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Windows 7: Want to update, should I disable things first?


18 Oct 2013   #1

Windows 7 Home Premium (x64), SP1
 
 
Want to update, should I disable things first?

I've done several different reinstalls to my system in the past, and Windows Update has given me hell each time. Many of the updates wouldn't install (had errors), and the system would also stall during configuration--prompting me to shut it off halfway-in due to unresponsiveness.

I've learned that my problem may very well be due to turning on the free 30-day Norton Antivirus after every factory restore, and/or installing a different antivirus before updating.

I'm beginning to wonder why the system was designed like that in the first place? Windows suggests you update right-out-of-the-box, but the packaged antivirus product seems to cause conflict if you turn it on. Makes no bloody sense what-so-ever. Even better, Windows AND the antivirus give no opinion on the matter.

So on my most recent reinstallation, I've made sure to download and install antivirus only after installing Windows Updates, and this seems to have helped things dramatically. It's too bad I was never given this tip before, it could have really been useful.

Moving forward to today, I have some updates that need installing. I want to update, but am fearful. I have both Avast antivirus and Malwarebytes installed, and am concerned about any conflicts. Should I disable these programs or uninstall them before updating?? I'm not sure if Malwarebytes can be disabled, but it may not be a concern anyway--correct me if I'm wrong.

My System SpecsSystem Spec
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18 Oct 2013   #2
Microsoft MVP

Windows 7 Ultimate X64 SP1
 
 

Windows doesn't bundle Norton with it but may be on your motherboard driver disk, just skip it, don't install it right away. What I do and seems to work is after Windows is complete, user account done but no drivers> Windows 7 will install several drivers form the installer so I let it do that. I install hardware drivers previously downloaded from the various hardware and board sites.

The very last drive to install in the LAN or other network adapter driver, this holds Windows updates at bay. After the LAN is running I then install security, in my case a paid for Norton, it will need updates. I also set Windows updates to Check for Updates but let me decide whether to download and install.

Still a crapload of them but this has worked for me.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Oct 2013   #3

Windows 7 Home Premium (x64), SP1
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Britton30 View Post
Windows doesn't bundle Norton with it but may be on your motherboard driver disk, just skip it, don't install it right away. What I do and seems to work is after Windows is complete, user account done but no drivers> Windows 7 will install several drivers form the installer so I let it do that. I install hardware drivers previously downloaded from the various hardware and board sites.

The very last drive to install in the LAN or other network adapter driver, this holds Windows updates at bay. After the LAN is running I then install security, in my case a paid for Norton, it will need updates. I also set Windows updates to Check for Updates but let me decide whether to download and install.

Still a crapload of them but this has worked for me.
I believe Norton might have been bundled with the Hewlett Packard laptop, not necessarily bundled with Windows.

Umm.. LAN? I'm partially unfamiliar with drivers, I know what they are, but I do not understand them when things go bad or are missing.

To reiterate my question above, before updating Windows with updates, is it a better idea to disable antivirus or uninstall it?? I need an opinion on what should be done about Malwarebytes too, I can't disable this program.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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19 Oct 2013   #4

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Win 7 x64 Home Premium (and x86 VirtualBox VM)
 
 

MalwareBytes should be fine - if Norton was/is installed, then I'd uninstall it and run the Norton Removal Tool before attempting the full hit of updates.

Other than that - here's my usual system for updates...

1) install any necessary drivers from the manufacturer's website or driver disk.
2) do a manual Check for Updates
now update using Windows Updates - for the moment ignore optional/recommended or Driver updates, and install the rest in this order, with at least one manual reboot between each batch, and another Check For Updates.
  • Security Updates for Windows
  • Updates for Windows
  • other Important/Critical Windows updates
  • IE9 (always install IE9 before IE10 - it seems to be more robust that way)
  • IE10
  • Updates for IE10
  • .NET updates (do .NET v3.5 updates before v4 or v4.5 ones)
  • once all the Critical/Important updates are in, work on the others in the same manner
HTH
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Oct 2013   #5

Win 7 Pro x64 SP1, Win 7 Ult x86 SP1
 
 

I see Noel posted while I was writing this post, but here is my 2 cents ...

When you do a reinstall, are you doing a Factory Recovery using HP Recovery discs or the HP Recovery partition?
It sounds like that is what you are doing, rather than Clean Reinstall.

If the Norton trial antivirus is installed you should use the Norton removal utility, preferably before installing another AV program such as Avast.
Having more than 1 AV program installed can cause problems.

Are you using Malwarebytes PRO (real-time) paid version?
It sounds like it because the MBAM free version is an on-demand scanner and there are no running processes or services that would run all the time.
You should be able to disable MBAM Pro by right clicking on the MBAM notification area icon and uncheck "Start with Windows", or clicking "Start Scanner" and change the settings in the Protection tab.
You do need to be logged into Windows with an Administrator account for this.

Name:  NAISP02.PNG
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I run Windows updates with Avast real-time and MBAM real-time enabled and it doesn't cause any problems for me.
Others may have a different experience and opinion.

