Windows 7 Forums
Welcome to Windows 7 Forums. Our forum is dedicated to helping you find support and solutions for any problems regarding your Windows 7 PC be it Dell, HP, Acer, Asus or a custom build. We also provide an extensive Windows 7 tutorial section that covers a wide range of tips and tricks.


Windows 7: Windows 7 to be shipped in Europe sans IE

13 Jun 2009   #101
PhreePhly

Windows 7 x64 (RTM via MSDN)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Boris View Post
@PhreePhly

MS is a monopolist. The EU foremost represents the EU customers, not so much other companies in this case. Maybe you should take a look in your own backyard and see what happens when there is no regulation. I give you a clue: "sub loans". Thank you very much
Actually, MS was a monopolist back in 1996, and was found to abused that position in 2001. The EU finally got around to going after MS in 2004. And I'm not necessarily against the fines imposed in 2004. They served their purpose, and changed how MS operates, just as intended. The last few actions have little bearing in reality and look to be purely vindictive. This last one is completely stupid. MS agrees with the EU, decides not to include IE, and now they want to continue the investigation. Total crap.

Ohh, and don't forget that plenty of your Central Banks knew about the "sub-loans" and still purchased them, even with all of your regulation. Seems regulation might not be the only issue, greed seems to play a pretty big part, also.

PhreePhly


My System SpecsSystem Spec
.
13 Jun 2009   #102
jimbo45

Linux CENTOS 7 / various Windows OS'es and servers
 
 

Hi all

Perhaps we are all getting a little carried away here
After all MS can simply add the IE browser in a folder called EXTRAS on the Windows distribution DVD (or even as a separate supplemental DVD) and instruct the user to load the 2nd DVD / EXTRAS folder and install the browser like any other software.

Note that they could even offer OPERA / SAFARI etc on the disk as well -- but you have to be a little bit careful with some Open Source programs -- whilst the License might be FREE for home users there could be implications in using some of this alternative software in a commercial environment

For example MySQL is freely downloadable to home users but if you use it in a commercial environment you have to buy a commercial license to legally use it.

What irritates me beyond measure here is that the ruling also applies to the EEA which is technically OUTSIDE the EU so we should be exempt.

Why on Earth if I buy the product in Iceland for example should I be forced to get the same conditions as a country BELONGING to the EU.

In any case I'm sure 99% of people will either have the OEM pre-installed W7 package or will source the product from non EU sources.

As I posted previously -- totally WASTED court case which will be 100% ineffective. (Also if these Bozos from their nice shiny new HQ in Brussels try and insist on this stuff it will make me DETERMINED to install IE whether I want it or not just to prove how stupid they are).

Cheers
jimbo
My System SpecsSystem Spec
13 Jun 2009   #103
Dwarf

Windows 8.1 Pro RTM x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by SGT Oddball View Post
Rubbish, the only thing the EU represents is the loony unelected bureaucrats that run it.
+1 from me too. There is one thing I have to say though, and this is that we should not present loonies in this light. It is an insult for them to be associated in this manner. Having said that, we might get more common sense if the EU was run by bona-fide loonies.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
.

13 Jun 2009   #104
PhreePhly

Windows 7 x64 (RTM via MSDN)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
Hi all

Perhaps we are all getting a little carried away here
After all MS can simply add the IE browser in a folder called EXTRAS on the Windows distribution DVD (or even as a separate supplemental DVD) and instruct the user to load the 2nd DVD / EXTRAS folder and install the browser like any other software.

Note that they could even offer OPERA / SAFARI etc on the disk as well -- but you have to be a little bit careful with some Open Source programs -- whilst the License might be FREE for home users there could be implications in using some of this alternative software in a commercial environment
The only issue I have with this solution is that now the EU is dictating what MS must include in the release. How many browsers does MS add to the disk? There are probably 10 browsers available on Windows. Most of them have less than 1% share, but where do you draw that line. Making 1% that limit would keep Opera off that list, funny, but problematic. MS solved that problem by adding NO browser and leaving it up to OEMs.


Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
What irritates me beyond measure here is that the ruling also applies to the EEA which is technically OUTSIDE the EU so we should be exempt.

Why on Earth if I buy the product in Iceland for example should I be forced to get the same conditions as a country BELONGING to the EU.
Well, Opera is from Norway, who is also not in the EU and a EEA member.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
In any case I'm sure 99% of people will either have the OEM pre-installed W7 package or will source the product from non EU sources.

As I posted previously -- totally WASTED court case which will be 100% ineffective. (Also if these Bozos from their nice shiny new HQ in Brussels try and insist on this stuff it will make me DETERMINED to install IE whether I want it or not just to prove how stupid they are).

Cheers
jimbo
Agreed. Again, I have no problem with the EU regulating monopolistic behavior. I'm not sure MS is the same monopoly it was 10-15 years ago. Linux, Firefox, Apple, even Novell, etc. have made MS less of a necessity. Much of that has to do with the actions taken by the EU and the US.gov.

PhreePhly
My System SpecsSystem Spec
13 Jun 2009   #105
SIW2

Microsoft Community Contributor Award Recipient

Vista x64 / 7 X64
 
 

My System SpecsSystem Spec
13 Jun 2009   #106
Night Hawk

W7 Ultimate x64/W10 Pro x64 dual boot main build-remote pc W10 Pro x64 Insider Preview/W7 Pro x64
 
 

The one thing the article lacks is the fact that Jobs introduced the first desktop system while BG introduced the first graphical user interface with the introduction and presentation of the 1.0 beta back in 1983 to be seen out 2yrs. later. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/WinHistoryDesktop.mspx

Another article by the same author however brings up some interesting points or predictions made in early 2008 on how MS will be making some changes to some extent.

"To be clear, I am not predicting that Microsoft will do a quick-and-massive overhaul of Windows Vista in the next 12 months. Instead, I think we’ll see Microsoft do the following:
  • Strip out or minimize some of Windows Vista’s clunkiest features — especially User Account Control
  • Simplify the interface back to something closer to Windows XP
  • Reduce backward compatibility in order to streamline the code base
  • Work much harder with vendors to ensure driver and software compatibility with new hardware and applications
  • Reduce the cost of Windows in retail boxes in order to generate goodwill and undercut Mac OS X (meanwhile, this will have little effect on the price of enterprise licensing, which is already much cheaper than retail)
  • Learn from the long delay of Windows Vista and move to an incremental release model with a subscription and at least one major update per year. Financially, most IT departments are already on a subscription plan. Now look for Microsoft to move consumers in this direction.
  • Release Windows 7 by the end of 2009 and market it as the simplest and easiest Windows ever" Prediction: Microsoft will leapfrog Vista, release Windows 7 early, and change its OS business | Tech Sanity Check | TechRepublic.com
Items #1, #4, #5, #6, #7 seem to hit the mark there. Backward compatibility #3 seen with 7 so far hasn't been lost since I have a few things running here that ran on 98-XP! As for item #2 we've all seen the enhancements with the new taskbar over both XP and Vista alike with 7 also featuring the Flip 3D introduced with Vista.

The latest EU issue simply reflects how long MS has been accused of monopolizing their OS by simply providing a newer version of the same browser with each new version of Windows. On the OS doesn't matter part I think some will still hesitate to agree on that one!

Despite the cross platform support slowing seeing a long awaited improvement with virtualization and even using a live Linux distro for a data recovery tool on a Windows machine which OS do you generally most running?

The thing that will get most however is going to install 7 and seeing the options for downloading updates or avoiding updates during the installation process, choosing the network setting of home, business, other, and then finding no browser installed. For direct downloads from Microsoft for the most part you still need IE there for any MS downloader to work.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Jun 2009   #107
petrossa

vista x64/ win 7 x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by PhreePhly View Post
First of all, ActiveX was not developed to kill Java, it was developed to provide a better framework for OLE/COM. It was meant to interact with not just IE but Office apps, Media Player, Visual Studio, etc.
PhreePhly
Since Javascript was already available to do what Activex did poorly afterwards, the inclusion of activex in HTML scripts was pointless, other then to stifle the adoption of java in browsers. A normal player on the market would have stepped in and helped push java further along faster.

