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Windows 7: In Virtual XP Wrong Soundcard

18 Jul 2010   #11
Kari

 

Ok, you are right. Virtual machine can use some of the host's hardware, the drives. Nothing else.

I play some old DOS games on XP Mode, sound comes quite nicely using XP Mode's emulated SoundBlaster. Virtual machines are thought to be mostly for business use, I think playing older games is not very high on the priority lists of Virtual PC coding people.


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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18 Jul 2010   #12
mickey megabyte

ultimate 64 sp1
 
 

cheemag, kari knows what he's talking about - listen to him.

are you trying to record sound?

you won't be able to record sound inside your virtual machine no matter what hardware you have in your real machine.

if your app only works in xp, then i'm afraid you'll have to use a real xp installation. it is quite easy to have a dual-boot 7/xp system. naturally, you'll need an xp install disc and a valid serial key. a tutorial is here if you need it.

what is the particular app/problem you have? maybe we can help suggest alternatives?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
18 Jul 2010   #13
Cheemag

Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by mickey megabyte View Post
cheemag, kari knows what he's talking about - listen to him.

are you trying to record sound?

you won't be able to record sound inside your virtual machine no matter what hardware you have in your real machine.

if your app only works in xp, then i'm afraid you'll have to use a real xp installation. it is quite easy to have a dual-boot 7/xp system. naturally, you'll need an xp install disc and a valid serial key. a tutorial is here if you need it.

what is the particular app/problem you have? maybe we can help suggest alternatives?
I'm not saying he doesn't know what he is talking about - it's just that his contention that the emulation doesn't use host hardware doesn't hold water.

I am trying to run a programme which uses the DSP functions of a soundcard, not specifically to record sound.

I have at least two genuine XP install discs, one from a defunct computer and one from a rather old machine which is to be scrapped. I don't think their licences would allow them to be installed on this machine as a dual boot with Windows-7. (?)

Thanks for the link to the tutorial. I'll have a look at it later.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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18 Jul 2010   #14
mickey megabyte

ultimate 64 sp1
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Cheemag View Post
...
I'm not saying he doesn't know what he is talking about - it's just that his contention that the emulation doesn't use host hardware doesn't hold water.
do a google - 7 xp mode hardware drivers - or whatever terms you like.

yes, emulation will use your host hardware, otherwise you'll never see anything, or be able to use your mouse etc - but it can only emulate very simple basic hardware - in this case, the good old soundblaster.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by wikipedia
Virtual PC emulates the following environments:
  • Intel Pentium II (32-bit) processor (but virtualizes the host processor on Windows versions) with an Intel 440BX chipset.
  • Standard SVGA VESA graphics card (S3 Trio 32 PCI with 4 MB video RAM, adjustable in later versions up to 16 MB by manually editing a virtual machine's settings file).
  • System BIOS from American Megatrends (AMI).
  • Creative Labs Sound Blaster 16 ISA PnP. (When Vista is installed as both the host (main) and guest (virtual) operating systems, settings are synchronized with the host and audio configuration is not required.)
  • DEC 21041 (DEC 21140 in newer versions) Ethernet network card.
  • Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and earlier do not have the ability to redirect USB devices to the guest machine, although devices connected to the host OS via USB can be used as normal by Virtual PC.
  • Programs using undocumented features of hardware, exotic timings, or unsupported opcodes may not work.
i'm not sure about your license situation with xp.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
18 Jul 2010   #15
Kari

 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Cheemag View Post
I'm not saying he doesn't know what he is talking about - it's just that his contention that the emulation doesn't use host hardware doesn't hold water.
Cheemag, yes it holds the water. Your critic doesn't. Other than drives, all hardware is emulated and XP Mode can not use host's hardware. If it couldn't use the drives, it would be impossible to install and use.

Installing normal XP from your own install media is not going to solve your issue. As I have already mentioned (post #2), this issue, using emulated hardware, is not just an XP Mode issue. All virtual machines use emulated hardware, and they can not use hardware of the host (exception: drives, which are naturally needed for virtual machine to run).