If you are interested in a clean reinstall of Windows without all the HP factory bloatware (and Norton) take a look at this tutorial:
Clean Reinstall - Factory OEM Windows 7


My System SpecsSystem Spec
25 Oct 2013   #6

Windows 7 Home Premium (x64), SP1
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by NoelDP View Post
MalwareBytes should be fine - if Norton was/is installed, then I'd uninstall it and run the Norton Removal Tool before attempting the full hit of updates.

Other than that - here's my usual system for updates...

1) install any necessary drivers from the manufacturer's website or driver disk.
2) do a manual Check for Updates
now update using Windows Updates - for the moment ignore optional/recommended or Driver updates, and install the rest in this order, with at least one manual reboot between each batch, and another Check For Updates.
  • Security Updates for Windows
  • Updates for Windows
  • other Important/Critical Windows updates
  • IE9 (always install IE9 before IE10 - it seems to be more robust that way)
  • IE10
  • Updates for IE10
  • .NET updates (do .NET v3.5 updates before v4 or v4.5 ones)
  • once all the Critical/Important updates are in, work on the others in the same manner
HTH
I recently reinstalled my system once again, and while checking for updates, I was not able to receive updates in the orders you have specified--Windows does not seem very particular about order, otherwise it should leave a message about it.

What I have done is install the important updates first, then check for more, install, check for more, install, until there was no more (there is a few but I'm ignoring them due to past errors). I ignored the IE updates until I got 10 to pull up, and also ignored anything with the term 'Service Pack 2' in it, all this with no antivirus installed. They all went in successfully. As for the optional ones, I haven't touched any of them, but I am noticing on Youtube that my mouse pointer won't disappear when in fullscreen. It used to.

I have installed Avast and Malwarebytes again, and am wondering if I should disable Avast if I want to install the optional updates, or should I just uninstall it? Earlier you mentioned uninstalling Norton, but uninstalling antivirus almost seems a bit much?? Some people have automatic updates enabled. A person can't possibly disable antivirus when Updates are set on autopilot? I just want to temporarily disable Avasts' protection shields permanently, and am wondering if that would be sufficient enough? I only plan on installing updates manually.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by DavidW7ncus View Post
I see Noel posted while I was writing this post, but here is my 2 cents ...

When you do a reinstall, are you doing a Factory Recovery using HP Recovery discs or the HP Recovery partition?
It sounds like that is what you are doing, rather than Clean Reinstall.

If the Norton trial antivirus is installed you should use the Norton removal utility, preferably before installing another AV program such as Avast.
Having more than 1 AV program installed can cause problems.

Are you using Malwarebytes PRO (real-time) paid version?
It sounds like it because the MBAM free version is an on-demand scanner and there are no running processes or services that would run all the time.
You should be able to disable MBAM Pro by right clicking on the MBAM notification area icon and uncheck "Start with Windows", or clicking "Start Scanner" and change the settings in the Protection tab.
You do need to be logged into Windows with an Administrator account for this.

Attachment 290397

I run Windows updates with Avast real-time and MBAM real-time enabled and it doesn't cause any problems for me.
Others may have a different experience and opinion.

If you are interested in a clean reinstall of Windows without all the HP factory bloatware (and Norton) take a look at this tutorial:
Clean Reinstall - Factory OEM Windows 7
I'm using the HP recovery partition to reinstall, and it works like a beauty. It's a bit time consuming, but it definitely gets the job done. Perhaps if there were easier ways to go about doing it, I would be interested. I've checked that tutorial in the past, but to me it seems like so much could go wrong in between. Every system is so different and particular about things.

I uninstalled Norton through Programs, and the process ran me through a Norton removal wizard and prompted me to restart. I believe I'm good there.

No.. I am running MBAM Pro, are you saying that with those options enabled, Updates possibly won't go through?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
26 Oct 2013   #7

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Win 7 x64 Home Premium (and x86 VirtualBox VM)
 
 

You really need to run the Norton Removal Tool to clear the dregs of Norton out of the system - the standard uninstall routine leave a lot behind...

Download theNorton Removal Tool from here https://www-secure.symantec.com/norton-support/jsp/help-solutions.jsp?lg=english&ct=united+states&docid=20080710133834EN&product=home&version=1&pvid=f-home



Close all otherprograms, then run the tool. When it's complete, reboot the machine whether it asks for it or not.



Afterthe reboot, open an Elevated Command Prompt, and run the following command



NETSH WINSOCK RESET



You'llbe advised to reboot - do so.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
26 Oct 2013   #8

Win 7 Pro x64 SP1, Win 7 Ult x86 SP1
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Double View Post
No.. I am running MBAM Pro, are you saying that with those options enabled, Updates possibly won't go through?
No, I was not saying "Updates possibly won't go through".

In Post #3 you stated
Quote:
I need an opinion on what should be done about Malwarebytes too, I can't disable this program.
I was trying to tell you that you SHOULD be able to disable Malwarebytes, if and when you ever want to.
If you can not disable Malwarebytes, imho you have a problem...

As I stated, I install MS updates with MBAM real-time protection (and real-time AV) running and have not had any problems.
If you have a problem installing updates, you should be able to disable real-time protection to see if that fixes the problem.

@NoelDP
Thanks for posting better instructions/advice on uninstalling Norton!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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 Want to update, should I disable things first?




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