Hard drive prices - and innovation - decline

[Dallas 7]

...That's one of those: "gee if I had only...." type of days when you seem to be all prepared with every precaution and ? nothing happens! But as soon as you turn around and don't tend to some type of preparation all H breaks loose and you get caught between a rock and a hard place!

Ok, I'm getting old. The first time I read that, I saw Preparation H.

YIKES! :roflmao:

 

[jimbo45]

Hi there
Please note I said "Sufficient or Adequate Backup". This means NOT relying on a SINGLE device for keeping backups on -- you should have a MINIMUM of TWO.

Incidentally that's why I always prefer decent commercial solutions for Backup rather than the "Freebies". The Free ones are a million times better than nothing but for the small amount you pay for a decent robust piece of software that will save you so many times in time / data loss / even money it seems to me that around 45 USD is a trivially small amount of money to pay.

Remember also that you don't need to backup everything every day -- take a FULL backup every week say and then take Incrementals daily. Incremental backups are those that only backup data that has CHANGED. The commercial backup solutions enable this to be done very easily. Some of the "Freebies" might offer this facility - but some don't so check if you are using a Free utility.

Also distinguish between what you can ARCHIVE and what needs to be backed up regularly. For instance the major part of most peoples music libraries can be "archived" since these rarely change much. You have to devise a decent strategy but you don't have to willy nilly backup several TB of data every day. Archived data also doesn't have to be online either -- just have some mechanism for retrieving this data when you need it.

As for the OS -- Always Image this separately - especially before installing any software -- so if the software doesn't work just restore the system --much much better (and safer) than relying on various "registry cleaners" or "un-delete / Un-install" 3rd party stuff.

Keep the OS in its own separate partition - or separate SSD if using a small SSD. A W7 partition even for a large system with loads of applications installed doesn't need to be much more than around 50 - 60 GB. Same for W8 if you are using that too.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[Britton30]

Backups are like a gun. It's better to have one and not need it, than to need one and not have it.

 

[Night Hawk]

Besides the built in option for creating full images I went with Acronis TI which reduces the sizes of images with a degree of compression as well as back up the main drive on two other completely separate drives in case one of those goes belly up. Other things are backed up externally to prevent any possible loss or to back up other systems along with a few laptops.

Even with all that you also have to take into consideration having a worthwhile av and antimalware detection system inplace that will spot bugs hidden in things you wouldn't expect to find any in like the zip files you download for some free utility that just happens to include some uninvited guest or crapware additive you don't want!

Sloppy backups can lead to major headaches where you can lose as much as if a drive or device decides to quit on you. I-Worms are the most notorious for recoding files when they happen to be a self replicator as compared to other bugs like data collectors you can burn off. The files that get recoded may not be able to restored to a a working state depending on how much of a change was seen. Other bugs simply make as much as possible unusable.

 

[jimbo45]

Besides the built in option for creating full images I went with Acronis TI which reduces the sizes of images with a degree of compression as well as back up the main drive on two other completely separate drives in case one of those goes belly up. Other things are backed up externally to prevent any possible loss or to back up other systems along with a few laptops.

Even with all that you also have to take into consideration having a worthwhile av and antimalware detection system inplace that will spot bugs hidden in things you wouldn't expect to find any in like the zip files you download for some free utility that just happens to include some uninvited guest or crapware additive you don't want!

Sloppy backups can lead to major headaches where you can lose as much as if a drive or device decides to quit on you. I-Worms are the most notorious for recoding files when they happen to be a self replicator as compared to other bugs like data collectors you can burn off. The files that get recoded may not be able to restored to a a working state depending on how much of a change was seen. Other bugs simply make as much as possible unusable.

Hi there
Here's where W8 trumps W7 -- the built in Windows defender (re-named -- not the same as windows defender in W7) works extremely well and renders typical A/V software obsolete. (One of the few areas where W8 wins out). However if you install MSE on W7 that's probably just as good (or bad) as most AV software out there -- and of course a system should be CLEAN before it's backed up otherwise it's just junk.

