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Windows 7: Adding group to a folders permissions?

03 Mar 2010   #11
richc46

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Windows 10, Home Clean Install
 
 

Glad that we could help and thank you for your thoughts on safe mode. It is because of people like you that this is a great forum. Use our knowledge and share yours.


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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03 Mar 2010   #12
Bare Foot Kid
Microsoft MVP

W 7 64-bit Ultimate
 
 

We are glad you've forund a solution that works for you.
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04 Mar 2010   #13
amajamar

windows 7
 
 

Thanks again, all! I'm new to Win7 and have lot's of questions!
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04 Mar 2010   #14
richc46

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Windows 10, Home Clean Install
 
 

You are not a quest of the forum, you are family. Use our knowledge and tutorials as much as you require. Feel free to share your knowledge with us, too.
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05 Mar 2010   #15
Barman58

Windows 10 Pro x64 x3, Ubuntu
 
 

Just a few things that may help in future when dealing with permissions.

Permissions are applied to the actual files and not the Operating system, what this means is that they are written to each file and folder individually and will survive the re-install of an OS or the installation of another OS

Permissions in windows are set to automatically cascade through the folder tree when applied. This results in any permission changes applied to a folder will attempt to be applied to all files and sub folders in the segment of the file tree concerned. It also means that to change or remove permissions it is often required to go up the folder tree to the point where there original permissions were added, although it is often possible to add extra permissions at the point you wish.

When running an administrator account in Windows 7 (or Vista), you actually run as a standard user, if UAC is on.

In order to change permissions you actually have to have a specific permission set for your user on the folders or files, Due to the dual nature of the normal administrator group accounts in win7, (or vista), it is possible that the standard form of the user account will not have this permission whilst the elevated user will.

This permission is part of the full control permissions and is also automatically granted to the owner of the folder or file.

Switching UAC off will automatically elevate the user status, as will running in safe mode, or running as the hidden system administrator.

When cascading the applied permissions down the folder tree it is possible that the system will encounter folders where the user applying the permissions does not have the required Change file permissions Permission, this will cause Windows to produce an error. In these situations it will be necessary to go to the folder and add the correct permissions.

There are various advanced options to control the application of permissions which can break the link between the current folder and it's parent, that may be useful at times.

Basically the application of NTFS file permissions is a complex one that is made more complex by the UAC in Win7 so unless you are certain of the consequences is best to leave well alone. Saying this, the control that the correct use of permissions can provide in a network or multi-user scenario is well worth the effort of learning how they work
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05 Mar 2010   #16
Bare Foot Kid
Microsoft MVP

W 7 64-bit Ultimate
 
 

Thanks for the explanation Nigel.
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05 Mar 2010   #17
amajamar

windows 7
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Barman58 View Post
Just a few things that may help in future when dealing with permissions.

Permissions are applied to the actual files and not the Operating system, what this means is that they are written to each file and folder individually and will survive the re-install of an OS or the installation of another OS

Permissions in windows are set to automatically cascade through the folder tree when applied. This results in any permission changes applied to a folder will attempt to be applied to all files and sub folders in the segment of the file tree concerned. It also means that to change or remove permissions it is often required to go up the folder tree to the point where there original permissions were added, although it is often possible to add extra permissions at the point you wish.

When running an administrator account in Windows 7 (or Vista), you actually run as a standard user, if UAC is on.

In order to change permissions you actually have to have a specific permission set for your user on the folders or files, Due to the dual nature of the normal administrator group accounts in win7, (or vista), it is possible that the standard form of the user account will not have this permission whilst the elevated user will.

This permission is part of the full control permissions and is also automatically granted to the owner of the folder or file.

Switching UAC off will automatically elevate the user status, as will running in safe mode, or running as the hidden system administrator.

When cascading the applied permissions down the folder tree it is possible that the system will encounter folders where the user applying the permissions does not have the required Change file permissions Permission, this will cause Windows to produce an error. In these situations it will be necessary to go to the folder and add the correct permissions.

There are various advanced options to control the application of permissions which can break the link between the current folder and it's parent, that may be useful at times.

Basically the application of NTFS file permissions is a complex one that is made more complex by the UAC in Win7 so unless you are certain of the consequences is best to leave well alone. Saying this, the control that the correct use of permissions can provide in a network or multi-user scenario is well worth the effort of learning how they work
Thank you so much! That was a great explanation!

I posted another thread yesterday with a question of error messages after restoring permissions of a user account. I now can see how those errors could have been caused, however how do you fix them? There seems to be no obvious problems at the top folder, as the correct owner is listed and the standard other users seem to be intact.

As there were seemingly 15 or 20 errors to click through when I made the changes, I couldn't track them all. This was done in Safe Mode, as well.

If you have any further thoughts on how to find and correct folder permission errors on "the tree", so to speak, please let me know.

Thanks so much!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
05 Mar 2010   #18
mitchell65

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit 7601 Multiprocessor Free Service Pack 1
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by amajamar View Post
I will heed your advice... .

BTW, Safe Mode is good place to fix things... Couldn't get System Restore to function until I ran it from there...
Hi Do you run Norton Anti Virus?
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05 Mar 2010   #19
Barman58

Windows 10 Pro x64 x3, Ubuntu
 
 

Unfortunately the only real way to correct incorrect permissions where they only apply to sub-folders - that is to note the errors during the cascade phase and manually go to the individual folders and correct at that level.

There are tools available within the operating system (under advanced in the permissions dialogue), that allow you to remove the links to the parent folder. It is then possible, (only if you are the owner of the folder or the hidden administrator ), to completely remove all permissions below your current location and then re-attach to the parent folders.

Which ever method you use this is always a complex thing to do especially where previous operating systems or other users have or have had access to the files and folders.

The way that permissions behave can provide a way of correcting permissions.

If you move a folder or file it retains it's existing permissions, however, if you copy the file or folder it takes on the permissions of the folder that it is copied into.

If you are having issues with the User files tree it is sometimes possible to create a new user and then as the hidden administrator copy the user file tree, (everything below the actual user folder, many of which may be hidden/system folders), from the old user to the new user's folder tree thus re-setting all permissions. The problem with this method is the amount of space that you may need to actually perform the copy operation. After the copy operation and the checking of the nw account operationally the old account is deleted.

I have been dealing with complex network/multi-user permissions since the days of NT3.5 so I feel comfortable doing this type of thing.

What I would advise anyone contemplating this is to make a complete system image to another location before you change anything
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05 Mar 2010   #20
amajamar

windows 7
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by mitchell65 View Post
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by amajamar View Post
I will heed your advice... .

BTW, Safe Mode is good place to fix things... Couldn't get System Restore to function until I ran it from there...
Hi Do you run Norton Anti Virus?

Yes, I do. However, it was off when I changed the permissions.

Nigel, as I am exploring the folders where I believe there were errors, I notice that what seems to be missing is the HomeUser account permission. That seems to be consistant with other user accounts with similar folders. My thinking is that the cascade of permisssions may not have been actual errors, as much as a prevention of an error. What is your feeling on this? Also, could you explain the HomeUser and it's impact on the system?

Thanks so much!!
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 Adding group to a folders permissions?




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