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Windows 7: What don't you like about Windows 7?

03 May 2010   #1591
Wreck

CommonOS (Linux Distro)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by WindowsStar View Post

I have 3 books for you to read that will help you better understand Windows 7.

1) Mastering Microsoft Windows 7 Administration, Sybex ISBN: 9780470559840
2) Windows 7 Resource Kit, Microsoft Press ISBN: 9780735627700
3) Windows 7 Inside Out, Microsoft Press ISBN: 9780735626652

Edit: BTW I own all three and they are very good books.
So in order to use Windows 7 you say people have to read several hefty books?

Ok there are a few problems here, I'm just not sure I have time to point them all out.


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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03 May 2010   #1592
WindowsStar

Windows 7 Enterprise (x64); Windows Server 2008 R2 (x64)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by WindowsStar View Post

I have 3 books for you to read that will help you better understand Windows 7.

1) Mastering Microsoft Windows 7 Administration, Sybex ISBN: 9780470559840
2) Windows 7 Resource Kit, Microsoft Press ISBN: 9780735627700
3) Windows 7 Inside Out, Microsoft Press ISBN: 9780735626652

Edit: BTW I own all three and they are very good books.
So in order to use Windows 7 you say people have to read several hefty books?

Ok there are a few problems here, I'm just not sure I have time to point them all out.
Nope, a 2 year old can use Windows 7, but if someone insists on changing everything, taking ownership of everything and modifying permissions then they need to do some reading to understand how things work.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
03 May 2010   #1593
CobaltKairi

Windows 7 32-Bit
 
 

Negative: User Account Control. You have it on, it bugs the heck out of you. You turn it off, your computer bugs the heck out of you telling you that it's off.
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04 May 2010   #1594
logicearth

Windows 10 Pro (x64)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by CobaltKairi View Post
Negative: User Account Control. You have it on, it bugs the heck out of you. You turn it off, your computer bugs the heck out of you telling you that it's off.
It bugs YOU. Does not bug everyone. I have it set to max and it does not bug me.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
04 May 2010   #1595
Wreck

CommonOS (Linux Distro)
 
 

[QUOTE=WindowsStar;717378]
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by logicearth View Post
Windows 7 works correctly out of the box. 99% of the time it is the USER that does not understand how junction points or permissions work!
I can't say I really agree with this. Junction points are very nearly a useful feature. However, Microsoft is still too frightened of looking like *nix so they cripple features that would otherwise be very handy.

Why isn't there a very simple method of creating Junction points by the user? I mean without having to use the command line.

Why are Shortcuts still around? They are better served as links...errr, I mean Junctions. When I drag something to another folder and select to "create a Shortcut" it would be better for everyone if it were "create a Junction." Why is MS afraid of doing that?

Why do I have to run an admin shell to create a Junction? Especially when I want to create a Junction of my own folder to another folder of my own?

Why do they make some very obvious Junction points hidden and make the permissions such that the user cannot use them from Explorer?

It appears that Microsoft went a bit crazy with the file system around Vista. "We are moving 'Documents & Settings' to 'Users' but we want you to be able to get there the old way for compatibility, but we don't want USERS to get there that way because we are so embarassed by the horrid method we used. Also we are changing all of the 'My *' folders to get rid of 'My '. Except that now they are back in Windows 7 because it was too confusing. Confused yet?"

Yes.

It would be handy if they would get a designer to make these decisions rather than having a vote every time a new release of Windows comes out. "Who wants to go back to the old folder names? Lets see a show of hands."

At least all of the user data has migrated to the Users own directory. Except that some of the users data is in hidden folders and some of it still doesn't belong to the user.

Confused yet?

Of course you are, it was designed to be confusing.

I mean MS even tries to confuse themselves. I doubt half of them could tell you if My Documents is a junction to Documents or the other way around. And I defy anyone to explain why "My Pictures" (or Music or Videos) are junctions inside of "Documents" back to folders called "Pictures" outside of "Documents"
My System SpecsSystem Spec
04 May 2010   #1596
Kari

 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by whs View Post
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Rickkins View Post
Libraries....and windows explorer in general...
Hmm, I think that the libraries are very handy. They allow me to group files/folders from all over my disks/partitions without moving them. I even have Vista folders in my Win7 libraries. Thus they are always in sync.
+1

The first new thing in Seven I almost fell in love was Libraries. Practical, easy to use and understand.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by CobaltKairi View Post
Negative: User Account Control. You have it on, it bugs the heck out of you. You turn it off, your computer bugs the heck out of you telling you that it's off.
I have nightmares when I think Seven without UAC. I thank Gods from every possible religion that Microsoft is finally getting there to simplify sys admins job and making it more difficult for a user to make a big mess.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by logicearth View Post
It bugs YOU. Does not bug everyone. I have it set to max and it does not bug me.
+1, as written above.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
04 May 2010   #1597
WindowsStar

Windows 7 Enterprise (x64); Windows Server 2008 R2 (x64)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by WindowsStar View Post
Windows 7 works correctly out of the box. 99% of the time it is the USER that does not understand how junction points or permissions work!
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post

I can't say I really agree with this. Junction points are very nearly a useful feature. However, Microsoft is still too frightened of looking like *nix so they cripple features that would otherwise be very handy.

Why isn't there a very simple method of creating Junction points by the user? I mean without having to use the command line.


You keep comparing Windows to *IX so what is wrong with the command line. Many many things are done from the command line in *IX, if fact that is the only way much of anything could be done until about 5 years ago when the *IX community started trying to make things better for common users.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post

Why are Shortcuts still around? They are better served as links...errr, I mean Junctions. When I drag something to another folder and select to "create a Shortcut" it would be better for everyone if it were "create a Junction." Why is MS afraid of doing that?