MSE does Real time protection -- anything else is useless since with "after the fact discovery" you don't know exactly when the machine became infected or what the infection has done to the computer since. You should always in any case do a scan before backing up the system -- if infected restore from your previous good backup -- there is NO point using "cleansing" software as you could never be sure that its worked.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

...MSE does Real time protection -- anything else is useless since with "after the fact discovery" you don't know exactly when the machine became infected or what the infection has done to the computer since. You should always in any case do a scan before backing up the system -- if infected restore from your previous good backup -- there is NO point using "cleansing" software as you could never be sure that its worked.

Cheers
jimbo

MSE isn't the only AV that has real time protection. Avast! free not only has real time protection, it also automatically updates at boot up and several times a day at intervals you can set (something MSE doesn't). Avast! runs circles around MSE.

 

[Barman58]

One thing that is essential in any backup scheme, at the beginning, is the one that most forget - A test restore cycle. Best done before the system gets heavily populated with vital data.

You should run a restore both from the OS and from any emergency disk or partition, if nothing more than to ensure you know how it works, but also that it actually does what you expect and need.

 

[Britton30]

One thing that is essential in any backup scheme, at the beginning, is the one that most forget - A test restore cycle. Best done before the system gets heavily populated with vital data.

You should run a restore both from the OS and from any emergency disk or partition, if nothing more than to ensure you know how it works, but also that it actually does what you expect and need.

Good advice Nigel. Doesn't everyone do that? It sure helps with the operation's familiarity.

 

[Night Hawk]

Besides the built in option for creating full images I went with Acronis TI which reduces the sizes of images with a degree of compression as well as back up the main drive on two other completely separate drives in case one of those goes belly up. Other things are backed up externally to prevent any possible loss or to back up other systems along with a few laptops.

Even with all that you also have to take into consideration having a worthwhile av and antimalware detection system inplace that will spot bugs hidden in things you wouldn't expect to find any in like the zip files you download for some free utility that just happens to include some uninvited guest or crapware additive you don't want!

Sloppy backups can lead to major headaches where you can lose as much as if a drive or device decides to quit on you. I-Worms are the most notorious for recoding files when they happen to be a self replicator as compared to other bugs like data collectors you can burn off. The files that get recoded may not be able to restored to a a working state depending on how much of a change was seen. Other bugs simply make as much as possible unusable.

Hi there
Here's where W8 trumps W7 -- the built in Windows defender (re-named -- not the same as windows defender in W7) works extremely well and renders typical A/V software obsolete. (One of the few areas where W8 wins out). However if you install MSE on W7 that's probably just as good (or bad) as most AV software out there -- and of course a system should be CLEAN before it's backed up otherwise it's just junk.

MSE does Real time protection -- anything else is useless since with "after the fact discovery" you don't know exactly when the machine became infected or what the infection has done to the computer since. You should always in any case do a scan before backing up the system -- if infected restore from your previous good backup -- there is NO point using "cleansing" software as you could never be sure that its worked.

Cheers
jimbo

That was one thing I found out right away when trying out the updated form of WD(renamed from...) on the 8 CP. For once MS actually put in something that worked for a change. But it still lacks one thing you get with a paid software however namely a good firewall with the web filtering option to selectively filter things out while browsing. That alone can prevent any number of bugs from getting on in the first place.

The malware detection was there however! The SE for 7 however was never upto par according to av industry standards forcing you to attain one or more good protections. The idea of having good removers however is to prevent to need to have to restore everything from a backup or image when the bug(s) can be removed without any harm done. Infected restore points is a different matter there where turning off the feature to nuke all restore points to avoid any possible reinfection is the rule of thumb.

Between the web filtering, active protection I know works with the software here I would highly doubt I will actually use images created while I will still have them anyways for any possible "rainy day". Other events can often force the need to repair or reinstall Windows where an image can still save the day.

