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Windows 7: Any way to make folders in Start Menu - All Programs expandable

16 Jun 2010   #1
zamar21

Win 7
 
 
Any way to make folders in Start Menu - All Programs expandable

Any way or hack to make folders in Start Menu - All Programs expandable withing All Programs Pan on mouse hover instead of mouse click, or cascadable on mouse hover? The only way I found mentioned is to use command line utility mklink for each folder you want to add expandable (or cascadable - I didn't try) to All Programs.

Open Command Prompt in %AppData%\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu and enter the command:
mklink /D <Name to Pin as> <Target folder to pin>

For example, to pin Program Files, type:
mklink /D "Program Files" "%ProgramFiles%"

Is there a way to make it simpler and working for any folder already in Start Menu? All Programs folder in Start Menu is expandable by default: what registry setting delivers that? Can the same setting be auto added to any new folder under All Programs? And how to convert the existing ones?

P.S. I just tried mklink on the example above, and it simply pinned the folder without making it expandable. Probably, some switches should be added when running mklink to allow that?


My System SpecsSystem Spec
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16 Jun 2010   #2
dunfiddlin

 

I'm sorry but it doesn't matter how many times and in how many different ways you ask this question, the answer isn't going to change. It can't be done! If you want cascades that much, go back to XP!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
16 Jun 2010   #3
zamar21

Win 7
 
 

First of, the thread was created by Admin from my post in the relevant thread. Second, there is no such thing in software development, like you say. It just reflects your personal knowledge and experience, nothing else. Proof or explanation would help, if you have one. Why would MS intentionally block this from being modified - motive pls? Why would mouse hover instead of click represent a major threat? What about "mad scientist" approach - I'm not looking for a Menu option or program. I also tried to find Win 7 Shell Team's or another relevant Blog to ask this question - any link?
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16 Jun 2010   #4
dunfiddlin

 

Well let's put the shoe on the other foot. Why would MS add reams of circuitous code to allow you to bypass most of the new features of their brand new OS? What's in it for them? Especially given that there's a huge range of third-party docks, program launchers, classic start menus and who wots what else available if you don't like the MS start menu.

If you want proof, then simply ask the guy who authored Classic Start Menu why he created an entirely separate program to bypass the MS coding rather than modify it? A large part of the OS now depends on embedded and encrypted style sheets. Unless you have access to MS secrets at a level we mere mortals cannot even dream of (or are happy to face charges of industrial espionage!) this makes some things not merely difficult but essentially impossible to change. You don't have to like it but you do have to lump it!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
16 Jun 2010   #5
zamar21

Win 7
 
 

This "feature request" isn't new. There were tons of complaints about Start Menu folders not expandable in Vista either. What I'm missing so far is MS motive to keep it non-expandable and non-cascadable on mouse hover, but ONLY clickable - must click to see the content. How it improves user experience, the benefits pls! How adding such option to Start Menu Prefs can harm MS - the option, users ask and ask about for years? If they want to differentiate newer software from previous one, there is a better way to do it: not by imposing senseless minor customization limitations, but making it more functional and flexible to adapt to every taste. If a folder is expandable on mouse hover, it won't make new Windows version unrecognizable - it will only make MS product look smarter and feel more efficient to use.

May be they just want to sell more Mouse devices, since these get broken a lot faster from ongoing clicks? What about pure user fingers and resulting professional diseases? What about user experience feedback, they get from sites like this one? Start Menu is the face of Windows, the most often used feature. Why not take user experience as its improvement guide? Not everything invented in the past gets obsolete by default - not for their prime user base. On purpose introduced inconvenience would never serve as sign of innovation or major difference, worth to spend money for. In fact, expand folders on mouse hover can look as a breakthrough in Windows efficiency.
My System SpecsSystem Spec
16 Jun 2010   #6
dunfiddlin

 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by zamar21 View Post
This "feature request" isn't new. There were tons of complaints about Start Menu folders not expandable in Vista either. What I'm missing so far is MS motive to keep it non-expandable and non-cascadable on mouse hover, but ONLY clickable - must click to see the content. How it improves user experience, the benefits pls! How adding such option to Start Menu Prefs can harm MS - the option, users ask and ask about for years? If they want to differentiate newer software from previous one, there is a better way to do it: not by imposing senseless minor customization limitations, but making it more functional and flexible to adapt to every taste. If a folder is expandable on mouse hover, it won't make new Windows version unrecognizable - it will only make MS product look smarter and feel more efficient to use.

