Solved Tech input needed please

[edilee012]

My system should be listed in my profile if there are questions about my hardware.

This is a 5 year old system that keeps rocking and playing all the latest games which is good since I cannot afford a new build now but I have had some issues lately and want to see if the opinion I have that the motherboard is failing sounds about right to you guys.

I will describe my issues and what I did and then what ELSE happened lol.

I have 3 hard drives- 1 system, 1 storage, and 1 for system image backup. My system drive is about 1.5-2 years old and the other two are 5 years old and have been storage related drives for that period of time so not too much heavy use on them.

About 3 months ago my storage drive kept vanishing when PC wakes from sleep and would reappear if I rebooted. Sometimes when it woke up it would act like it had just been connected like a ram drive and asking me what I wanted to do with the drive (auto play menu). My anti virus also asked it I wanted to scan it. When it did that the drive would be there, if it didn't give me the auto play menu then the drive was either there or not.

I decided to pop in a spare drive I had to see if the drive was bad causing this issue or something more sinister, even checked cabling, etc, etc. I hooked the spare drive in and rebooted and low and behold I have no video, no BIOS screen, no sound, absolutely nothing! Rechecked all connections and everything was good...I work on PC's so I know what all to check and I covered it all. I was also getting a POST beep that was 1 long 3 short which indicates video error...swapped vid cards and issue remained.

The PC was like that for 2 days and I finally totally removed the motherboard thinking I might have created or had a grounding issue that appeared with me messing around in there. Put just the basics back in to see if I could get past POST or get a different error. I also did different ram configs until finally I removed 2 sticks from the B banks and only had a vid card in the #2 PCIe slot and no more video error. Also cleared CMOS. Then all the sudden I get the BIOS screen so I set all my settings cut it off then hooked the system drive up and inserted #1 video card (SLI setup).

This time I had no video again so I removed that card and just used card #2 and got into Windows. It will run with both cards in but slot #1 produces no video and card does have power. I have swapped the cards also and they both work. This where I am now.

I was looking through the event viewer and seeing multiple HAL, Volsnap, Nvstor64, print spool, and the list goes on and on. The Nvstor64 error I have read about and I have hundreds of entries for that one happening every second for like a minute and I assume this is happening when PC wakes up. This error also was present before the vanishing hard drive problem.

My printer won't print also so I am sure it has to do with spool error.

Now my question that I already think I know the answer to is....are these signs of a failing motherboard? I mean the #1 PCIe slot will not work at all so this is an issue and in the last 2 days I have been avoiding playing games too much because I need to back up some data I think. I have my eye on a replacement motherboard identical to mine but just wanted to see if someone else thought these were signs of a mb going bad?

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Hiyya edilee at five years old mate I would be taking a close look at the PSU for starters Plus I would be checking out the caps on the board and any signs of scorch marks - I am assuming you keep the interior reasonably clean too a you work on machines.

I would also be unplugging everything and reinserting the RAM sticks GPU card etc jst to make sure they are not just dirtied sockets / slots.

Now although the PSU comes up ok with volts mate doesn't mean it has sufficient current.

While yo are at it are the temps ok in the CPU and mobo ok check it with Specy and see


http://www.piriform.com/speccy/download

 

[edilee012]

Hiyya edilee at five years old mate I would be taking a close look at the PSU for starters Plus I would be checking out the caps on the board and any signs of scorch marks - I am assuming you keep the interior reasonably clean too a you work on machines.

I would also be unplugging everything and reinserting the RAM sticks GPU card etc jst to make sure they are not just dirtied sockets / slots.

Now although the PSU comes up ok with volts mate doesn't mean it has sufficient current.

While yo are at it are the temps ok in the CPU and mobo ok check it with Specy and see


[URL="http://www.piriform.com/speccy/download"]http://www.piriform.com/speccy/download[/URL]

Temps are all dead on and I did check some of the PSU connectors and all tested good but of course that main motherboard connector could be lacking....might see if I have another PSU capable of hooking to this board for testing.

When I removed the board I cleaned everything. I have AIDA64 for monitoring temps and volts but might try Speccy as well.

 

[edilee012]

Ran Speccy and it give me the info AIDA does but I did notice both of them show the one PCIe slot that won't read my card as available so motherboard is still reading the slot is there.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Well if you can hookup a spare PSU that should at least eliminate that avenue and I am assuming that you have done all the drivers BIOS updates etc?


Just another couple of things if you haven't got them as the AV asked you to scan if that was the only scan you ran if so try these


http://www.superantispyware.com/


http://www.malwarebytes.org/products/malwarebytes_free/

If it means going the whole hog maybe a memtest and some hard drive scans too

http://www.memtest.org/ < you probably know but you will need to make a bootable disk for this.

