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Windows 7: Win7 or Win10 For My First Handbuilt HEDT Effort?

08 Mar 2018   #1
BrianH

Windows 7 Professional x64
 
 
Win7 or Win10 For My First Handbuilt HEDT Effort?

Hi everybody,

My very first post on these hallowed pages, a bit long, so please be gentle I've just today joined but have dropped in over the years and always been impressed by the way you guys help people and look after each other. Put off joining for long enough so here I am.

I'm going to be building my very first computer soon - a HEDT machine with a fairly high spec. The machine I am using now (3770K, Z77 rig from 2012) was built by a shop for me to my specs. I wasn't brave enough to try building on my own but I think I am now. You tube is helping a lot to build my confidence that I can handle this. I'm not here to necessarily ask you guys what are the best components to use, although I 'might' do some of that in the future when I start to lay actual money down on the thing. I'm not a computer guru but I probably know at least 90% of everything I need to know to make my computing experience hassle free AND help out the odd other 'newer' user when called upon. From checking this forum out over the years I have learned a lot BUT I know for sure I'm not half as talented as most of the brains here.

No, I'm here today to say HI and to ask some help with a question that has me in a malaise of sorts. I LOVE Win7 as an operating system as it offers the most powerful, usable and friendly combination I've ever used. I'm a firm believer in "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". I'm not against progress by any means, of course, but the learning curve to upgrade to Win10 PLUS the horror stories of Win10 PLUS the principle of paying for it when not needed PLUS PLUS PLUS and it goes on.

The thing is, the new machine I want to build, well, apparently many of the components are optimised for Win10. Here's the barebones of my intended new system, mainly built around a need for high power video editing as well as general office use (home office):

- Asus X299 TUF Mark 1 MOBO Socket LGA2066 (the 5 year warranty is the main reason for the TUF model as is unique)

- Skylake i9 7900 CPU (lowest cost possible CPU to get the full 44 PCIe lanes)

- 32 GB Corsair Vengeance RAM

- GTX 1050/1060 or 1070 GPU (undecided about exactly which yet) - the 1080 price is unjustifiable to me.

- at least 1 NvMe M2 drive, probably Samsung 960 Pro. (512mb and/or 1GB) for OS and video work partition (one of my existing 1GB Raptors too perhaps for daily hack office work)

- Fractal Define R6 case (looks good, big for good airflow and quiet - important in an office sitting so close)

- Corsair AX860i Platinum80 Plus PSU (10 (yes TEN!) year warranty - very attractive to me)

- a 4K monitor but don't know which one yet. Much research to do on this. Any suggestions/endorsement very welcome.

So, that's the plan so far - nothing is locked in yet, except perhaps the MOBO which I really like due to the unique warranty. Everything else is geared to the current demands of video editing in 1080p however will probably need 4K capability in the medium term future (2 years?). Had much MOBO problems in the past and, as Murphy's law would have it, they were 'just' out of their pitiful 1 year or 3 year warranties at the time. TUF also has industry-best military standard components and just seems like the best made anywhere.

Now - my conundrum . . . Win7 or Win10 . . .?!

The MOBO (UEFI BIOS), CPU, NvME M2 and (I think) the GPU are all optimised and designed for Win10. I'm using the latest hardware here so it seems to make sense to use the latest OS . . . NO?

I'm wary of moving away from Win7 as I know it so well. I don't NEED a bloody new learning curve, I don't NEED a bloody hassle when updating (horror stories), I don't WANT to hand ANY money to bloody Microsoft.

So, what do you think? Will the new machine hardware play nice with Win7 SP1? I know it WILL work. I wonder though how much performance i will lose or maybe not be able to access in NvME M2 or Skylake if I don't have Win10. I suspect I will lose a good few performance enhancements offered by Win10 - is this correct? Win7 feels like a trusted, loyal and dependable old friend that has always been there for me. Win10, to my eyes and ears, is a shiny new distraction STILL yet to prove itself. Should I get into bed with the devil, because he's tempting me with a new shiny advanced world of possibilities?

