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Windows 7: Apple demanded Microsoft to stop its Laptop Hunters ads

18 Jul 2009   #41
Lordbob75

Windows 7 Ultimate x64, Mint 9
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by BCXtreme View Post
I agree with your main point very strongly. Apple's main problem here is arrogance.

After one of the first Laptop Hunter ads, Apple actually responded by saying that saving money doesn't help if the computer doesn't work. They actually claimed that a Vaio FW laptop "doesn't work."

Then at WWDC 09 they made a slew of derogatory comments about Windows 7, all of which were outright lies. We all know that Apple didn't have someone test Windows 7 before making those remarks.

I find it so strange that Apple can get away with whatever bad business practices they want, with ZERO consequences. The EU is getting on Microsoft's case for bundling Internet Explorer with Windows; why not attack Apple for bundling Safari with OS X? Microsoft is accused of maintaining a monopoly in the PC market; Apple's legal department considers it a crime to install OS X on a computer they didn't build. People like us run hundreds of programs on our computers that have not been certified by MS; Apple has a killswitch in place on the iPhone that can let them deactivate any app on the device if they suddenly decide they don't like it.

The ultimate example of Apple arrogance is Snow Leopard's tagline: "The world's most advanced operating system." It's not. Windows can do more than Mac. Linux can do more than Mac. The only thing exceptionally advanced about Mac is the fancy graphics and special effects (cover flow, etc). And guess what? Last time I checked, you can get a lot of those fancy effects and UI in Windows, through the use of customization programs. So there goes the Snow Leopard tagline!

C'mon Apple, you whine and complain about MS criticizing your high prices in a commercial? The next commercial on the air had your Steve Jobs lookalike insinuating that PC users are stupid clumsy nerds. It doesn't take one of your "Geniuses" to figure out which insult is worse.



Hear hear!
VERY well said. (have some rep)

~Lordbob


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18 Jul 2009   #42
joel406

Windows 7 Ultimate x64/x86 Windows 7 Pro x64/x86 Windows 7 Home Premium x64/x86
 
 

One of my customers daughter gets a new PC everytime she screws hers up. Gone through 3 at my last count. She decided to waste her $$ on a MAC last time. She didn't make it 24 hours before screaming for help. Nothing worked right.

All Apples are rotten if you ask me I have never seen one work right, even straight out of the box they are a mess.
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18 Jul 2009   #43
Joshatdot

Windows 7 Professional x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Muad Dib View Post
Apple's strategy from the start was to create and sell Ferrari's to an elite group of well-to-do snobs and make owning a PC a symbol of "having made it" in the world. They wanted absolute control and a VERY large % if not 100% of the profits from all Apple related products and services. My first PC was an Apple IIe. Nice machine in its day.

IBM wanted absolute control and 100% of the profits from IBM DOS and any hardware they licensed the IBM BIOS to.

Bill Gates, like Henry Ford, created and marketed a Model T (MS-DOS) that even the lowliest of the population could afford. If not for themselves then for their children. His strategy changed PCs from a $$$ status symbol to a generic toaster found in every kitchen (Ok - maybe a washing machine, price wise, found in every laundry room). To the 3rd party hardware and software vendors he said - "Have at it, may the best products/services win!", and prices for all plummeted from OPEN market competition. And the population benefited.

Did he become the richest man in the world as a result? YES. Did MS come to dominate the market? YES. Do I resent their success? NO!

I, for one, am grateful, Bill Gates and MS are an example of entrepreneurial "Carpe Diem". They "seized the day" at a critical point in the history of technology.

But they did not grip the reins tightly as Apple and IBM attempted to do. They gave a wild horse a loose rein and held on for the ride. Many other industries simply grabbed the horses tail and did the same.

The existence of this forum is only one example of the consequences of the Apple versus MS strategies.

And I think the best horse won! That is the way of the free market.
That is a very god description of Apple & MS! But I would liek to add, MS usually steals or buys out another companys work/design/code. I mean look how MS-DOS and Windows first got into the market.

Watch Pirates of Silicon Valley, if any of you are old old skool computer geeks you'll love it if you haven't seen it already.
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.

18 Jul 2009   #44
Klaw117

Windows 7 Home Premium x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by BCXtreme View Post
I agree with your main point very strongly. Apple's main problem here is arrogance.