SeaTools | Seagate

 

[gregrocker]

I agree with John that the PSU should be looked at to react that way just from plugging in a replacement HD.

But the problem with the first HD disappearing makes me wonder if you ran a Disk Check on it. I would also test it's surface condition with the maker's HD Diagnostic extended CD scan. If a HD interferes in any way it may need to have boot code wiped using Diskpart Clean Command after moving data off.

Other Troubleshooting Steps for Windows 7 to touch all bases and gather clues.

 

[edilee012]

Well if you can hookup a spare PSU that should at least eliminate that avenue and I am assuming that you have done all the drivers BIOS updates etc?


Just another couple of things if you haven't got them as the AV asked you to scan if that was the only scan you ran if so try these


http://www.superantispyware.com/


http://www.malwarebytes.org/products/malwarebytes_free/

If it means going the whole hog maybe a memtest and some hard drive scans too

http://www.memtest.org/ < you probably know but you will need to make a bootable disk for this.

SeaTools | Seagate

Anytime I hook up any removable drive my AV asks if I want to scan it...this is normal.

I agree with John that the PSU should be looked at to react that way just from plugging in a replacement HD.

But the problem with the first HD disappearing makes me wonder if you ran a Disk Check on it. I would also test it's surface condition with the maker's HD Diagnostic extended CD scan. If a HD interferes in any way it may need to have boot code wiped using Diskpart Clean Command after moving data off.

Other Troubleshooting Steps for Windows 7 to touch all bases and gather clues.

I did use the WD hard drive tool and totally wiped it (wrote zeros to entire drive) and performed quick and extended tests on it and it checked out and passed all the tests. It was then re-introduced to the system and formatted and was sitting there empty and still kept disappearing. Now tonight I did hook up that spare drive and am going to give it a couple days and see if it disappears also.

I did remember I have a lower watt ATX PSU here and I will hook it up bare as I can and see if the card works in slot #1. All monitoring programs see the slot as active and empty so the slot at least is doing something.

So many issues the last couple weeks and it is just too many all at same time....some of which just don't make sense. Will run PSU tests tomorrow evening. All my monitoring software shows all voltages are good and in their ranges but PSU's can be finicky.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

edilee mate try a surface test on that drive with Partition Wizard it scans for physical defects not just corrupt files etc Did you try the Seatools one mate - horses for courses they say

http://www.partitionwizard.com/free-partition-manager.html

 

[edilee012]

edilee mate try a surface test on that drive with Partition Wizard it scans for physical defects not just corrupt files etc Did you try the Seatools one mate - horses for courses they say

http://www.partitionwizard.com/free-partition-manager.html

Will do it. So far the spare drive has showed up everytime after resuming from sleep so maybe that drive was on its way out. Shame cause the spare is 250g and the other was a 500.

 

[gregrocker]

The preferred method if available is to test the suspect HD using Data Lifeguard Diagnostic for DOS (CD) http://www.carrona.org/hddiag.htmlextended CD scan which may have repair capabilities and will let you know its exact condition. Your reply earlier is that you used this to wipe the HD only, which is not thorough. Please follow all steps.

If pass, then move data off to wipe the HD with Diskpart Clean Command, create a full disk partition to run Disk Check.

 

[edilee012]

It is the PSU. I looked up online how to test all the connectors where it hooks to the motherboard and what the volatages should be...I had 5 plugs that were suppose to be +5V and they were +3.74V so there is the issue. Glad I looked further into this issue because I was about to purchase a replacement motherboard off of Ebay tomorrow...shew...close one!

 

[gregrocker]

Thanks for reporting back. Keep us posted.

 

[edilee012]

Well I tested the PSU unhooked from motherboard as instructed and got the low reading on the 5v...well I decided to test it while in PC running and all the leads that tested low test 5v when hooked up and machine is running. I guess PSU is ok and I am back to bidding on that board on Ebay tomorrow.

I dropped the second vid card in primary slot and checked Speccy and AIDA64 and both read the slot and show it as empty. Going to swap cards now and try it but I believe I have already did this!

 

[gregrocker]

I'll ask some of our hardware guys to take a look in here.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Hum well just cos the volts are there doesn't mean the current is edi I would take the thing out and flip on a few HDD and fans and see how it copes first.

Oh and Greg thanks for that WD ref mate - most handy

 

[edilee012]

Hum well just cos the volts are there doesn't mean the current is edi I would take the thing out and flip on a few HDD and fans and see how it copes first.

Oh and Greg thanks for that WD ref mate - most handy

I did test it with a multimeter both unhooked-running and hooked-running. For some reason it puts 3.74V on the 5V rail when unhooked and it is 5.12V while hooked and PC is running and that is on all 5V terminals in the main motherboard connector.

