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Windows 7: Why get Windows 7 64bit

08 Mar 2009   #21
Night Hawk

W7 Ultimate x64/W10 Pro x64 dual boot main build-remote pc W10 Pro x64 Insider Preview/W7 Pro x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by MadDog56 View Post
For the average user who browses the net, plays a couple of mildly demanding video games and watches videos it's unnecessary. The people who can really benefit from a 64 bit OS are manipulating large files and need the increased ram capacity and throughput. These are the same people that were putting 2gb in when the rest of us were happy with 512mb of ram. Users here and on the vista forums are gung-ho for it and sure that it is the immediate future of the OS and I just don't agree. The "more than just the ram" article still doesn't apply to most home users and without the price of ram dropping so much that 4gb is commonplace we probably wouldn't have seen this kind of interest in 64bit OS environments until years from now. For joe sixpack it IS all about the ram and that much ram isn't necessary for him.

As for drivers it's not as easy as some have mentioned. Yes there are 64 bit drivers for most products, but it's not a surprise to find ones that are unstable or reduce the capabilities of the device from what the 32 bit driver can do. Sure they will continue to release newer, better drivers but as long as the 64 bit crowd is the vast minority so shall the drivers be less of a priority.
Not only is driver support missing for several things still even the 32bit Vista sadly hasn't seen much in the way of updated softwares there with 7 almost out. If you look around at tv tuner cards despite the "Vista compatibility" tag all you get is XP software with a Vista driver update thrown at you. Despite all of the 32bit emulation where are the actual 64bit native softwares? 16 to 32bit went a lot farther and faster there!

I'm trying to find something that actually record composite/analog video and sound from an external source like an old vhs camcorder. Either a new tuner card records sound only in Vista or 7 with no picture even seen or the next card displays both but can't record either! Where's that leave the 64bit side of things when they have been slacking off for 32bit?

As for memory regardless of 32bit or 64bit editions it depends far more on the types of programs being run where a large demand on ram is present. For a pc game that runs on a 512mb system why does anyone think they will see any great performance going 64bit just to run 6-8gb of memory?

The reality of it is that the 32bit market still embedded for XP is too greedy to let go of their "golden egg" and start working on 64bit as well as Vista softwares left in limbo. Despite an improved efficiency of moving up to 64bit over 32bit reality checks are simply a look at "what is" still being marketed by the main software companies.

(Gee? JB: Quatam of Solice recent November title=32bit, Fear 2 just released in the last month = XP compatible still 32bit, and the list goes on and on and on...)


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08 Mar 2009   #22
darkassain

Windows 7 Ult x64(x2), HomePrem x32(x4), Server 08 (+VM), 08 R2 (VM) , SuSe 11.2 (VM), XP 32 (VM)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by scaramonga View Post
XP64 could have been a lot better, had that dreadful Vista not taken up any of MS's time, was a good OS, unsupported and forgotten due to greed and no thought as regards to progress.

it depends on XP 64 as there was two versions based on architecture(IA64 and the AMD64)
IA64 is long gone and well wasnt a good architecture to beging with (i mean 400mhz for 32 bit instructions thats ridiculous [at least when the market was inherently )

the AMD64 version based on the Windows Server 2003 and not based on Windows XP so it was not completely compatible
while i agree that it was very hastily built it was also a OS that was nearing its OS family life cycle
also very few Manufactures supported this OS which also caused its downfall...
so it was not only MS but the OEM's the Antivir people (patchguard was not liked since its inauguration by antvir makers since most used kernel patching for protection, which by the way is also the way rootkits enter)
i say this was one of the main reasons that xp failed is because of its lateness to retail and the cooperation with OEM's was minimal and at that time driver signing was completely minimal (there were even instructions on how to bypass the prompt that said that this hardware was not tested on this machine....)
then users are asking why the computer bluescreens and think automatically its window's fault...
sorry if this turned into from a comment into a rant but MS is trying to change that by having OEM and manufacturers test their hardware before shipping (at least for 64bit)
and of course having to pay money in the process....
some hardware manufactures dont have this amount of money and i would like to see ms trying to help these IHV's and give certs to those that really need it the most and that have really tested their software...
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09 Mar 2009   #23
Romulinx2

Win7 Ultimate x64 on Desktop / Win7 Ultimate x86 on laptop / Win7 x86 Starter on Netbook
 
 

In a few years you will be able to buy a box (a very small box) of nano-machines that will build your own CPU/PC.

You will control the PC with you brain waves also.

It will probably make cake or pie, if you ask it nicely.
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09 Mar 2009   #24
darkassain

Windows 7 Ult x64(x2), HomePrem x32(x4), Server 08 (+VM), 08 R2 (VM) , SuSe 11.2 (VM), XP 32 (VM)
 
 

Nighthawk only specialized software such as autocad (or CAD in general), Creativity Software (such as premiere, finally 64 bit) and Scientific Software in general usually have a 64 bit version...



another link
Windows Vista 64-bit - Is it worth the upgrade? | Windows Vista for Beginners

where i get news on 64 bit apps:
64bit and x64 - Home
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09 Mar 2009   #25
Night Hawk

W7 Ultimate x64/W10 Pro x64 dual boot main build-remote pc W10 Pro x64 Insider Preview/W7 Pro x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by darkassain View Post
Nighthawk only specialized software such as autocad (or CAD in general), Creativity Software (such as premiere, finally 64 bit) and Scientific Software in general usually have a 64 bit version...



another link
Windows Vista 64-bit - Is it worth the upgrade? | Windows Vista for Beginners

where i get news on 64 bit apps:
64bit and x64 - Home
I like this one. Video Tuner Capture**Drivers/Codecs**Catalogue of 64-bit Software* There are none!