Any and all leaned opinions will be very, very, very much appreciated. Cheers and thanks for any help.


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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08 Mar 2018   #2
mrjimphelps

Linux Mint 18.2 xfce 64-bit (VMWare host) / Windows 8.1 Pro 32-bit (VMWare guest)
 
 

If you're going to go with a Skylake CPU, you may have problems doing automatic updates with Windows 7. There are workarounds; but Skylake is the first Intel processor which is specifically restricted from doing Windows 7 auto updates. If you go back one or two steps to a Broadwell or Haswell, you won't have that problem.

Here's some information about the workaround on the auto updates issue:
https://www.csoonline.com/article/31...ake-ryzen.html

You sound like a great candidate for Linux Mint. Have you considered Mint? You could install VMWare Workstation Player in Mint, and then install Windows 7 in a virtual machine. You'll have so much power on this machine, you won't even notice that you're running Windows 7 in a VM. In fact, I have been wondering if running Windows 7 in a VM would in effect shield you from the auto update restrictions that are on these newer processors.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
08 Mar 2018   #3
BrianH

Windows 7 Professional x64
 
 

Thanks mrjimphelps. I didn't know about the auto update issue with Skylake. Just goes to show even after SO much research on various component there's something still to learn. I see from your screen you are a Mint devotee. I've used Mint before but only from a boot disc to help when I can't get into windows. I do recall it was an interesting OS. Unfortunately I use a number of business applications that may preclude me from getting creative with a new OS.

I have no experience with VM however I have WinXP running inside Win7 on my laptop in the good 'ol XP Mode - that works a treat. So, OK, I have another reason now to put Win10 up a notch in the comparo - thank you so much - I think(!) . . . I still love 7 so this will be hard. It may come down to head over heart in the end. Looks like the buggers are making it hard to stay with Win7. I'll have to research more re drivers for old things I have like scanners and printers and some old business progs that may not like Win10. Onwards and upwards . . . Thanks again for your help and link to the work around.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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08 Mar 2018   #4
mrjimphelps

Linux Mint 18.2 xfce 64-bit (VMWare host) / Windows 8.1 Pro 32-bit (VMWare guest)
 
 

You could go the opposite way -- run Windows 10 as your host system, then run Windows 7, Linux Mint, or whatever, in Hyper-V (virtual machine) sessions. (Hyper-V is the new name for Microsoft's virtual machine software, the one that you are running XP-Mode in.)

There is another approach that you may not have considered -- Run Windows 8.1 as your host system, with Classic Shell installed. Classic Shell will allow you to configure Windows 8.1 to look and feel exactly like Windows 7, with the advantage of receiving security updates till January 2023 (rather than January 2020 with Windows 7). I run Windows 8.1 in a virtual machine, with Classic Shell installed, and I can't tell the difference between it and Windows 7.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
08 Mar 2018   #5
BrianH

Windows 7 Professional x64
 
 

Wow, Win7 inside Win8.1 sounds interesting. I'll give that some thought, thank you. I'm feeling at the moment that Win10 is trying to take over the world and re the updates I'm feeling pressured now, LOL! aNOTHER MEMBER OF THE HOUSEHOLD HERE USES 8.1 IN THEIR LAPTOP WITH cLASSIC sHELL AND IT SEEMS GREAT - JUST LIKE 7 AS YOU SAY. (Oops, sorry, CAPS!). I suppose one way of thinking about is that if I bite the bullet now and use Win10 it will at least future proof me to 'some' degree and i won't have to face this dilemma again any time soon. Isn't Win10 the 'last and final' OS that MS will create? That's what I think I recall reading. So hopefully will mature into something less annoying. I dunno, I've much more thought and research to give this and I VERY much appreciate your input mrjimphelps.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
08 Mar 2018   #6
mrjimphelps

Linux Mint 18.2 xfce 64-bit (VMWare host) / Windows 8.1 Pro 32-bit (VMWare guest)
 
 

Microsoft claims that "Windows 10" is the last OS. But the very name "Windows 10" is deceptive. It would be more accurate to say "Windows 1509", "Windows 1703", "Windows 1709", etc. If you have what Microsoft calls "Windows 10", then you have an ever-changing version of Windows, not the static kind of Windows versions that ended with Windows 8.1.

