concerns known to Microsoft in my communications with them.

Warning: If anyone is downloading WLM Wave 4, there are two download machines. The one named wlsetup.web downloads the whole Windows Live shooting match, and then you have to uninstall what you don't want. This validates Greg S's comment about M$ getting their meat hooks into you wherever possible! Update: A new wlsetup.web download engine has come out which allows you to download selected elements of Windows Live, so you can select WinLiveMail to download by itself. This download engine is attached at the bottom of this post, or can be downloaded directly from this link here.

This second download machine, wlsetup-webc, can be obtained by this direct download link: wlsetup-webc.exe. When wlsetup-webc is run from desktop, it gives a menu to choose what elements of WinLive are downloaded. I only downloaded Mail by un-ticking all other programs available.

I've also attached the actual download machine program wlsetup-webc, if you prefer that to the direct download link above.

Have to admit I'll miss all the fanfare that went with this thread. Certainly gave me an interest and has been a learning experience from people like Greg S whom I consider the "El Maestro Supremo" for researching work arounds and general PC literacy. Here's a public rep to Greg S for all his help. Thank you.

Cheers PB

Greg S · 28 Jun 2010

poppa bear said:

Have to admit I'll miss all the fanfare that went with this thread. Certainly gave me an interest and has been a learning experience from people like Greg S whom I consider the "El Maestro Supremo" for researching work arounds and general PC literacy. Here's a public rep to Greg S for all his help. Thank you.

Cheers PB

What a coincidence, I just now got in from work kinda early and came here to say I'm throwing in the towel as well as offer a big Thanks to all, especially SevenForums for allowing us to hash and hack out the Windows Mail on Win 7.

I did setup WLM on my wifes laptop and it hasn't had any problems for a couple of months now but that was on her laptop. Anything that works well on other laptops for some reason will give me problems on mine. I have to be honest about this WLM, I don't understand it. What is it? I know it's the latest and greatest email client but I have some questions with the biggest one being, does it store messages locally like WinMail? I've read through some of the guys/gals replies here and for some reason I'm getting the feeling that it doesn't. Has anyone started a new thread on WLM. I probably need the WLM thread for dummies if it exists. Anywho, I'm moving on to WLM for better or worse. If the worse is really bad, maybe we can hack it into shape,lol.

Anyone know what the initial file permissions were in Windows Mail folder and contents? Wasn't it TrustedInstaller ?

Greg S · 28 Jun 2010

Good God Almighty, which one of these seven hundred outbound connections should actually have an outbound connection. As you may have guessed, I've installed it but am not happy to say the least. I've been trying for one hour to receive mail and couldn't. I deleted the Windows Live Mail rule from my Firewall and allowed it to create a new rule which I think may have solved that. Back to my original question, Is Windows Live Mail the only one that needs net access?

Here's what wanted and got as best I remember, network access during installation
1) Windows Installer
2) Windows Live Installer
3) Choice Guard command line interface
4) Can't remember, I killed it right off the bat
5) Windows Live Communications Platform
6) Windows Live Mail

Which one's above need to keep their Firewall rules and which, if any can be deleted?

poppa bear · 28 Jun 2010

Greg S said:

I know it's the latest and greatest email client but I have some questions with the biggest one being, does it store messages locally like WinMail?

Yes it does. This is an extract from my post #650 found here.

Received and sent emails are auto downloaded and stored on your hard drive under AppData, the same location used by WinMail. The only differnece is WinLiveMail stores them in the individual Accounts folders, whereas WinMail stores them in one folder named Local Folders. This pathway shows where they are stored, however it is necessary to make hidden folders visible to view AppData:

Start Orb --> User Name --> AppData --> Local --> Microsoft --> Windows Live Mail --> Account Name (eg "Alex", or whatever name you give you account.

This is an image of the location of storage folders for emails in Windows Live Mail.

Windows Mail-winlivemail-email-storage.png

This is an image of the location of storage folders for emails in Windows Mail.

It's easy to demonstrate this. Simply turn off your modem and all emails are still visible. Or another way is to open one of your accounts at this location, and move all the-sub folders from that account to a storage folder on your desktop. Shut everything, and download a few new emails. WinLiveMail will have created new sub-folders for the account folder you cleaned out. However, even though you are now have your modem on, and choose to sign in to Windows Live, (which is optional - see post here), the emails from the moved sub-folder which you cleaned out from the accounts folder will still be missing. If they were stored on the web site of Windows Live, they would still be available.