Finding 64bit drivers first before running 64bit Windows is the advice seen on the first link there as well as at MS. Unfortunately that's the main beef for most people when finding there are none for something they have on their own systems.

You can't point the finger at Microsoft there since they only provided the 64bit editions of Windows while 3rd parties fell sleep at the switch as darkassain summed that up pretty well. Unfortunately not everyone is in a position to simply go after the latest hardwares that do see support.

Presently I'm waiting to see if adding a wireless router that will match up wiith the ethernet type dsl line and will work for getting online with the 64bit 7. The video and sound drivers are easy enough to find while Creative still lacks on the application side of that.

For those that can get everything going they are one step ahead there. But for the rest of us .. not soooo good is the unfortunate side of that..
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09 Mar 2009   #26
zrtom

W8 Pro, W7 Ultimate, XP Pro x64, Vista x64, Ubuntu
 
 

This is indeed a great thread. Lots of really good thoughts and ideas.

One way I look at x86 vs. x64 is, forgetting about drivers and installed programs, the Operating System itself will run more efficiently (faster) if the computer's architecture supports addressing 64 bits. It seems like, with Windows at least, that the Operating System is sometimes its own worst enemy. It is so busy indexing and defragging and verifying digital signatures and polling the removable media and checking for updates and ......on and on... that it is sometimes hard for a driver or program to get a word in edgewise. So with the OS itself being faster and more efficient, the other things like drivers and programs will have more time to do their thing.

How does that present in the real world? You click on Photoshop and in two or three seconds it is loaded and ready to get to work; and you're not sitting there watching the blue circle spin....less time for the OS to get confused and forget what it was doing. Windows 7 has fixed a lot of that by reprogramming interrupt timers but being more efficient (64-bit) reduces the total interrupt "load" and gives you a faster system.

I don't know, just a thought. From my experience at least, 64-bit Vista, 64-bit XP (to some extent) and now 64-bit W7 all run more stable and faster than the 32-bit versions.
Tom
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09 Mar 2009   #27
Night Hawk

W7 Ultimate x64/W10 Pro x64 dual boot main build-remote pc W10 Pro x64 Insider Preview/W7 Pro x64
 
 

Once I get the 64bit side of things online and see what familar programs will actually install and run while most see the not compatible with 64bit message appear I can sit the 64bit vs 32bit argument to a real test to take notes with both on the exact same set of hardwares at the same time.

The 64bit isn't actually so much faster but simply a more efficient kernel still sadly lacking the 3rd party efforts with a 3rd major Windows release on the way. With 7 finally you may actually start seeing far more 64bit drivers and softwares(key word) being released. For the novice and those running older hardwares the rush to 64bit is still a bit off for the time being however.
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10 Mar 2009   #28
Smashy

Vista Enterprise x64 SP1
 
 

My idea? Install 64bit, it doesn't kill you and anything that doesn't kill you will only make you stronger!
Besides that do everyone a favour and stop using 32bit OS so all the programmers can stop wasting time with 32bit drivers/applications and go straight for 64bit.
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10 Mar 2009   #29
Dzomlija

Windows 7 Ultimate x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Night Hawk View Post
Once I get the 64bit side of things online and see what familar programs will actually install and run while most see the not compatible with 64bit message appear I can sit the 64bit vs 32bit argument to a real test to take notes with both on the exact same set of hardwares at the same time.

The 64bit isn't actually so much faster but simply a more efficient kernel still sadly lacking the 3rd party efforts with a 3rd major Windows release on the way. With 7 finally you may actually start seeing far more 64bit drivers and softwares(key word) being released. For the novice and those running older hardwares the rush to 64bit is still a bit off for the time being however.
Remember how long it took for 32-bit to become mainstream? The 80386 series processors introduced 32-bit, but it was only with the release of Windows 95 that we had a 32-bit operating system, but the real acceptance of 32-bit can only be seen with the release of Windows NT 4 and later Windows 2000.

How long will it be for 64-bit computing to be the norm in the same way that 32-bit is today?
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10 Mar 2009   #30
Smashy

Vista Enterprise x64 SP1
 
 

According to what you said :
XP was the first 64-bit Windows OS (only had a 64-bit version and sadly a rather ****ty one) <-> Windows 95
Vista was the second 64-bit Windows OS (first "good" one) <-> NT 4
Windows 7 is the third and really good 64-bit Windows OS <-> Windows 2000

note : only compared on timeline in terms of the 32-bit usage/acceptance

Basically the time for 64-bit is NOW, this is the third 64-bit Windows OS and we really have to stop using it as 32-bit too, people need to move on.

*edit*
There were other 32-bit versions but not that well known or used.

*edit 2*
Build 7048 is now installing on a pc couple years old with a Pentium 4 3.0 GHz and I'm installing the 64-bit version to see how it runs (machine has 1GB ram)
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 Why get Windows 7 64bit




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