After one of the first Laptop Hunter ads, Apple actually responded by saying that saving money doesn't help if the computer doesn't work. They actually claimed that a Vaio FW laptop "doesn't work."

Then at WWDC 09 they made a slew of derogatory comments about Windows 7, all of which were outright lies. We all know that Apple didn't have someone test Windows 7 before making those remarks.

I find it so strange that Apple can get away with whatever bad business practices they want, with ZERO consequences. The EU is getting on Microsoft's case for bundling Internet Explorer with Windows; why not attack Apple for bundling Safari with OS X? Microsoft is accused of maintaining a monopoly in the PC market; Apple's legal department considers it a crime to install OS X on a computer they didn't build. People like us run hundreds of programs on our computers that have not been certified by MS; Apple has a killswitch in place on the iPhone that can let them deactivate any app on the device if they suddenly decide they don't like it.

The ultimate example of Apple arrogance is Snow Leopard's tagline: "The world's most advanced operating system." It's not. Windows can do more than Mac. Linux can do more than Mac. The only thing exceptionally advanced about Mac is the fancy graphics and special effects (cover flow, etc). And guess what? Last time I checked, you can get a lot of those fancy effects and UI in Windows, through the use of customization programs. So there goes the Snow Leopard tagline!

C'mon Apple, you whine and complain about MS criticizing your high prices in a commercial? The next commercial on the air had your Steve Jobs lookalike insinuating that PC users are stupid clumsy nerds. It doesn't take one of your "Geniuses" to figure out which insult is worse.



Hear hear!
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Muad Dib View Post
Apple's strategy from the start was to create and sell Ferrari's to an elite group of well-to-do snobs and make owning a PC a symbol of "having made it" in the world. They wanted absolute control and a VERY large % if not 100% of the profits from all Apple related products and services. My first PC was an Apple IIe. Nice machine in its day.

IBM wanted absolute control and 100% of the profits from IBM DOS and any hardware they licensed the IBM BIOS to.

Bill Gates, like Henry Ford, created and marketed a Model T (MS-DOS) that even the lowliest of the population could afford. If not for themselves then for their children. His strategy changed PCs from a $$$ status symbol to a generic toaster found in every kitchen (Ok - maybe a washing machine, price wise, found in every laundry room). To the 3rd party hardware and software vendors he said - "Have at it, may the best products/services win!", and prices for all plummeted from OPEN market competition. And the population benefited.

Did he become the richest man in the world as a result? YES. Did MS come to dominate the market? YES. Do I resent their success? NO!

I, for one, am grateful, Bill Gates and MS are an example of entrepreneurial "Carpe Diem". They "seized the day" at a critical point in the history of technology.

But they did not grip the reins tightly as Apple and IBM attempted to do. They gave a wild horse a loose rein and held on for the ride. Many other industries simply grabbed the horses tail and did the same.

The existence of this forum is only one example of the consequences of the Apple versus MS strategies.

And I think the best horse won! That is the way of the free market.
Nice arguments, rep for the two of you.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
18 Jul 2009   #45
pestbest

Windows 7
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Muad Dib View Post
Apple's strategy from the start was to create and sell Ferrari's to an elite group of well-to-do snobs and make owning a PC a symbol of "having made it" in the world. They wanted absolute control and a VERY large % if not 100% of the profits from all Apple related products and services. My first PC was an Apple IIe. Nice machine in its day.

IBM wanted absolute control and 100% of the profits from IBM DOS and any hardware they licensed the IBM BIOS to.

Bill Gates, like Henry Ford, created and marketed a Model T (MS-DOS) that even the lowliest of the population could afford. If not for themselves then for their children. His strategy changed PCs from a $$$ status symbol to a generic toaster found in every kitchen (Ok - maybe a washing machine, price wise, found in every laundry room). To the 3rd party hardware and software vendors he said - "Have at it, may the best products/services win!", and prices for all plummeted from OPEN market competition. And the population benefited.

Did he become the richest man in the world as a result? YES. Did MS come to dominate the market? YES. Do I resent their success? NO!

I, for one, am grateful, Bill Gates and MS are an example of entrepreneurial "Carpe Diem". They "seized the day" at a critical point in the history of technology.

But they did not grip the reins tightly as Apple and IBM attempted to do. They gave a wild horse a loose rein and held on for the ride. Many other industries simply grabbed the horses tail and did the same.

