Imaging strategies

Could someone stop by and help this member? Is it possible to add files to a system image? I did leave a simple response so he? wouldn't be left hanging.

Thanks.

http://www.sevenforums.com/general-...sible-add-files-system-image.html#post3211155
Not sure what's up with that link you posted :/

I was afraid of that TZ, the original poster started his thread in General Discussion and it has since been moved to Backup and Restore, this is the link now: http://www.sevenforums.com/backup-r...les-system-image-post3211155.html#post3211155

I've been reading this thread and like many here am a huge proponent of drive imaging. Started with a DOS 5/Norton Ghost boot disk decades ago, same strategy. OS/Apps on one partition, user data on another. I prefer using bootable media for backup and restoring since in my experience with XP and 7 it is much faster and doesn't require installing anything on the system you are imaging. My preferred imaging software is Acronis 2019 from bootable ISO. I have used it to backup AND restore XP, Windows 7, 8.1 and Ubuntu 12.04. We all have our favorites that get the job done for us.

I used to carry a CD case with all my bootable CDs/DVDs for Acronis, Hirens, BartPE etc. That CD case is now collecting dust since I discovered Grub4DOS.

I now have most of my bootable CD/DVD images (ISO) on a bootable USB pen drive.



You can download the easy2boot.com software and use it to format and create the grub4dos bootable menu for your pen drive. Then you merely copy your ISO images to the _ISO/MAINMENU subdirectory on your pen drive and presto! Multi-boot USB pen drive.

A few caveats; the file system is FAT32 so max file size is 4GB (most bootable imaging software is far below this range so it shouldn't be a problem). While this worked flawlessly for me on computers using legacy BIOS I couldn't get it to boot fully on UEFI machines. There appears to be a method to convert the pen drive so it works with UEFI but I haven't tried it yet - If I get it working I'll post a follow-up.

For UEFI I had to use RUFUS which, like easy2boot, formats the pen drive, makes it bootable and copies the appropriate files from your bootable ISO to the pen drive - I had to use this method to successfully boot Acronis 2017 and backup a Dell UEFI laptop. I have also used RUFUS in the past to create a Windows 7 installation pen drive from an ISO. The only drawback is no multi-boot with Rufus - only 1 bootable image per pen drive.

I'm going to play around with other software and see if I can create a multi-boot UEFI for modern systems but I find it's much easier to carry a pen drive in my pocket with all my bootable utilities than a CD case.

For years, I've enjoyed reading these threads on the topic of doing backups.


Over the years, there have been many so called Backup Programs. All the way back to the DOS days, there were companies, like Central Point Software, that wrote PC Tools, and that put out very good backup programs.

In MS Windows, the first really GOOD backup program that I was introduced to was written by a little known software company in New Zealand, called simply "Ghost". I began using Ghost 2.0 while working in a small computer shop. We mainly used it to CLONE small hard drives to larger hard drives.

So cutting to the chase, so to speak, I still use the last DOS version of Ghost, ver 11.5, to clone my own SSD to a 1TB backup drive, once a week. Even more often, I use Ghost 11.5 to make a compressed backup of my C:\ partition to an external HD.
I run Ghost from two different media. One is a CD that can boot my PC to a DOS Menu on the CD, from which I can run Ghost in several different modes, and also perform different DOS utilities. It's a nice disk to have around.
I've duplicated my Ghost boot CD to an 8GB Flash Drive. I have the same files on a bootable SD Memory Card.
Using the same backup program since 1997, keeps it simple. And every Backup can be verified, making it flawless.
Ghost runs in DOS, and could not care less what it's backing up. It will back up all versions of Windows, and even Linux, or a pure data disk with no OS on it at all.

I've also used it for backing up Windows 10/Pro/64.


In all these years, I've had countless HD failures, * but with good backups "In the Can" , I've never lost the first bit of data.

* I've had almost NO HD failures since I stopped using WD drives.

Cheers Mates, and Happy Computing!

I have a question about image vs. clone.

I have close to 60 programs on my C partition, so not easily duplicated from scratch. I've been imaging with Macrium, and it's been working fine, although I've never had to restore more than a few random files. If I have a virus or any other major system screwup, I can restore from an image.

However, if my HD dies, then I need a clone to copy to a new HD. The downside is that a clone also copies all the free space, of which I have huge amounts. Half of my C partition and 2/3 of my D partition are empty and will remain so.

Is there a compromise between these 2?

RoWin7 said:

I have a question about image vs. clone.

