3rd party firewall drivers conflicts  

Hello. I have a thread posted in the crashes and debugging forum, but thought this forum might also be appropriate.

I am using a new dell computer with windows 7 64bit. I have had it about 10 days. Everything is running very smoothly except for trying install a firewall. The 2nd day I had it I tried installing a 3rd party firewall and the installation went fine and told me to restart the machine. When I did it started shutting down windows and then starting it back up....then all of a sudden a BSOD flashed and I was taken to the screen with options to either start in safe mode or start normally. I tried to start normally but the same thing happened so I booted in safe mode and did a system restore and then they computer booted up normally. I thought this was a fluke so I tried a different firewall and the same thing happened. I have since tried 3 different firewalls and this happens every time.

The first part of the BSOD when it occurs says this DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL
stop:0x000000D1

I have tried to zip up the minidump folder but even though it is set to save minidump files the folder remains empty and won't let me zip.

From what I have been reading I think I am having some kind of conflict with the 3rd party kernel drivers these firewalls are trying to install. Why I am having this problem.....I do not know....nor do I know how to fix it. Of course I could be totally wrong.

I have successfully been using windows 7 firewall control plus, which does not install any 3rd party kernel drivers, without any problems. So, I guess I will stick with that unless I can figure out why I am having conflicts with the 3rd party kernel drivers and how to resolve those problems.

Does anyone have any ideas on how to solve this issue? Thanks to anyone who replies.

nikonmama said:

Does anyone have any ideas on how to solve this issue? Thanks to anyone who replies.

It's highly unlikely that multiple 3rd-party firewall drivers would all happen to develop similar crash-inducing bugs at the same time. My guess is that there's something else that's fundamentally wrong on your machine, though minidumps may not be enough to find it through debugging.

It's worth a shot though. I understand you're having some difficulties attaching the minidumps, though I'm not clear on the exact reasons. Here's one way to do it:

https://www.sevenforums.com/crash-loc...d-problem.html

As a suggestion, it might be better to continue this discussion in your original thread, simply as a courtesy to the others who've been helping.

H2SO4 said:

nikonmama said:

Does anyone have any ideas on how to solve this issue? Thanks to anyone who replies.

It's highly unlikely that multiple 3rd-party firewall drivers would all happen to develop similar crash-inducing bugs at the same time. My guess is that there's something else that's fundamentally wrong on your machine, though minidumps may not be enough to find it through debugging.

It's worth a shot though. I understand you're having some difficulties attaching the minidumps, though I'm not clear on the exact reasons. Here's one way to do it:

https://www.sevenforums.com/crash-loc...d-problem.html

As a suggestion, it might be better to continue this discussion in your original thread, simply as a courtesy to the others who've been helping.

I started a new thread b/c I stopped getting any replies despite several updates. I also thought I might get more support on this forum b/c much of the technical support I have received indicates a driver conflict.

I know how to attach a minidump. I am not having problems with that. the problem is that the file is empty. When I go to zip it it says that it cannot be zipped b/c it is empty.

I am not having any other issue at all with this machine. I debated taking it to best buy to have them look at it and potentially exchange it, but I decided against that. So, I am hoping this is just a driver problem and not something major. Other than being unable to install a firewall I have had no issues or crashes whatsoever and all checks are turning up no problems on this machine.

If starting a new thread was a mistake than a mod can just delete this.

nikonmama said:

I know how to attach a minidump. I am not having problems with that. the problem is that the file is empty. When I go to zip it it says that it cannot be zipped b/c it is empty.

Are the minidump files themselves showing up as being 0 bytes in size when you examine the contents of \Windows\Minidump? If you open them in Notepad, just for laughs, are they actually empty?

If not, it's more likely that there's something wrong with the copy.

nikonmama said:

If starting a new thread was a mistake than a mod can just delete this.

"Mistake" sounds heavy. I just thought it might be best to continue on the same thread :)

I don't know whether I'll be able to help you, but the problem is interesting and that intrigues me, so I'd like to try.

H2SO4 said:

Are the minidump files themselves showing up as being 0 bytes in size when you examine the contents of \Windows\Minidump? If you open them in Notepad, just for laughs, are they actually empty?