IMO only solution is to install XP on a dual boot system, as Mickey already suggested.

Kari

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by mickey megabyte View Post
do a google - 7 xp mode hardware drivers - or whatever terms you like.

yes, emulation will use your host hardware, otherwise you'll never see anything, or be able to use your mouse etc - but it can only emulate very simple basic hardware - in this case, the good old soundblaster.
Mickey, it is not possible to change the emulated hardware components of a virtual machine. You have to play with you have, or not to play at all. That's what I mean when I say you can not use host's hardware.

Of course the emulated SoundBlaster uses host's soundcard to produce sound, and emulated S3 Trio GPU uses host's GPU to show the virtual machine. But that's it. It's common, accepted way to explain this saying that a virtual machine has it's own emulated hardware setup, where individual hardware components can not be changed (again, exeption the drives of the host).
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Jul 2010   #16
Cheemag

Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
 
 

[QUOTE=mickey megabyte;850373]
Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by Cheemag View Post
...
I'm not saying he doesn't know what he is talking about - it's just that his contention that the emulation doesn't use host hardware doesn't hold water.
do a google - 7 xp mode hardware drivers - or whatever terms you like.

yes, emulation will use your host hardware, otherwise you'll never see anything, or be able to use your mouse etc - but it can only emulate very simple basic hardware - in this case, the good old soundblaster.

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by wikipedia
Virtual PC emulates the following environments:
  • Intel Pentium II (32-bit) processor (but virtualizes the host processor on Windows versions) with an Intel 440BX chipset.
  • Standard SVGA VESA graphics card (S3 Trio 32 PCI with 4 MB video RAM, adjustable in later versions up to 16 MB by manually editing a virtual machine's settings file).
  • System BIOS from American Megatrends (AMI).
  • Creative Labs Sound Blaster 16 ISA PnP. (When Vista is installed as both the host (main) and guest (virtual) operating systems, settings are synchronized with the host and audio configuration is not required.)
  • DEC 21041 (DEC 21140 in newer versions) Ethernet network card.
  • Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and earlier do not have the ability to redirect USB devices to the guest machine, although devices connected to the host OS via USB can be used as normal by Virtual PC.
  • Programs using undocumented features of hardware, exotic timings, or unsupported opcodes may not work.
Thank you ... so it CAN and does use host hardware.
Except that, in the case of the sound card it cannot use external inputs such as LineIn and Mic.

Quote:
i'm not sure about your license situation with xp.
The usual. You can only use that system disc on the machine it was originally tied to, even if that machine is defunct and the OS out-of-date. Would have thought the UK/EU's Unfair Terms in Contracts legislation would have outlawed that.

Might be able to get round it though ...
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Jul 2010   #17
Kari

 

Absurd.

Last time:

All virtual machines installed on Virtual PC use emulated hardware devices. A virtual machine can not use hardware devices (exception: drives) of the host computer. Virtual machine uses resources of the host's devices for the emulation, for instance emulated SoundBlaster audio device directs the output to the sound device of the host computer, but virtual machine is not able to use that device directly.

It's very clear you don't like what I'm saying. Nevertheless, that is how a virtual machine works, and it isn't my fault. There is absolutely no way to use other audio device on virtual XP, be it XP Mode or any other virtual XP installation.

10-7, bailing out.

Kari
My System SpecsSystem Spec
19 Jul 2010   #18
Barman58

Windows 10 Pro x64 x3, Ubuntu
 
 

This is untried by me, and therefore for reference only

The only way of getting around the virtual hardware in a VM that I am aware of is the use of USB devices which should transparently work as designed within the VM. There are available USB sound cards which may enable functions within the VM that are not normally available - this would of course depend on the hardware involved.

In a last resort scenario where functions are required and a native XP is not an option this may be worth checking out
My System SpecsSystem Spec
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 In Virtual XP Wrong Soundcard




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