May be they just want to sell more Mouse devices, since these get broken a lot faster from ongoing clicks? What about pure user fingers and resulting professional diseases? What about user experience feedback, they get from sites like this one? Start Menu is the face of Windows, the most often used feature. Why not take user experience as its improvement guide? Not everything invented in the past gets obsolete by default - not for their prime user base. On purpose introduced inconvenience would never serve as sign of innovation or major difference, worth to spend money for. In fact, expand folders on mouse hover can look as a breakthrough in Windows efficiency.
I don't suppose you've considered the possibility that the silent majority actually like it this way and this is reflected in the feedback MS gathered? Those who have no reason to complain have no reason to post whining forum messages or make noise about it.

The fact is that everything you want was available in XP and yet they didn't continue with it. Since we're both agreed that MS is interested in selling the most units possible I can only conclude either that it is indeed a very small though very loud minority that wants it and it really wasn't in MS's commercial interest to include it for so insignificant a percentage of its users or that coding both options is just hugely impractical for some reason. Either way, the ease with which the start menu can be simply bypassed with third-party applications certainly doesn't make it a big enough deal for them to rework the whole package at this stage. Nor it would appear is it a big enough deal for the whiners to actually hold up on going from XP to 7 so that they can continue their bliss!
My System SpecsSystem Spec
16 Jun 2010   #7
zamar21

Win 7
 
 

Its hardly possible to collect feedback from "silent majority", as you put it. Look for example, what MS Tech pros say about this on Technet. I do understand however, resent revenue figures from Win 7 sales don't prompt for any improvement. As to impracticality, given options already in Start Menu Prefs, there would be really no big difference. Show me one single post that says "clicking on each folder in All Programs is a lot better than mouse hover expansion." If that was the case, why All Programs folder expands on mouse hover?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
17 Jun 2010   #8
dunfiddlin

 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by zamar21 View Post
Its hardly possible to collect feedback from "silent majority", as you put it. Look for example, what MS Tech pros say about this on Technet. I do understand however, resent revenue figures from Win 7 sales don't prompt for any improvement. As to impracticality, given options already in Start Menu Prefs, there would be really no big difference. Show me one single post that says "clicking on each folder in All Programs is a lot better than mouse hover expansion." If that was the case, why All Programs folder expands on mouse hover?
All Programs isn't a folder and it doesn't expand. And I wrote almost exactly that in one of the threads here a few days ago so I'm fairly confident that I can show you a single one. The Technet thread does not appear to be unanimous by any means and even if it were, so what? I've never tried to pretend that there are some people who don't like the way W7 does things. I merely wonder why, knowing that this was never going to be available to them, they went ahead and spent cash on an upgrade which they apparently hated! XP is a thoroughly serviceable OS which I would still be using if it was not for a generous gift. So why abandon it for something which you consider inferior?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
17 Jun 2010   #9
zamar21

Win 7
 
 

Quote   Quote: Originally Posted by dunfiddlin View Post
So why abandon it for something which you consider inferior?
I never said that. In fact, Win 7 is working very well, and its UI (which is a small part of it's code) is way better in many aspects compare to Win XP. What I'm saying, there was no need to abandon such proven features as cascadable folders in Start Menu, even so their look and feel could be different from XP folders, and that feature could be switched off by default to make an impression of an entirely different and thoroughly reworked OS (if UI can be a solid indicator of that - probably for some users ). As well, there was no folder expansion within XP Start Menu Pan on Mouse Hover, so your reference to that is strange, so to speak. But it should be in Win 7, because its a better more productive and convenient way to browse start menu, and the UI team is supposed to concentrate namely on these targets for the next SP. As to "never will be", its laughable, as everything in this world is in relative terms, not absolute. If All Programs is not a folder or shortcut to a user's Programs folder, how would you call this folder: C:\Users\Your_Name\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs ?
My System SpecsSystem Spec
17 Jun 2010   #10
zamar21

Win 7
 
 

Btw, if anyone wants to make a suggestion to MS on any improvement in Win 7, you can do it using this Feedback Form:

Give Us Feedback for Windows 7
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 Any way to make folders in Start Menu - All Programs expandable




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