If not, it's more likely that there's something wrong with the copy.

when I go to c/windows/minidump.....it is empty. there is nothing to open. The entire folder's properties say's 0 files, 0 folders, 0 bytes.

I have tried searching for .dmp files and only 1 shows up for a video editing software plugin that wouldn't install.

nikonmama said:

when I go to c/windows/minidump.....it is empty. there is nothing to open. The entire folder's properties say's 0 files, 0 folders, 0 bytes.

I have tried searching for .dmp files and only 1 shows up for a video editing software plugin that wouldn't install.

No need to search. If they (minidumps) existed, they'd be right in that location. The fact that you're experiencing BSODs without minidumps means either:

a) [Unlikely] the crash itself occurs in such a way as to knock out the OS's ability to write to the disk at the crucial time

b) there isn't a sufficiently large pagefile on the boot partition.

What's your pagefile layout like? You'll need say 1GB+ worth of pagefile on the partition where \Windows lives for dumps to be generated.

H2SO4 said:

What's your pagefile layout like? You'll need say 1GB+ worth of pagefile on the partition where \Windows lives for dumps to be generated.

You have officially gone over my head LOL. I have no idea what any of that means.

I don't know if this helps but when the bs crash happens it is as windows is starting back up when I prefer a restart to complete the firewall installation. The only way to get started back up is to go into safe mode, do a system restore to just before the fw installation and then everything is up and running normally again.

nikonmama said:

H2SO4 said:

What's your pagefile layout like? You'll need say 1GB+ worth of pagefile on the partition where \Windows lives for dumps to be generated.

You have officially gone over my head LOL. I have no idea what any of that means.

Sorry. In order to generate memory dumps when a BSOD occurs, Windows needs a pagefile on the same partition as the one where the \Windows folder resides, and that pagefile needs to be 1GB in size or preferably even bigger.

Does your machine currently have a 1GB or bigger pagefile on the \Windows partition?

nikonmama said:

I don't know if this helps but when the bs crash happens it is as windows is starting back up when I prefer a restart to complete the firewall installation. The only way to get started back up is to go into safe mode, do a system restore to just before the fw installation and then everything is up and running normally again.

Thanks, but it doesn't really help, other than to suggest that the symptom is so severe that you don't get very far at all. The vast majority of BSODs require memory dumps for deterministic troubleshooting.

H2SO4 said:

nikonmama said:

H2SO4 said:

What's your pagefile layout like? You'll need say 1GB+ worth of pagefile on the partition where \Windows lives for dumps to be generated.

You have officially gone over my head LOL. I have no idea what any of that means.

Sorry. In order to generate memory dumps when a BSOD occurs, Windows needs a pagefile on the same partition as the one where the \Windows folder resides, and that pagefile needs to be 1GB in size or preferably even bigger.

Does your machine currently have a 1GB or bigger pagefile on the \Windows partition?

I am sorry, I still don't understand how to figure that out. Please excuse me, but I really have terribly limited technical knowledge of computers. I won't be around the new computer until later this afternoon but I will try to see if I can figure that out.

nikonmama said:

H2SO4 said:

I don't know if this helps but when the bs crash happens it is as windows is starting back up when I prefer a restart to complete the firewall installation. The only way to get started back up is to go into safe mode, do a system restore to just before the fw installation and then everything is up and running normally again.

Thanks, but it doesn't really help, other than to suggest that the symptom is so severe that you don't get very far at all. The vast majority of BSODs require memory dumps for deterministic troubleshooting.

I wish I knew for sure if this problem is something that is going to cause problems later or is just limited to trying to install a firewall. I have been looking into this feverishly since I bought the computer and set it up on 11/1. I have talked to dell repeated times but they insist it is not a hardware problem and that is the only thing covered under the limited warranty. They insist it is some sort of software driver problem, but won't help unless I pay for software support. They said I either need software support from them or from Microsoft, but with both would have to pay and I just can't.

I still have until tomorrow if if I want to take the processor into best buy and have their techs look at to see if they can either resolve the issue or deem that it needs to be exchanged. I am just hesitant to do that b/c other than the firewall issue I have had no problems. And if I had never even tried to install a firewall in the first place I wouldn't have even had this problem.

I am sorry to vent. I am just really frustrated and can't decide if I should keep looking into getting this resolved or just let it go. I do appreciate your assistance!