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Windows 7: No end in sight

06 Oct 2017   #1

Desk1 7 Home Prem / Desk2 10 Pro / Main lap Asus ROG 10 Pro 2 laptop Toshiba 7 Pro Asus P2520 7 & 10
No end in sight

I have just been reading about the 8th gen Intel processors (?Coffeelake) and the Z370 chipsets and I am really lost for any hope of ever doing another build as any future proofing has gone out of the window (no pun intended) and it certainly makes for what little pleasure we/I have enjoyed over the last few years since the Sandy and Ivy Bridge builds has followed that hope down the insatiable gurgler of whatever Intel and Microsoft are planning.
To me personally Windows for for one has lurched from one good build to another XP > Vista > 7 > 8.1 > 10 and now in my mind is lost in a system that is not enjoyable anymore partly because a lot of the control that we had in 7 has now been taken away in favour of app based models of the OS which to a fairly simple minded and semi savvy person such as I have some degree of difficulty in taking part in any forum for example. The Seven Forum it appeared to me a happy and pleasant place to be able to take some degree of participation whereas the Ten Forum I am finding bogged down in tech talk that the system is built around it's (to me) convoluted GUI's and settings.
All in all it gives me the impression that unless one is or as some formal training or study of IT matters it only leaves open the door of getting help with the 10 system when I run up against some problem I cannot figure out again that is proving more often than not.
But this is just my own personally feelings on computing both as an enjoyable and useful service/activity and I have heard from many that I am in contact with through various means that they also feel the same way.

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06 Oct 2017   #2

Windows 10 64 bit

There will always be a "new improved" whatever. Its "Marketing 101". I built a new desktop for my recording studio (finished it the first of December last year). Its a Z170 with an i7 6700K. Its already 2 versions behind and the "9" series is looming. Unless you are a developer or a hobbyist that is flush with money we will never keep up.

As far as the OS, its not just Microsoft. I have an Apple iPad ("new" iPad) and Apple has obsoleted it as iOS9 is as far as it can accept. Its not compatible with iOS10 or the new/current iOS11. Several of the Apps I have on the iPad are not no longer useable as they have been updated for iOS11 and are not backward compatible with iOS9.
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06 Oct 2017   #3

Desk1 7 Home Prem / Desk2 10 Pro / Main lap Asus ROG 10 Pro 2 laptop Toshiba 7 Pro Asus P2520 7 & 10

I hear what you are saying Jack and you are right but it is to exponential growth of the tech that I think is in part way killing the experience for me. I mean not only are the gens spiraling up but so are the costs ie I saw GPU's advertised just in the last few days at a sale price of $999!!

Now I don't know about you but that being the case any future build for me is out of the question and with the OS Microsoft is putting out now and the cutting back on what you can control on your own machine that you have paid for and the software of course and it could be seen to becoming like a police state where eventually we shall have no control over much at all.

It is very sad it has got to this and I see those around me having their lives driven by the need to have the latest tech and their lives ruled by the need to have what the large corporations beit Microsoft or Apple etc etc say they need and are having to have. Just look at the light speed that mobile phone tech is going through now I have a 10 month old Google Pixel phone and it has been superseded already and I would hazard a guess has been in the "wings" way before now.

Well for what it is worth I used to enjoy computing and everything that went with it especially in this forum and all the really pleasant folks like yourself that I have met during that time. Problem is like I mentioned in my first post I just find the 10 forum overwhelming and very "clinical" for want of a better term.
Probably just as well I have taken up trying out acrylic painting after many years doing my water colours - at least they cannot control that - or can they
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06 Oct 2017   #4

Linux Mint 18.2 xfce 64-bit (VMWare host) / Windows 8.1 Pro 32-bit (VMWare guest)

Have you tried Linux? I have tried both Ubuntu (and its variants) and Mint, and I really like Linux Mint. With the xfce interface, it is close enough to Windows so that there isn't a big learning curve. Also, it took me some time, but I have become pretty proficient with Libre Office. Just about everything I need works very well in Linux Mint, although there are a few things which don't work: one thing is that I haven't figured out how to get my scanner working. (I will soon!)

Linux Mint 32-bit runs like a champ on my 1-1/2 year old Dell (Haswell CPU) computer.

I am fed up with Microsoft for the same reasons you are, and so I decided to make the move to Linux now, so that I would be proficient enough with it so as to be able to abandon Microsoft when Windows 7 support ends in 2020. I set up a dual-boot on my computer -- I have three hard drives: one for Linux, one for Windows 7, and one for data; and I have a SATA power switch, so that I can easily power down and switch to the other OS, while my data drive is always on and available with both OSs. I rarely go into Windows these days, because I'm just about at the point where I can say "adios" to Microsoft.

I'm sure you have tried Linux. If not, then trying it out will be a welcome diversion for you from the hassles of Microsoft.
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06 Oct 2017   #5

Desk1 7 Home Prem / Desk2 10 Pro / Main lap Asus ROG 10 Pro 2 laptop Toshiba 7 Pro Asus P2520 7 & 10

Yes Jim I have tried the Linux line up and I really am a fan of Ubuntu as I find the terminal stuff in Mint a little overpowering and Zorin well it fell off the perch when I tried updating it taking with it a dual boot 7 and to be honest it looked good at first try but the constant updating was a tad nerve racking.

The Ubuntu I stumbled over a few years ago and have used it to unlock drives for data on family machines where they have forgotten the password after long spells of no use. I just like the GUI of it and shortly if I can get my tester machine ( a no name build with a Q9650 core) going again I might leave it as only Ubuntu though a dual boot with the 7 I have the machines copy might be a good option.