MS is not afraid of that, it is just they have a log history of doing things this way and a huge user base that knows how they work, is it the best way maybe not but that is how it works.

There are many things I don't like about *IX but I understand that things may have been done one way long ago and now we are stuck with them this way now.


Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post

Why do I have to run an admin shell to create a Junction? Especially when I want to create a Junction of my own folder to another folder of my own?


What? Many things are like this in *IX you need to use SU or DOSU to get some system wide change done. This is just like *IX so I have no idea why you would even bring up the question.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post

Why do they make some very obvious Junction points hidden and make the permissions such that the user cannot use them from Explorer?


Simple, because the basic end user does not need to know they are there nor do they need to work or use them. Since you clearly want to be a Super User on Windows you need to take the time to read, learn and understand how things work, just as you would if you use *IX.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post

It appears that Microsoft went a bit crazy with the file system around Vista. "We are moving 'Documents & Settings' to 'Users' but we want you to be able to get there the old way for compatibility, but we don't want USERS to get there that way because we are so embarassed by the horrid method we used. Also we are changing all of the 'My *' folders to get rid of 'My '. Except that now they are back in Windows 7 because it was too confusing. Confused yet?"


Ok, the whole "My" stuff was that an MS mistake, well I think many in the IT community would say oh yeah! But it was a great marketing idea and for the standard user it gave them a sense of the computer being personal.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post

It would be handy if they would get a designer to make these decisions rather than having a vote every time a new release of Windows comes out. "Who wants to go back to the old folder names? Lets see a show of hands."


MS used a lot of resources and feed back for Windows 7 if I remember the last posted stats showed that they have a huge end user satisfaction approximately 92%. That is amazing if you ask me. Yes there will be the few out there that you can never make happy.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post

At least all of the user data has migrated to the Users own directory. Except that some of the users data is in hidden folders and some of it still doesn't belong to the user.


Again, this is because you have not taken the time to learn how Windows 7 works, once you take the time you will completely understand why, how and the train of thought behind this.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
04 May 2010   #1598
logicearth

Windows 10 Pro (x64)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Wreck View Post
Why isn't there a very simple method of creating Junction points by the user? I mean without having to use the command line.
There is a third-party extension just for that.

Quote:
Why are Shortcuts still around? They are better served as links...errr, I mean Junctions.
Shortcuts and Junctions are two different things. Lets give an example, you want to put a shortcut of "something.exe" on your desktop. Using a Shortcut "something.exe" will launch in the context of its installation directory "C:\Program Files\SomeVendor". Using a Junction (In the case of files, Symlink) "something.exe" would be seen as an actual executable residing in "C:\Users\[username]\Desktop". You will find this does not work. Shortcuts and Junctions ARE NOT interchangeable.

Quote:
Why do I have to run an admin shell to create a Junction?
You don't. Only creating Symlinks require a Administrator power.

Quote:
Why do they make some very obvious Junction points hidden and make the permissions such that the user cannot use them from Explorer?
See the last link in my signature. The part to note:
Quote:
Of course, a new opportunity can create a new problem: An application that isn’t familiar with junctions may get stuck in an infinite loop when it attempts to perform a recursive directory-tree walk. To prevent this, the compatibility junctions permit directory traversal but explicitly deny List contents permission: If you try to navigate to these folders from Explorer or the command prompt, you’ll get an Access denied error.
Quote:
Also we are changing all of the 'My *' folders to get rid of 'My '. Except that now they are back in Windows 7 because it was too confusing. Confused yet?"
The "My " part of the folder names are just visual, the actual folders names are minus the "My " part.

Quote:
And I defy anyone to explain why "My Pictures" (or Music or Videos) are junctions inside of "Documents" back to folders called "Pictures" outside of "Documents"
Pictures, Music, Video used to reside in Document in previous version from Windows XP's era. To keep applications that have hard coded these locations they are transparently redirected to the real locations. This applies to all Junctions that are existing by default.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
04 May 2010   #1599
Rhyous

Windows 7 64 bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by logicearth View Post
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Vertex View Post
things still get slow because of registry errors, faulty files, folders and settings that are left over by removed applications that maybe risky to remove using registry cleaners. So I agree with some of the others.
None of those cause the computer to slow down. Running applications cause the computer to slow down. Unused entries in the Registry do not cause any delay. Junk files on the HDD do not cause the computer to slow down unless it is so full that free space is scarce.

Why this myth is still alive baffles me.
Wow! Have you ever done support on Windows? You ever had something that should be instant, like 1 ms, but it takes 10 or 50 seconds and your remove some registry keys and it takes 1 milisecond.

Windows 7 still has explorer. People spend a lot of time in explorer. Explorer is still single threaded. A lot of things are done in explorer and explore does slow down with registry bloat/corruption.

Explorer still sucks in Windows 7 and is still susceptible to slow downs due to registry key errors.

Also, there are lot of processes that have timeouts, such as searching for a UNC share, and guess what happens when you have to wait for such a timeout because of a bad registry key that points to a mapped drive that no longer exists. Well, using a single threaded application, the app shuts down until the timeout expires.

So why you call something a myth that tech support engineers see all the time is beyond me.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
04 May 2010   #1600
ACR731

Win 7 Pro x64
 
 

After reading some of the responses on this thread I am beginning to wonder if those who are so adamant in their support and defense of Windows 7 are Microsoft employees. Why else would someone attack people like they have been doing here.
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Closed Thread

 What don't you like about Windows 7?




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