They can however, be restored simply by moving the contents of each sub-folder that you stored on your desktop back into the appropriate newly created sub-folders.

My incoming emails are stored on my ISP web mail site, or Yahoo web mail site, until I click Send/Receive on WLM, when they are stored on my hard drive at the location mentioned above.

On opening WLM there are basically 3 options re signing in to Windows Live. There is a switch found at this location which enables or disables signing in to WinLive:

Open: WLM --> Icon button in top left side of Ribbon --> Options --> Connections Tab --> Sub-heading: Connecting to Windows Live services --> Sign in or Stop signing in.

"Sign in" active:

1. At prompt on opening WinLiveMail, tick option to always auto-sign-in on... (ain't never gonna happen!)

2. At prompt on opening WinLiveMail sign in manually.

"Stop signing in" active:

3. On opening WinLiveMail you are never signed in and WLM acts like a normal email client, which means it can't store emails on Windows Live web site because it's not signed in.

Cheers PB

Greg S · 28 Jun 2010

poppa bear said:

Greg S said:

I know it's the latest and greatest email client but I have some questions with the biggest one being, does it store messages locally like WinMail?

Yes it does. This is an extract from my post #650 found here.

Received and sent emails are auto downloaded and stored on your hard drive under AppData, the same location used by WinMail. The only differnece is WinLiveMail stores them in the individual Accounts folders, whereas WinMail stores them in one folder named Local Folders. This pathway shows where they are stored, however it is necessary to make hidden folders visible to view AppData:

Start Orb --> User Name --> AppData --> Local --> Microsoft --> Windows Live Mail --> Account Name (eg "Alex", or whatever name you give you account.

This is an image of the location of storage folders for emails in Windows Live Mail.

This is an image of the location of storage folders for emails in Windows Mail.

It's easy to demonstrate this. Simply turn off your modem and all emails are still visible. Or another way is to open one of your accounts at this location, and move all the-sub folders from that account to a storage folder on your desktop. Shut everything, and download a few new emails. WinLiveMail will have created new sub-folders for the account folder you cleaned out. However, even though you are now have your modem on, and choose to sign in to Windows Live, (which is optional - see post here), the emails from the moved sub-folder which you cleaned out from the accounts folder will still be missing. If they were stored on the web site of Windows Live, they would still be available.

They can however, be restored simply by moving the contents of each sub-folder that you stored on your desktop back into the appropriate newly created sub-folders.

My incoming emails are stored on my ISP web mail site, or Yahoo web mail site, until I click Send/Receive on WLM, when they are stored on my hard drive at the location mentioned above.

On opening WLM there are basically 3 options re signing in to Windows Live. There is a switch found at this location which enables or disables signing in to WinLive:

Open: WLM --> Icon button in top left side of Ribbon --> Options --> Connections Tab --> Sub-heading: Connecting to Windows Live services --> Sign in or Stop signing in.

"Sign in" active:

1. At prompt on opening WinLiveMail, tick option to always auto-sign-in on... (ain't never gonna happen!)

2. At prompt on opening WinLiveMail sign in manually.

"Stop signing in" active:

3. On opening WinLiveMail you are never signed in and WLM acts like a normal email client, which means it can't store emails on Windows Live web site because it's not signed in.

Cheers PB

Which do you recomend, signing in/not signing it? When WLM is setup successfully, can WinMail's mail storage/folders(email folders) be deleted? I took a snapshot prior to installing WLM. I will rollback and start again when I get this going correctly?

poppa bear · 28 Jun 2010

Greg S said:

Good God Almighty, which one of these seven hundred outbound connections should actually have an outbound connection. As you may have guessed, I've installed it but am not happy to say the least. I've been trying for one hour to receive mail and couldn't. I deleted the Windows Live Mail rule from my Firewall and allowed it to create a new rule which I think may have solved that. Back to my original question, Is Windows Live Mail the only one that needs net access?

Here's what wanted and got as best I remember, network access during installation
1) Windows Installer
2) Windows Live Installer
3) Choice Guard command line interface
4) Can't remember, I killed it right off the bat
5) Windows Live Communications Platform
6) Windows Live Mail

Which one's above need to keep their Firewall rules and which, if any can be deleted?

Can't help. Fraid you've totally lost me. Are they rules for connections your firewall allows? I just installed WLM and it worked. Am using Zone Alarm freebie firewall.