Right now my Sandy Bridge is in 10 mode and my Ivy Bridge well is taking a vacation somewhere in the outer solar system I think LOL!! But I still have my sons old bulid in 7 as is one of my laptops runnign a dual 10/7 boot the one I use most is in 10 mode and frankly I wish I had the nerve to dual boot this one as I use it the most now.

It is just right now I am a bit disenchanted with computing because of what is going on like I said I find this forum really friendly after many years of being on it and well the 10 forum is like I said a tad clinical for my sort of usage. So hence my get back to painting is a) not as expensive and b) to be honest more enjoyable.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
06 Oct 2017   #6
Microsoft MVP

Windows 10 Pro x64 ; Xubuntu x64

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by ICIT2LOL View Post
I really am a fan of Ubuntu as I find the terminal stuff in Mint a little overpowering
Its the same command line/terminal in both.
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07 Oct 2017   #7

Desk1 7 Home Prem / Desk2 10 Pro / Main lap Asus ROG 10 Pro 2 laptop Toshiba 7 Pro Asus P2520 7 & 10

Well I sort of knew that Colin but I just meant the GUI in Ubuntu is preferential for me I know there are certain things that have to be done via the terminal and it is just the way things are right now with Windows it has in my mind as per 10 become as I stated quite a clinical environment and one that I don't really feel that comfortable with as it was in 7 because it certainly seems to have less of the friendly banter as I guess a lot of the old crew have gone over to 10 while still keeping in touch with 7. It is just shame things have gone the way they have for us semi to loosely savvy people such as I as it does appear to me it needs an in depth knowledge now to take part in anything much. The party is over for me at least and quite a few of my friends too.

In any case I just use the machine in the main now for emails and purchasing banking etc my time is now more into my painting. I also often wonder what some of the members who have passed ie Gary would have made of it as I looked to him as sort of mentor when I first started getting into the swing of things. But I suppose all good things must come to an end as is oft said.
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07 Oct 2017   #8

Windows 10 64 bit

I've worked with computers, starting in 1961, and that was my career. Change was the one thing that was always happening. Whether with an Operating System (Supervisor as IBM called the mainframe OS) or with hardware or with software or with procedures. Anyone in the industry just accepted it and went on with their business. I see no difference today with PC's.

However, most businesses do not immediately upgrade every time something new comes along. Its too costly to the business and the reason there are many, today, still using XP or Win 7. Along with the cost of the new hardware and software, there is the cost to retrain employees, including the loss production while the employee is in training. After a couple of years of Win 10, businesses are slowly migrating to the new system (and upgrading hardware) but it will be years before they are completely off of old OS' and hardware.

Just because there is a new model CPU or new peripheral interface or new OS version, that does not mean I must immediately buy or download it. I don't plan on upgrading what I built in November of last year for at least 3 or 4 years. I'll still be relevant.

Don't let it get you down. Just go on with what you have and when you must upgrade then do it - whether tomorrow, next year or whenever. Many are either afraid or don't like Win 10 because of change. Because of my computer background and attending "managing change" seminars I'm able to cope with it.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
07 Oct 2017   #9

Desk1 7 Home Prem / Desk2 10 Pro / Main lap Asus ROG 10 Pro 2 laptop Toshiba 7 Pro Asus P2520 7 & 10

Yes I hear you again Jack and it isn't that I don't like 10 per se' what bothers me about it is the way that ones control over your own machine has been taken away ie updates. I was really very annoyed the other evening when typing an email to have them shut down my computer to install an update. now if they can do that remotely what else are they doing?? is what I immediately thought.

The forum I find as I said a bit clinical and the 7 forum seems to have wound back quite a bit and it just isn't the forum it was but anyway I shall pg on with it but just not as much as I used to and like I said I have got into my painting again and I have to say YouTube is a handy tool for that so I shall just keep using what I have.
The other reason for not building again too is the cost prices out here are unbelievably high if you want something like a Sky, Kaby or Coffeelake set up and using an i7 because both my laptops have i7's and I can see why it is the only choice because the other machines with i5 cores just don't stack up well not what I have got. Plus there is the fact that you build something and you can depend on something "better" being released in no time at all how they keep up with re configuring factories etc is just mind numbingly bizarre for want of a better term.

Anyway mate I am not going to top myself over it just disappointed.
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08 Oct 2017   #10

Windows 7 HomePremium 64bit

Months ago I gave Windows10 a serious try. I mean, everything works just fine on Windows7, but I though it's time to be more up to date (especially because I already skipped Vista and Win8x). I need to emphasize, that I wanted to "like" Windows10.. I wanted to find things where I could say "yep, Windows10 is worth to keep". But that didn't happen.

The thing is, as for OS itself, there's nothing new in Windows10 really -it's 18years old OS, patched with updates. Meaning, we install some software and there's no guarantee all garbage will be collected during uninstall.. every software we install can "play" with registry at will, etc. In short: it's an OS that can't protect itself.

But I knew that (from reviews) when I installed Windows10. It was telemetry and "out of control" updates, what made my decision to go back to Windows7. There was a reason MS offered Windows10 for "free"... No, I don't wear tinfoil hat

I have upgraded my PC with SkyLake CPU, made Windows7 clean install and everything works just perfect -I say that again, because we can read too many times how "Windows7 doesn't support new CPU's" (shame on you MS). And as it seems, Windows7 will work just fine on just coming CoffeeLake CPU's too. Where will is, there's a way...

I'm aware that I will need to change OS at some point. Maybe in a year, or in five years... I'm not in hurry.
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 No end in sight

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