A monopolist would see it as a threat to their monopoly and fight it hand, tooth and nails.

Furthermore the EU is not dictating what to put in (yet) but just not to make competition virtually impossible.

Should the EU dictate what to put in, then MS can either decide to put it in, or decide to loose their largest paying customer. To my mind MS's shareholders would have a dim view of the latter.

Lastely, one should inform oneself of the facts before making remarks about 'looney' burocrats. If it weren't for those 'looney' burocrats member countries could impose stringent anti-piracy laws as proposed by Napoleon Sarkozy. And that includes the UK who had a very open ear to Sarky's ridiculous law proposal.

Also they protected you from your governments desire to invade and control your privacy on the net, not in the least by making internet a basic necessity of life equal to electricity, water.

The list of good things is longer then the bad things.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
14 Jun 2009   #108
Boris

W7 64b - Leopard 10.6.2 - Ubuntu 10.10 (MBP Snow Leopard 10.6.3)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by PhreePhly View Post
Ohh, and don't forget that plenty of your Central Banks knew about the "sub-loans" and still purchased them, even with all of your regulation. Seems regulation might not be the only issue, greed seems to play a pretty big part, also.PhreePhly
Agreed, I was just pointing at the root of the problem.

I think we could go on forever discussing this topic. Seems people like to blame the EU or Opera, but have limitless faith in MS.

I wish people would take a bit more time to look at all sides of the problem. One more click on installation is not much to ask if you get more open standards in return, is it?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
07 Jul 2009   #109
ian1983

XP Windows7
 
 

As there is no option to upgrade from xp or vista with Windows 7e most ppl installing will have the technical knowledge to download a browser setup.

For the others that take it to the local pc shop im sure the staff would just put on a browser after install.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
07 Jul 2009   #110
Dwarf

Windows 8.1 Pro RTM x64
 
 

That is not the point. What is the point is this: Why should those of us who are unfortunate enough to reside in Europe have to go through the rigmarole of having to separately install a browser just because a bunch of EU dictats decree that MS (a US-based company) should only release W7 without a browser in this part of the World?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
Reply

 Windows 7 to be shipped in Europe sans IE




Thread Tools




Similar help and support threads
Thread Forum
Buying used laptop sans HD and OS
I've been looking for a Dell W7P laptop and noticed many of them are being sold without a hard drive or operating system at a good price. The advantage to me is I could install the exact HD I wanted, like a SSD with 128-256GB and not settle for the ones selling around $150-$200 with a standard HD....
General Discussion
Microsoft: 350 million Windows 7 devices to be shipped in 2012
Read more at: Microsoft: 350 million Windows 7 devices to be shipped in 2012 | Microsoft - CNET News
News
Was shipped 32bit Windows for my 64 bit Laptop
Hello, Earlier this year I purchased an Asus F50S laptop. I love the laptop but I am a bit frustrated that they shipped a 32bit version of Windows with a 64 bit Laptop. I own my own business doing videography work - and I know I am not getting the full performance out of my laptop. What are...
Windows Updates & Activation
Windows 7 pre-orders big in Europe
Windows 7 pre-orders big in Europe | Beyond Binary - CNET News
News
Europe won't pay more for Windows 7. Really!
Europe won't pay more for Windows 7. Really! Europe won't pay more for Windows 7. Really! • The Register For all the Europeans out there! Cheers! ~Lordbob
News


Our Sites

Site Links

About Us

Find Us

Windows 7 Forums is an independent web site and has not been authorized, sponsored, or otherwise approved by Microsoft Corporation. "Windows 7" and related materials are trademarks of Microsoft Corp.

© Designer Media Ltd

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:34.
Twitter Facebook Google+ Seven Forums iOS App Seven Forums Android App