I have close to 60 programs on my C partition, so not easily duplicated from scratch. I've been imaging with Macrium, and it's been working fine, although I've never had to restore more than a few random files. If I have a virus or any other major system screwup, I can restore from an image.

However, if my HD dies, then I need a clone to copy to a new HD. The downside is that a clone also copies all the free space, of which I have huge amounts. Half of my C partition and 2/3 of my D partition are empty and will remain so.

Is there a compromise between these 2?

Click to expand...

You don't need a clone, you can restore an image to a new disk. If you have imaged all the partitions Windows needs to run (In W7's case System & C) then there should be no problem booting Windows from the replacement disk.

RoWin7 said:

I have a question about image vs. clone.

I have close to 60 programs on my C partition, so not easily duplicated from scratch. I've been imaging with Macrium, and it's been working fine, although I've never had to restore more than a few random files. If I have a virus or any other major system screwup, I can restore from an image.

However, if my HD dies, then I need a clone to copy to a new HD. The downside is that a clone also copies all the free space, of which I have huge amounts. Half of my C partition and 2/3 of my D partition are empty and will remain so.

Is there a compromise between these 2?

Click to expand...

While Macrium Reflect has the capability to clone from a larger drive to a smaller one, as long as the amount of data on the source drive will comfortably fit on the smaller drive, restoring from an image is far superior. Plus, if you have room to store them, you can have multiple images on hand so, should the most recent one not meet your needs, you can go back to an earlier one. You will need some kind of rescue medium to restore from an image (I suspect you already have one). A USB thumb drive is far superior to using an optical disk (CD, DVD, etc.).

One thing I've found that really speeds up the process of restoring the System (OS, programs, and games) is to segregate the System from data. This can be done by having them on separate drives or, if limited to only one drive (like my one drive wonders, aka notebooks), on separate partitions (I suspect you are already doing this).

Imaging is essential for restoring System files (cloning can also be used but is not very efficient) but is too time consuming and wastes too much storage space to be efficient for backing up and restoring data. A folder/file syncing program, such as FreeFileSync, is far more efficient for backing up data. When set to Mirror Mode, it will result in what is essentially a clone of the original data drive or partition (unnecessary hidden System files needed for storing even data are not copied since the destination drive already has its own). The really big difference is, after the initial backup, updstes will take far less time than actually cloning. The better folder/file syncing programs also have a feature called Versioning that, when enabled (which I strongly recommend), will send files deleted from the backup drive during an update to a user designated Versioning drive or folder. This protects from losing accidentally deleted files.

RoWin7 said:

However, if my HD dies, then I need a clone to copy to a new HD. The downside is that a clone also copies all the free space, of which I have huge amounts.

Click to expand...

No, a clone is not necessary. An image is a copy of all the used space, and that's all you need for an exact copy of the working system.


I had a dying HDD and made a Macrium image (not a clone) before it failed completely. I restored that to a replacement SSD and lost nothing.

Bree said:

...I had a dying HDD and made a Macrium image (not a clone) before it failed completely. I restored that to a replacement SSD and lost nothing.

Click to expand...

You lucked out on that. The idea is to make an image every time you make a change to the System (change settings, update the System or programs, delete programs, etc.). Then, if you get failure without any warning, you will already have the image you need to recover with.

Quite right Milady. You can never have too many backups.

Lady Fitzgerald said:

You lucked out on that. The idea is to make an image every time you make a change to the System (change settings, update the System or programs, delete programs, etc.)...

Click to expand...

Oh, I do. At least once a month after Patch Tuesday. But I had just set up a Hyper-V VM on this machine when I discovered its HDD had hundreds of reallocated sectors.



Rather than loose that work, I tried (and succeeded) in making an error free image. By the time I had finished the reallocated sector count had more than doubled so yes, I was lucky - but not entirely unprepared

Bree said:

Oh, I do. At least once a month after Patch Tuesday. But I had just set up a Hyper-V VM on this machine when I discovered its HDD had hundreds of reallocated sectors.



Rather than loose that work, I tried (and succeeded) in making an error free image. By the time I had finished the reallocated sector count had more than doubled so yes, I was lucky - but not entirely unprepared

Click to expand...

Thanks, people. I wonder why all the backup programs offer cloning when it has so many disadvantages.

I've always had data on a separate partition and in a separate image. I have very few changes to the C (sys+prog) partition, so don't have to make new images of C often. Then I also have a 2nd computer with identical programs and data that I use if i'm repairing this one. So I think I'm covered.