I have Windows "10" at my job. That's more than enough for me. At home, I have Linux Mint, Linux Lite (on an old, slow computer), Windows 8.1, and Windows 7. My main computer has Linux Mint as the host OS, and Windows 7 and 8.1 each in its own virtual machine. Other than running a little slow, running Windows in a VM is no different than running it as the host OS on the computer. I only have 4 GB of RAM; but if I had more RAM, I'm sure that I wouldn't even notice that Windows was running in a VM. Having Windows in a VM allows me to run all of the software than I can't run in Linux, but which I must have.

Since you are getting a brand new computer, I suggest that you try running Linux Mint as your host OS, with Windows 8.1 (with Classic Shell) in a VM. Install all of your Windows software in the VM. Then try it for a while. You may find that that works perfectly well for you. And you can then begin to transition to Linux, finding ways to get more and more of your business requirements met with something that is available in Linux. At some point, you will have switched to Linux and will be using Windows only as needed, rather than the other way around.

But if you don't want to fool around with all of that, just run Windows 8.1 as your OS, with Classic Shell installed; and put off your "Windows 10" decision till January of 2023.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
08 Mar 2018   #7
strollin

W10 Pro desktop, W10 laptop, W10 laptop, W10 Pro tablet (all 64-bit)
 
 

Technically, MS has never said Win 10 is "the last OS". They said it is the last version of Windows, big difference. I'm sure they'll come out with another OS, it just won't be called Windows.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
08 Mar 2018   #8
BrianH

Windows 7 Professional x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by mrjimphelps View Post
Microsoft claims that "Windows 10" is the last OS. But the very name "Windows 10" is deceptive. It would be more accurate to say "Windows 1509", "Windows 1703", "Windows 1709", etc. If you have what Microsoft calls "Windows 10", then you have an ever-changing version of Windows, not the static kind of Windows versions that ended with Windows 8.1.

I have Windows "10" at my job. That's more than enough for me. At home, I have Linux Mint, Linux Lite (on an old, slow computer), Windows 8.1, and Windows 7. My main computer has Linux Mint as the host OS, and Windows 7 and 8.1 each in its own virtual machine. Other than running a little slow, running Windows in a VM is no different than running it as the host OS on the computer. I only have 4 GB of RAM; but if I had more RAM, I'm sure that I wouldn't even notice that Windows was running in a VM. Having Windows in a VM allows me to run all of the software than I can't run in Linux, but which I must have.

Since you are getting a brand new computer, I suggest that you try running Linux Mint as your host OS, with Windows 8.1 (with Classic Shell) in a VM. Install all of your Windows software in the VM. Then try it for a while. You may find that that works perfectly well for you. And you can then begin to transition to Linux, finding ways to get more and more of your business requirements met with something that is available in Linux. At some point, you will have switched to Linux and will be using Windows only as needed, rather than the other way around.

But if you don't want to fool around with all of that, just run Windows 8.1 as your OS, with Classic Shell installed; and put off your "Windows 10" decision till January of 2023.
Haha! Love the way you think. Very clearly expressed, thank you. Sounds like a great option and I've copied and pasted it to a prominent place to review again when the time comes!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
08 Mar 2018   #9
BrianH

Windows 7 Professional x64
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by strollin View Post
Technically, MS has never said Win 10 is "the last OS". They said it is the last version of Windows, big difference. I'm sure they'll come out with another OS, it just won't be called Windows.
Thanks Stollin, that's news to me. Fascinating! It is the part where they can change any part of the Win10 OS with any update so prolifically, as the have done on occasion, that scares me away from Win 10. I suppose they can do this with Win7 updates if they really wanted but it isn't too hard to read up on Win7 updates prior to installing them but from What I understand Win10 updates can carry surprises that no mere mortal can foresee. So your points are well taken, thanks.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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 Win7 or Win10 For My First Handbuilt HEDT Effort?




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