Imaging with free Macrium

Anak said:

...I've been ignoring SSD's only because of the re-write cycles and how long will it last, I'd believe it has gotten better since they came out, but I'm not sure.

SSD write life has definitely improved. For example, a 2TB Samsung 850 EVO has a warranty of five years or 150TBW (TeraBytesWrites), whichever comes first. To use up 150TB of writes in five years, one would have to write 2.5TB a month! Add to that, most SSDs will last longer than the length of their warranty. At 1TB per month, that drive could last 12.5 years.

However, loss of write life is not the only thing that could cause an SSD to fail. The NANDs themselves and the controller could also fail. I had one 4TB Samsung 850 EVO give me problems right out of the box (it kept dropping out on me; the vendor replaced it). The chances are, though, most SSDs will last past their warranty period.

I would suggest not worrying about the reads and writes on hard drives or ssd's. What ever the reads and writes are, is what is needed. Any hard drive or ssd can go bad but most don't. So just use them. Worry about something else.
I have had hard drives, ssd, and thumb drives go bad. It happens no matter what brand is chosen.

The warranty is what I concern my self with. Is the warranty handled quickly and without jumping through loops. Saving a few dollars on hardware that most likely will last 5 years or longer is false
economics to me.

To make my life easier I use Hot Swap, which use Sata connections. Plug them in. Make a backup.
Check the backup. Unplug and remove drive. "DONE"

Icy Dock is my choice of Hot Swap bays. That is one reason I insist that my towers have 5 1/4 bays in the front.

Of course my systems are desktops, which pretty much are not designed to be portable and difficult to get through air ports with.

Jack

A 2TB Samsung 850 EVO SSD costs around Au$900 (US$700). A 2TB WD Blue is costing a little less than Au$100. A 4TB WD Blue is around Au$180. A 2TB WD Black is around Au$170 - not that you need a black for backup.
So SSDs aren't cost effective for large backup at the moment.

mjf said:

A 2TB Samsung 850 EVO SSD costs around Au$900 (US$700). A 2TB WD Blue is costing a little less than Au$100. A 4TB WD Blue is around Au$180. A 2TB WD Black is around Au$170 - not that you need a black for backup.
So SSDs aren't cost effective for large backup at the moment.

I was pointing out earlier that limited write life is no longer a cause for concern with SSDs. Cost is another story. There are a lot of variables that determine the cost effectiveness of SSDs for backups or even storage. For most of us, they do not come even close for anything other than a boot drive or the one drive in a notebook or a smaller laptop.

However, people may decide that SSDs are worth the cost for other reasons. One huge advantage is increased speed. In my case, I can update three data drive backups in just a few minutes instead of an hour or more. However, it was mostly because SSDs are much smaller and lighter. Besides taking up less room inside a computer, SSDs being used for backup drives take up far less space in storage and are far easier to transport because of their much smaller size and lighter weight. I used to carry six HDDs to and from my credit union in a Pelican case that could carry up to ten HDDs. With only six backup HDDs in it (I had two onsite and two offsite backups for each data HDD in my computer), that case was seriously heavy; heavy enough to be a danger to my old back. Anymore would have been a real pain...literally. If I had more than five HDDs in my computer, I would have had to lug around two Pelican cases (and have paramedics on standby) since that model case had room for only ten HDDs.

I also had to pull each backup HDD out of the antistatic foam "egg crate" in the drawer I kept them in, insert each one into an antistatic bag, then put it in the Pelican case. Once I got the HDDs to my Credit Union, I had to pull the HDDs out of the case and swap them out with the ones in my safe deposit box where I keep my offsite backups, then load the ones I took out of the safe deposit box into the case, lug them home, remove them from the antistatic bags, and put them back into the drawer. Adding insult to injury, my safe deposit box was already pretty darned heavy with only six HDDs in it and there wasn't much room for any more.