Swapped the vid cards and same results..something I did notice is vid card fan runs like it should but card does not get physically warm/hot when it is in the assumed dead slot. I mean it is cool so there is nothing being pushed through the card...I'm going to have to say this motherboard has some dead components and that hard drive is still there and my old one must have been bad.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

QUOTE=edilee012;2252332]

Hum well just cos the volts are there doesn't mean the current is edi I would take the thing out and flip on a few HDD and fans and see how it copes first.

Oh and Greg thanks for that WD ref mate - most handy

I did test it with a multimeter both unhooked-running and hooked-running. For some reason it puts 3.74V on the 5V rail when unhooked and it is 5.12V while hooked and PC is running and that is on all 5V terminals in the main motherboard connector.

Swapped the vid cards and same results..something I did notice is vid card fan runs like it should but card does not get physically warm/hot when it is in the assumed dead slot. I mean it is cool so there is nothing being pushed through the card...I'm going to have to say this motherboard has some dead components and that hard drive is still there and my old one must have been bad.[/QUOTE]
Hum Edi seems you have some weird things going on there with the mobo like I said volts are not current I mean take for example a car battery well it might test up 12v or whatever but come to crank the engine and there is not enough amps to do that if you get my drift, and I think you would find that cranking that engine would also drop the bottom out of the available volts.

It is a pity there is no easy way to test the slot too as I am not sure of what is data and what is supply the fan of course needs very little volts and current to run it is the GPU chip and the board it is on that is the big "eater". Maybe the mobo is the real culprit have you had a look around for any signs of scorching and if you move any components do they move even the tiniest amount as it could be down to "dry joints" which on mobos can be very hard to detect and even harder to re-solder. Plus do any of the caps look suspect it only takes one to run the thing out of whack and if at all.
Just how old is the board mate as it looks more and more like it might have to go and in that case would you consider updating the CPU as well?

Look I just had a thought why not try cleaning the slot contacts all round RAM GPU and whatever it could be just dirt on the contacts a credit card with some lint free cloth drape over the edge and just tad of ethyl or methyl alcohol on it and swipe along the slots and do the sticks and card contacts the same method (not the credit card thought LOL!!)

 

[TVeblen]

Any overclocking?

I'm agreeing with ICit2 in first suspecting that power supply. When they start to fail it can be odd behavior as the first symptoms. Here's the thing: (as John was saying) the supply could be putting out the 12v to a device but the amperage could drop under load. That could have a global effect on the system.

When you test the supply with a multimeter you can find a spare power connection and connect the meter to it, like an unused Molex plug or SATA connector. The yellow lines are 12v, red wires are 5v, and orange is 3.3v. Then watch the voltage as you use the PC. Watch as you start up, shut down, everything. What you are looking for is fluctuation. The voltage should remain steady. If it drops or rises that is a problem. If your meter has an amperage reading check that too.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Any overclocking?

I'm agreeing with ICit2 in first suspecting that power supply. When they start to fail it can be odd behavior as the first symptoms. Here's the thing: (as John was saying) the supply could be putting out the 12v to a device but the amperage could drop under load. That could have a global effect on the system.

When you test the supply with a multimeter you can find a spare power connection and connect the meter to it, like an unused Molex plug or SATA connector. The yellow lines are 12v, red wires are 5v, and orange is 3.3v. Then watch the voltage as you use the PC. Watch as you start up, shut down, everything. What you are looking for is fluctuation. The voltage should remain steady. If it drops or rises that is a problem. If your meter has an amperage reading check that too.

Hey that is a neat little side step TV I'm gonna try that next chance I get

 

[edilee012]

The test I performed on the PSU was on the 24 pin connector, some 4 pin molex, and the 6 pin video crd connectors. I did the test by activating the PSU disconnected from board and the hard drives and fans were pulling power while I did the unhooked test. This method resulted in a reading of 3.74V on all 5V plugs except the 5V standby which read 5.12V.

Last night before before I last posted I tested it while hooked up and pc running from the back side of the 24 pin connector and all 5V were reading 5.12V and 12V were reading 12.14V and 3.3V were reading 3.37V...this was under power with all components installed including my second video card and running. I am not sure why the 5 read 3.74 unhooked because I did test another PSU unhooked and its 5v read 5v while unhooked. Maybe this power supply does something different when it is unhooked and I am going to look into that here in a sec.

I had a few issues going on as I stated in original post and it seems the hard drive vanishing was in fact due to a failing drive because spare one is still there and has not went away yet. If money wasn't tight right now I was just go ahead and get a decent replacement board that most my current hardware would run on and then if problem was still there then I would get a new PSU...time for an upgrade anyways since this system just hit 5 years old.