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Windows 7: In defence of Vista

17 Jul 2009   #21
sjaak327

Windows Vista, Server 2008, Leopard, Suse
 
 

"It's certainly a security risk to give highly inexperienced people administrator rights but that has got nothing to do with real OS security. It's certainly dead easy to bring down any OS in existence if you have sufficient rights, and it always will be."


Yes, however the difference is that under Vista, you can run as admin (still the default, actually still the default on 7 as well), and still be much more secure, courtesy of UAC and file and registry virtualisation.

It does make a striking difference. People who disable it because it's annoying, are for a big deal, taking that advantage away.

I am truly interested in know what you consider a more insecure OS developed by Microsoft, that has an equal high number of vulnerabilities and succeeded attacks in the same amount of time. Along the lifecycle of NT, surely XP must be it.


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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17 Jul 2009   #22
nolabar10der

Windows 7
 
 

Vista will always receive better marks from the geekier among us than in the 'general public.' Just look at the two most guilty reasons for Vista hate:

Drivers. For reasons I will never understand, many people assume that a camera or a printer should work through magic and unicorns living in a USB port. When it doesn't, guess who takes the blame? The manufacturer for not providing a Vista driver (often intentionally)? Yeah, right. The user, for not so much as bothering to look around for one? Nope. The clear culprit here is Vista, despite everyone in the developed world having known that it was coming out, and maybe you guys should have made sure that your products were supported.

The second and probably biggest culprit for the hate IS Microsoft's fault. Minimum requirements. Sure, Vista would run on 512 RAM, just as I could technically function on a bag of Skittles for the weekend. Hundreds of thousands if not millions of people purchased Celeron laptops or desks with a half-gig of memory and then had the audacity to say that Vista sucked, without considering so much as a $30 stick of RAM. Again, this is directly tied to MS, and of course, the manufacturers who knew better but didn't see fit to bump their specs just a tad, if only to give even budget consumers a decent experience with their product. Lol, yeah that was gonna happen.

And since we're here, a third big reason exists: Just bad PR. How many people have you met that claim, "Dude, Vista sucks," yet have never actually used it? I'm not in IT, hell, I don't even work in a Best Buy - and I've met tens of these people. "Well, have you tried it?"

"No."
"Would you like to?"
"Well, sure, I guess, but it sucks?"

...sigh
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17 Jul 2009   #23
Jon55

Windows 7 64-bit (7127) & Mac OS X 10.5.7
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by FXDriverGuy View Post
Well, I was well into my studies to get a computer engineering degree when MSDOS 4 came out (and a computer enthusiast since the ZX Spectrum days) and I can tell you that your statements are grossly inaccurate.


XP the most insecure OS ever developed by Microsoft? Sure, that's why techies and businesses alike are still refusing to "upgrade" although practically forced at gun point by now. The fact is that XP is the longest used OS version in the history of OS versions. Sure this means it still has fixes coming out but that's only because it is still being used, a lot. 100% bug free softwareis so legendary a tool as the philosopher's stone.


Windows 95 based on MS-DOS? That's something not even worth arguing. But what makes only an OS based on NT.. an OS (which we can then consider to be insecure), in any case?
XP is a dinosaur of an OS. It was great in its day, sure, but its day is LONG gone. Anyone claiming it's faster or more stable than Vista/7 is kidding themselves.
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17 Jul 2009   #24
FXDriverGuy

Windows 7
 
 

I'll just use a Wikipedia quote

"Microsoft stopped providing security updates for Windows NT 4.0 Workstation on 30 June 2004 and Windows NT 4.0 Server on 31 December 2004, due to major security flaws including MS03-010, which according to Microsoft could not be patched without significant changes to the core operating system. "

This discussion, although Antman really spiced it up, has no real point. So I'll just say that all my techie friends dual-boot XP and a Linux flavor and won't touch Vista with a stick, and leave it at that. And yes it's still anecdotal evidence but I do have many techie friends
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17 Jul 2009   #25
FXDriverGuy

Windows 7
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Jon55 View Post
its day is LONG gone.
As a final note, some w3schools OS statistics for June 2009

WinXP: 66,9%, Vista: 18.3% (http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_os.asp)

Note that Windows 7 already had by June a market share similar to the first few months of Vista on the shelves.
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17 Jul 2009   #26
sjaak327

Windows Vista, Server 2008, Leopard, Suse
 
 

Yeah they might be technie friends, but I doubt they know anything about security. Your first quote, regarding NT, please show me what major attack brought down NT 4.0 in drones, in the same was as attacks in 2001, 2002 did to XP ?

Nt 4.0 released in 1996 was simply end of support.
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17 Jul 2009   #27
Antman

 

That's a spicy meatball.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Jon55 View Post
XP is a dinosaur of an OS. It was great in its day, sure, but its day is LONG gone. Anyone claiming it's faster or more stable than Vista/7 is kidding themselves.
Neither you, nor our drink slingin' friend from "N'awlins" truly understands the customer base or the MS business model, at least your comments reflect this. One article from millions that may shed some light on this.

With the possible exception of Windows ME, MS has never released an OS product with the residential/casual user/gamer et al as the target market. That demographic set has been pulled along in the wake, rolled up in the tide. Regardless of packaging labels or version names, every version of DOS and Windows, OS/2 and even Xenix was intended for business consumption - with or without a domain server.

And business stays with what works well enough. A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow.
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17 Jul 2009   #28
matt_0978

Windows 7 Ultimate 64Bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Antman View Post
In defense of Vista... Oops, I missed my block.

I just see this from a business man's perspective. As an OS, Vista is what Vista is. As a product offering, Vista was not unlike New Coke.

My Vista DVD set is the most expensive item I never used. Unless you consider the '93 RX-7 I bought for Cailin, a month before she dumped me.

i bought an 80gb ps3 thinking it would play ps2 games, that was a waste of £250 bucks.

btw antman, i'm curious:
f∆=∑∆ + (c-1)
wossat all about? just gibberish?
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17 Jul 2009   #29
Antman

 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by matt0978 View Post
btw antman, i'm curious:
f∆=∑∆ + (c-1)

wossat all about? just gibberish?
Thank you for finding my typo. It should read f∆=∑∆ - (c+1) I corrected it.

I can't place the actual formula because the equation images are not supported in that placeholder.

Basically, the function of change is the summation of change, not including my experience. I am the collapse of the wave function.

i=am squared (i=am2, no superscript available) is a reference to Jaynesian bicameral theory.
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17 Jul 2009   #30
mez4junk

OS X Leopard
 
 

Vista was a bloated, resource-hog piece of crap.
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 In defence of Vista




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