 

[mjf]

The problem with large HDDs (say 2TB or higher) you really need a second in case one fails. I have 2x2TB USB3 HDDs for my backups. I like to keep multiple images over periods of time using 2 different imaging programs. I'll only buy a 4TB if they become cheap enough so I can buy a second.

 

[lehnerus2000]

Agreed

I didn't think you could have too much backup while you may use up a lot of drive space or removable media at times. Hard drives never failing? HAR! That's a joke! You can have a brand new as well as old clunker drive decide to give you a major headache!

Last year, I bought a new desktop USB 1.5TB HDD (to use for backups) and it was broken. :shock:

The retailer replaced it when I took it back (2 days later).

I have 3 main desktop backup HDDs (plus two small portable HDDs) totalling ~5.5TB.
I also have a 2TB internal backup HDD in my PC.

Unfortunately I don't have any off-site storage.

Backup HDD images are also useful for testing new software programs (if you don't have a VM & VM manager).

Even after testing a program in a VM and deciding to install it on your physical machine, you may only use a program a few times, or you may discover it doesn't actually provide the benefits you first thought.

Re-imaging your PC means that there aren't any leftover bits clogging up your install.

Nowadays, I always create a backup before installing driver updates.
Driver installs/updates are infamous for causing havoc.

 

[Night Hawk]

There are literally "countless" reasons for having extra drives as well as other alternatives for backups. When going to plan out this case I had taken a drive out of the WD Essentials usb enclosure it came in and installed it internally as an extra drive for testing 7. Unfortunately any OS installed would go on but have constant issues with any program you installed!

That drive was designated for storage only back then and still sits in the old case having a full image for the Vista install first seen when replacing board, cpu, memory, and supply as both board and supply failed! Well you know a clean install had to be seen for Vista on the old main drive that wore out and was then replaced where the image restoration seemed to all go well until the new drive had an oops and still no explaination as to why the fresh install of Vista or XP at first would finish by dvd or flash drive install key for Vista or by way of cd for XP. My friend who I had set the old case up for was able to get XP on and then suddenly after only a few days "no boot device detected"!

The first drive was the main drive since that case was first new in late 2007 having seen a ton of wear and hard boots at times when first getting used to the previous version as well as testing 7! It lasted however. And then you would think? a brand new drive installed internally with adequate cooling not an external which often suffers from much higher temps failed in less then a month?

As for getting into those larger drives I first knew when going to plan out this build that a move up from a pair of 500gb OS drives as well as the extra Green Power 500 used for storage would need to be replaced by two larger 1tb OS dirves as well as now trying out a pair of Sata III drives becoming available. At first 7 went onto the S3 drive used for the main until a problem requiring a clean install came up a few times like a supply cooking a new board or changing the brand of memory used(OCZ 1.9v to Muskin 1.5v) and yet saw no problem later after the first year and a full image made and restored even six months later when again changing the memory(Mushkin Enhanced dimms sitting too high for original hsf only allowing two not four dimms to Kinston Hyper X with low profile regular height dimms) which had passed the grace period for hardware updates.

By the time last summer came along you knew it was time for a clean install knowing the system had been run since the initial image had been restored in October 2010 until then! That shows a good image can last and why that type of backup can have several advantages.

The problem comes when those one or more images just happen to be larger in size where a tb drive is cramped! One folder coming in at 358gb is also one reason why the OS drive is also a 1tb not smaller. Now imagine having several images to keep. Where are you going to put them?

The idea of swapping out the 1tbs for a pair of S3 2tbs came to mind as well as adding in one or two more drives internally for immediate access as well as for keeping images. Other backups as well as copy & paste and downloading something more then once to go to the main drive as well as a folder on each of the two storage drives insure one will be a good download in case one or two don't work out.

You backup the download as well as everything else at times not only in case of some hardware issue but software problem of some type. That would apply to why an image made is the day saved if something goes wrong with any update or new program install.