Tell me if I misinterpreted something I read on this site some time ago. Or maybe I misread it:
You can make an image of Computer 1 system +programs and use it to install the system and programs on Computer 2 if you include the drivers from Computer 2.

This would go against everything I've ever learned about setting up a new machine.

RoWin7 said:

Tell me if I misinterpreted something I read on this site some time ago. Or maybe I misread it:
You can make an image of Computer 1 system +programs and use it to install the system and programs on Computer 2 if you include the drivers from Computer 2.

This would go against everything I've ever learned about setting up a new machine.

Click to expand...

The paid versions of Macrium have a re-deployment feature which adapts an image to new hardware. Re-deploying to new hardware - KnowledgeBase v7 - Macrium Reflect Knowledgebase - KnowledgeBase v7 - Macrium Reflect Knowledgebase

Depending on how different the hardware is, it might be necessary to "adjust to new hardware".

I think paragon were the first to introduce "adjust to new hardware" module many years ago. Most imaging programs can do it nowadays. Usually it requires the paid version for that functionality.

It is available free in the giveaway version O&O diskimage 12 Pro.

Registration for your FREE license of O&O DiskImage 12

Download

RoWin7 said:

Tell me if I misinterpreted something I read on this site some time ago. Or maybe I misread it:
You can make an image of Computer 1 system +programs and use it to install the system and programs on Computer 2 if you include the drivers from Computer 2.

This would go against everything I've ever learned about setting up a new machine.

Click to expand...

RoWin7 said:

Thanks, people. I wonder why all the backup programs offer cloning when it has so many disadvantages.

I've always had data on a separate partition and in a separate image. I have very few changes to the C (sys+prog) partition, so don't have to make new images of C often. Then I also have a 2nd computer with identical programs and data that I use if i'm repairing this one. So I think I'm covered.

Click to expand...

Cloning is a very useful feature. It's best used for creating duplicates of drives or, depending on the software used, duplicate partitions. An example is when replacing an otherwise perfectly good HDD with an SSD. Or when upgrading from one drive to another, better one (if the replacement is larger, it may be necessary to expand the new partition after cloning). Cloning can be used for backing up a computer but, since each time you update, you are copying over the entire drive or partition, it takes far longer. Also, unless you put umpteen partitions on the backup drive, you can have only one backup clone on a drive whereas it's easy to have multiple images.

RoWin7 said:

Tell me if I misinterpreted something I read on this site some time ago. Or maybe I misread it:
You can make an image of Computer 1 system +programs and use it to install the system and programs on Computer 2 if you include the drivers from Computer 2.

This would go against everything I've ever learned about setting up a new machine.

Click to expand...

As Kado897 pointed out, Macrium Reflect has a redeployment feature that allows an image from one computer to be used on another one. I've never used it but, from what I've read, it has a fair amount of success. Generally, when moving to a new machine, it's better to use a fresh install.

I'm still using an older paid version of Macrium Reflect. Back then, redeployment was a feature available only on the paid version. I only recommend the free version of Macrium Reflect due the incompetence, laziness, or both of the website designers of (not so)Cleverbridge, the company that Paramount (the company that makes Macrium Reflect) uses to handle their payments,

SIW2 said:

Depending on how different the hardware is, it might be necessary to "adjust to new hardware".

I think paragon were the first to introduce "adjust to new hardware" module many years ago. Most imaging programs can do it nowadays. Usually it requires the paid version for that functionality.

It is available free in the giveaway version O&O diskimage 12 Pro.

Registration for your FREE license of O&O DiskImage 12

Download

Click to expand...

I would be willing to pay Macrium $70 to set up another computer. The customizations and ironing out of problems of the system and each program drives me nuts.
OTOH, if I use O&O, I first make the image in that program instead of Macrium?

I can set up one of 2 spare machines. One has an SSD, one doesn't.

Lady Fitzgerald said:

As Kado897 pointed out, Macrium Reflect has a redeployment feature that allows an image from one computer to be used on another one. I've never used it but, from what I've read, it has a fair amount of success. Generally, when moving to a new machine, it's better to use a fresh install.

I'm still using an older paid version of Macrium Reflect. Back then, redeployment was a feature available only on the paid version. I only recommend the free version of Macrium Reflect due the incompetence, laziness, or both of the website designers of (not so)Cleverbridge, the company that Paramount (the company that makes Macrium Reflect) uses to handle their payments,

Click to expand...

It's still only on the paid version, just checked. I might consider the O&O.