The existence of this forum is only one example of the consequences of the Apple versus MS strategies.

And I think the best horse won! That is the way of the free market.
Thank you for such an insightful post. I totally agree. If there wasn't a Windows now, we will all be stuck to IBM and Apple. Do you really think everyone will be able to afford Apple's hardware? No. It would be simply the rich people who have computers. In schools and even workplaces, there will be expensive hardware which are not value-for-money and as an end result, education and all technology will all be affected.

That's why I respect Bill Gates. While Apple and IBM thought of the profits and what is better for themselves, Bill Gates thought of us and how computers could benefit consumers instead of themselves. Microsoft may be anti-competitive but they are the ones who are really helping the world advance via technology and computers.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Jul 2009   #46
PhreePhly

Windows 7 x64 (RTM via MSDN)
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Joshatdot View Post
That is a very god description of Apple & MS! But I would liek to add, MS usually steals or buys out another companys work/design/code. I mean look how MS-DOS and Windows first got into the market.

Watch Pirates of Silicon Valley, if any of you are old old skool computer geeks you'll love it if you haven't seen it already.
I've watched Pirates of Silicon Valley, and it's not bad, but there is a strong Apple bias in the production.

The show portrays Gates as über-geeky, but completely misses his early understanding and visions of where the PC will fit in the home. While Gates was a decent software guy, Paul Allen was the real coding talent. However, as Muad Dib pointed out, Gates was the strong "Henry Ford" businessman with a vision.

As far as your point regarding MS "stealing" or buying out, let's be honest, MS "steals"as much as the next guy. And the guys that MS buys out, well they are usually very happy about that.

And I just went through this with petrossa, but I'll repeat it here. When IBM was introducing their early PC, they wanted an operating system. They knew about Gates and Microsoft from their work on the BASIC interpeter on the Altail 8800. They approached Gates to develop an OS. Gates told IBM to go see Gary Kildall of DRI and look at his CP/M OS. Gary essentially blew off IBM, so IBM came back to Gates and said, find us something else.

Gates knew what this could mean financially, so he had Paul Allen buy the rights to 86-DOS and they tweeked it to fit the IBM PCs and it shipped as PC-DOS. Now 86-DOS was basically a clone of CP/M and when Gary Kildall got ticked and threatened to sue IBM. IBM agreed to offer users the choice of CP/M or PC-DOS. The problem was that Kildall insisted on selling CP/M for $240 (this was 1984 dollars) and IBM was selling PC-DOS at $40. Gary was sure people would pay for quality. He was wrong.

And as far as Windows goes and the GUIs out there, the writing was on the wall, GUIs were going to be the interface of the future and Apples lame attempt at the "look and feel" lawsuit was just stupid. Apple never bought any rights to the Xerox PARC UI. They also "stole" the look and feel.

PhreePhly
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Jul 2009   #47
Ohgami

Main: Dual Boot (Vista SP2 64 Ultimate & Win7 64 7100) Laptop:Win7 64 7100
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Joshatdot View Post
I remember the old Mac comercials from early 2000's, and then this came out...loved it

YouTube - Mac Gamer Spoof
This is my personal favorite Mac Spoof. A bit old but still LOL

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19 Jul 2009   #48
Muad Dib

XP Pro & Vista Home Premium (x86); Windows Ultimate 7600 x64 Retail
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Ohgami View Post
This is my personal favorite Mac Spoof. A bit old but still LOL

I have never seen that one. That was funny!
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19 Jul 2009   #49
Slimy

Windows 7
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Ohgami View Post
This is my personal favorite Mac Spoof. A bit old but still LOL

That's my fave as well :P
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20 Jul 2009   #50
BCXtreme

Windows 7 Home Premium x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Joshatdot View Post
That is a very god description of Apple & MS! But I would liek to add, MS usually steals or buys out another companys work/design/code. I mean look how MS-DOS and Windows first got into the market.

Watch Pirates of Silicon Valley, if any of you are old old skool computer geeks you'll love it if you haven't seen it already.
While MS does buy out other products sometimes, I disagree with the use of the words "usually" and "steals". If you want to talk about a company stealing something ... well, did you know that the iPod was not actually invented by "Steve Jobs, et al" as the patent suggests? Look it up.
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 Apple demanded Microsoft to stop its Laptop Hunters ads




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