Now that I've gone all SSDs (I have four data drives in my computer now), I have a much smaller Pelican case that has a pair of homebrew antistatic foam "egg crates" or "pigeon holes" that will fit in it. I keep one egg crate in a much smaller drawer at home and the other in my safe deposit box. Each egg crate can hold up to 22 2.5" drives (although I doubt I'll ever put more than 16 in one, if even that many). When I need to swap out my onsite backup drives with my offsite backup drives, I just take the egg crate with the eight backup SSDs in it, put it in the smaller Pelican case, carry it to the credit union (no paramedics needed), swap out the egg crates, haul the case with the swapped out egg crate home, and put the egg crate back into the drawer. The time I spend swapping out my backup drives is considerably less, my old back no longer suffers, and I need far less room to store the drives.

Was my switch to all SSDs cost effective? Heck no! Not in my wildest dreams (unless, maybe, you factor in the cost of standby paramedics and medical expenses for a blown back). Was it worth giving up buying a new truck to pay for the darned things. For a handicapped, flatulent geriatric, oh heck yeah!

Hi,
Ideally you'd have a 1tb hdd for each machine and recycle the older images with newer ones.
The heat an hdd produces as a os drive compared to an ssd that produces next to no heat is reason enough to me to use one as a primary but as always budget rules but dependability/ reads/ writes wise it's no different
The real difference is pure performance an ssd will bring an older device to life my old M-series Gateway is a animal compared to what it was

ThrashZone said:

Hi,
Ideally you'd have a 1tb hdd for each machine and recycle the older images with newer ones.

This doesn't give you backup HDD redundancy. With Macrium you aren't likely to get confused putting all machine images on the one drive. Just have folders PC-A, PC-B... or whatever clearly identifies the individual PCs. You need the discipline to put duplicate images on another physical drive in case the other one fails.

An SSD for the OS drive is obviously the way to go. We are talking about backing up a number of system images and SSDs aren't the way to go at the moment.

Hi everyone I didn't get lost, as usual real life has slowed me down and I'm trying to absorb all the info you kind folks have posted especially Jeannie and Jack.

mjf you're accurate on those 850EVO SSD prices and that way to go would be a might salty for now so I'm leaning towards the two internal 2TB HDDs with or without docks, and having a 250GB SSD for the OS drive is an interesting angle, I could get all three for about $400.USD and an extra what $100 for the docks if I go that way, that's not too bad let me know if I'm too high or too low. TZ I'll just have to keep a closer eye on my backup recycling.

Here is a pic of 2x 2TB drives in a dual slot docking station that I use for backups inc system images. I just leave it on the end of my desk. The usb3 cable is always connected to my PC but I plug in the power adapter and turn the dock on when needed.
The extra tidy people may want it off the desk when not in use - I couldn't be bothered.

I'm anal so I prefer using internal docks for my external HDDs; they look more sanitary than external docks plus the SATA connection is faster than USB 3.0 in real world performance on my rig. I recently removed the 3.5" hot swap bay that was in my rig and replaced it with a 2.5" hot swap bay in addition to the built in 2.5" hot swap bay.



That dust you see is what has accumulated in less than a week and looks worse in the photos than in real life.

Here, I have two SSDs plugged into the hot swap bays:



I like that style of hot swap bay since I can just gently shove the drives into the slots, then just pull them out when done rather than have to horse with doors and eject mechanisms (which are often prone to breaking).

This is one of the two "egg crates" or "pigeon holes" that I store my backup drives in (the coin is a $1 USD fake gold coin):



The blue ribbons make it easier to lift the egg crates out of the drawer and Pelican case.

Are internal docks basically hot swapping cradles? I assumed that hot swap drive sata connections would need to be physically pushed in and out each time they were used resulting in wear over time on the connectors.
The drives in my external docking stations are not physically inserted and ejected very often. They get connected and disconnected by a power switch. They could be placed out of sight somewhere I guess for anal retentiveness. It would look neater!

For spinners I don't think direct sata vs usb3 data transfer rates (up to 5 Gb/s) would make a difference. I don't think spinner R/W rates come close to the usb3 limit? SSDs are a different story - you probably want sata 6 Gb/s.