Hard Drive - why is 2 TB only 1.8 TB ??

Buddahfan · 25 Dec 2010

whs said:

Right now my thermometer shows 45 degrees - but it is just misleading me because in my reality it is 7 degrees - because I am a European and I only know Celsius. This is the analogy to your misconstrued arguments.

I have never understood why people use "weather" thermometers.

If you feel too cold you put on more clothes and/or turn up the heat to get comfortable.:)

If you feel too hot you wear less clothes and/or turn the temperature down on your air conditioner to get comfortable.:)

Knowing what the temperature says on a "weather" thermometer does not change your atmospheric comfort level.

James Colbert · 25 Dec 2010

Buddahfan said:

Knowing what the temperature says on a "weather" thermometer does not change your atmospheric comfort level.

Not understanding the actual capacity your drive, however, does :) .

James Colbert · 25 Dec 2010

whs said:

We do keep running in circles regarding this topic, with all due respect.

I guess we'll do that until the "last" guy understands what they missed in math class.

And therein lies the confusion: which math? We know which math you refer to, but how about Average John Doe? How about those who skipped HD math altogether (which is the majority of the computer using world)?

The point is not that the math you and HD mfrs & marketers use is invalid, nor is it that the math the OS's use (and which users are subject to) is invalid, it's that there are 2 different 'maths' in play here, and this is the problem (as is evidenced by this and many, many other threads).

Further, to say that the HD mfrs are unaware of the dynamics of these different maths is to under-estimate them.

Both maths are legitimate, but the use of both in the manner that exists leaves users feeling cheated. This cannot be denied.

James

whs · 25 Dec 2010

LoWang said:

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whs said:

LOL, on another forum last year, a Canadian lady even wanted to take the manufacturer to court for false advertising. We had a hard time to keep her from doing that.

And that means this lady is right! It is fundamentally wrong from the beginning of computer media manufacturing and I think it is just a dirty trick! There would be nothing wrong to take manufacturers to court about this IMO!
Of course you can tell me that manufacturers are actually right because MB and GB are multiplies of 1000 and only GiB and MiB are multiplies of 1024. Oh yes one can say we are all noobs and don't understand it, but that would be just closing your eyes before the world. Have you ever seen MiB or GiB being used in operating systems or programs?? I almost never had. That means it can be written in some wikipedias that there are MBs and MiB, however in reality it is simply not true and HDD manufacturers simply live in a paralel world :-\

This is a red herring. 2 billion bytes are 2 billon bytes, regardless whether expressed in decimal GBs or binary GBs. I would like to see the mess when things are being specified in binary for those "appliance users". They should have been awake during math class.

LoWang · 26 Dec 2010

whs why don't you tell it to operating system programmers who merrilly use GBs and MBs in all their software but not those you are talking about? It seems THEY were asleep during math class weren't they?

mikedl · 26 Dec 2010

Thanks, LoWang. I know of one group that certainly was not sleeping in class; the HD marketing guys ...

whs · 26 Dec 2010

Hi friends, we are beating this horse to death. But I am going to make a last attempt to explan it to you. (Btw: I was an Operating System Programmer for 35 years).

Last month, I bought an item here in Florida for $100. Today I get my credit card statement and the item is listed at 76.45. So you would think I made a good deal. Not so, because my credit card is from a German Bank and the 76.45 is Euros which is worth exactly the same as $100 (the day they made the conversion). It is just expressed in another currency. Imagine I would ask the American cashier to express the prices in Euros. That would really confuse them - to say the least.

Now back to the marketing guys for disks. They could state the capacity in binary. Then it would read 1.8TB binary for a disk the has the capacity of 2 trillion bytes. You think that would help? Our normal world is in decimal, that's why the say 2TB for 2 trillion bytes. Does'nt that make more sense?

In summary, 2 trillion bytes can be expressed as 2TB in decimal (which is our normal world) or as 1.8TB in binary (which is the world of computers). But that does not change the capacity - it is 2 trillion bytes in both cases.

derekimo · 26 Dec 2010

whs said:

Hi friends, we are beating this horse to death. But I am going to make a last attempt to explan it to you. (Btw: I was an Operating System Programmer for 35 years).

Last month, I bought an item here in Florida for $100. Today I get my credit card statement and the item is listed at 76.45. So you would think I made a good deal. Not so, because my credit card is from a German Bank and the 76.45 is Euros which is worth exactly the same as $100 (the day they made the conversion). It is just expressed in another currency. Imagine I would ask the American cashier to express the prices in Euros. That would really confuse them - to say the least.

Now back to the marketing guys for disks. They could state the capacity in binary. Then it would read 1.8TB binary for a disk the has the capacity of 2 trillion bytes. You think that would help? Our normal world is in decimal, that's why the say 2TB for 2 trillion bytes. Does'nt that make more sense?

In summary, 2 trillion bytes can be expressed as 2TB in decimal (which is our normal world) or as 1.8TB in binary (which is the world of computers). But that does not change the capacity - it is 2 trillion bytes in both cases.

Excellent explanation Wolfgang!

Case closed, let the horse rest in peace.

Dogz · 26 Dec 2010

jm1996a said:

Hi Folks - new member, first thread.

I have several hard drives, mostly Western Digital.

The advertised 2 TB only shows up as 1.8 TB, and so keeping it below the 80-90 percent full means it is pretty much "full" at about 1.5 TB.

Ditto my 1 TB, which shows up as 900 MB, and my 1.5 TB which shows up as 1.3 TB.

So the questions:
- why do they advertise as 2 TB when its only 90 percent of that ?
- am i doing the right thing by keeping the drives below about 80-90 percent of the 1.8 TB max capacity ?

- OR -

- do i really have a full 2 TB capacity, and its just formatted to display "full" at the 90% point of 2 TB, which is 1.8 TB (in other words i can safely store up to a full 1.8 TB point, rather than 80-90 percent of THAT).......

thanks guys, i'll look forward to the reply,

jm

Part of that 2TB is used by the hard drive to organize data.

James Colbert · 26 Dec 2010

derekimo said:

Excellent explanation Wolfgang!

Case closed, let the horse rest in peace.

Hi Derek. Understanding of the 'math' involved notwithstanding, unfortunately, the 'case' will continue (as will the threads) as long as the average user doesn't understand where his "missing GBs" went. Not an argument, but a statement of reality.

James