More Than 3 Out of 4 Enthusiasts Reject Windows 8

[SIW2]

It is like buying a truck and reducing the discomfort, noise and other annoyances.

 

[Indianatone]

Wow, this thread is still going...

Anyway I got free copy of Windows 8 pro, than bought a copy for $39.99. That said, I installed a copy under VM Ware, and after playing with it a bit.... I haven't touched it for about a month and a half now.

I bought a copy of 8 pro and have it set up looking just like Windows 7. I can see no point in Metro Apps except 1, the MAP APP is excellent.:huh:

Maybe I'm getting to old, but I have no patience for a tablet based OS on a desktop. Unless Microsoft does something to drastically boost the OS, I see this as an experiment gone bad. I'm not even sure ME (Windows Millennium Edition) flopped this bad but...???
Agree absolutely

That said, the future of computing is going the way of the tablet/mobile computing so any OS producer would be crazy not to embrace now. Perhaps this is what Microsoft is trying with Window 8.

At any rate I wouldn't hold my breath that Microsoft is going to abandon the W8 strategy, they may just change the approach with the new OS; that is make it two prong - one for business/desktop users, the other for mobile business and consumer use.

That would be sensible. XP was available in Home and Pro versions. Prior to that the NT versions were for power users and business and the 9X series were for home users and games.

I think with Windows 8, Microsoft tried to force too much of the mobile side on desktop users. Perhaps they could have left it a little more desktop friendly. This forced approach on desktop users is what's killing the OS as we shouldn't be forced to sign up for Microsoft accounts in order to use our desktops. I understand the concept (mobile computing), but we're not there yet.

BTW I do have a Microsoft Live account, but I'm not ready to put all my business in the cloud just yet.
The recent certificate debacle cements this as the cloud is not reliable, look outside some days no clouds.

Honestly I don't know where 8 will wind up at, but it sure isn't inspiring many to move like 7, or even Vista did. As I've said many times, this is the first OS I've not jumped on. Even ME made me jump.
You can pry Windows 7 from my cold dead hands.
My two cents.

Great Post, thanks Tony.

 

[jimbo45]

By making it "Look like W7" in a way is almost tantamount to saying -- I'll buy a Ferrari but I want it to "look and feel" just like a Chevy or a pick up.

Hey Jimbo - love your posts. But I don't think this is an apt metaphor for Windows 7 versus Windows 8.

I see it more as a Ferrari in both cases. But in the upscale model, they've taken away all of the dashboard and console controls and put some of them in the center of steering wheel and the rest are hidden in the ashtray. Then they declared the users should like this much better because it's less cluttered.

Hi there
Thanks .

All I was trying to say really here is that if people are comfortable with Windows 7 continue to use it - however if one can actually just take a "Time out" there are some good features built in to W8 that for a lot of people merit decent consideration -- and with a relatively small amount of work you can actually make W8 behave as a desktop OS without changing the way you work very much at all -- although the initial set up is a bit fiddly.

On the downside for a lot of people is the GUI etc - but on the plus side you get a much more SECURE OS, better hardware support, decent recovery, built in History file changes so it's easy to restore previous versions of files without having to resort to 3rd party backups etc, a proper backup system THAT WORKS, Native VHD image mounting and booting, virtual ISO support so you don't need things like daemon tools etc any more and generally an optimized kernel which definitely does boot and run slicker than W7 in most cases.

At the enterprise level you also get the very useful "Windows to Go" facility - this creates a bootable complete Windows system on to an external USB stick or Disk which will boot and run from almost any conceivable hardware where you can boot from a USB device -- and it's a COMPLETE Windows system where you can install and run applications just like you are running from the Windows "C" drive == it's BETTER than a "Live CD" since it's a real running system.

For roving consultants this is actually very useful -- for example I can have OFFICE 2010 in English on my Windows to go system even if say the basic installed version of Office in the workplace is say FRENCH and version 2007. The I.T people don't have to support 10 zillion versions of office in 200 different languages for example

Some people will like the new OS, others will hate it --- welcome to planet Earth -- Humans always disagree about things -- and why not.

What I've tried to point out that some of the perceived problems with W8 can be overcome without a humungous load of hassle -- now if you don't want to bother --that's fine and I'm sure an SP2 of W7 will have to appear in due course since W7 isn't going away any time soon --

However Mobile and touch devices will become much more prevalent even in "Classical workplaces" so Ms designing an OS to incorporate these devices doesn't IMO seem a bad idea,

Now a load of people don't like this first iteration -- but wait and see what happens later -- XP was universally condemned when it appeared --now people are STILL baying for Ms's blood because they want to keep using it forever.

Anyway I've said my bit -- I'm not Rubbishing W7 in any way shape or form -- I'm just trying to say that you CAN use W8 in almost the same fashion as you use W7 but it requires a small amount of work to do it.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[LittleJay]

Anyway I've said my bit -- I'm not Rubbishing Windows 7 in any way shape or form -- I'm just trying to say that you CAN use W8 in almost the same fashion as you use Windows 7 but it requires a small amount of work to do it.

I totally agree. I have the Windows 7 start menu installed on my Windows 8 installation and it works just like Windows 7, but with added security features.

 

[Indianatone]

The Linux program library (in Mint) contains over 60.000 programs. There is something for everybody. I have done video editing, Impress (like PowerPoint) presentations, etc. These programs are just as good as the Windows equivalents. You just have to get used to them.

Even the system oriented programs are similar. E.g. Bleachbit is very similar to CCleaner. Installing and uninstalling programs is even easier than in Windows. So there is very little to complain about - if anything, it is the complex Terminal (command prompt). That takes some time to fathom.

I run my Linux distros in virtual. So backup is simple - I just copy the VMware folder to a backup disk. Right now my host system is still Windows 7. But a Linux host is also supported by VMware Player.

At the moment my Linux Virtual Machines are for learning and fooling with. No biggie if I beak it, delete and restore copy. These are running on Windows 7 with VMWare. In the future if the direction chosen by M$ continues I'll be running Windows 7 in a Linux virtual machine. I learnt windows in and out and if I applied it to Linux I am sure I could tweak it to my hearts content. Windows has become an OS of all trades and a master of none.

 

[sygnus21]

i see it more as a ferrari in both cases. But in the upscale model, they've taken away all of the dashboard and console controls and put some of them in the center of steering wheel and the rest are hidden in the ashtray. then they declared the users should like this much better because it's less cluttered.

lol

@ Indianatone, thanks.

 

[Bertison]

If it was the case that Ms just did not want to believe that most of us have rejected Windows 8, that must be glaringly apparent to them by now.

The conclusion is obvious that they are just going ahead with all the usual hype, moving the deckchairs around whilst the iceberg looms ahead unseen, amidst a fog of their own making.

I appreciate that there are is quite a sizeable minority who actually like 8, but I like and use desktops, so do many millions more, and the take-up of 8 (as opposed to the number of licenses issued) proves that I am in the majority.

This can really hurt Ms, and I do not like the thought of that. I learned all that I know with Windows, from 3.1 onwards, and many more Microsoft products. That is true of most computer users on the planet. Anything that might affect the ability of the company to progress beyond this glaring mistake, will result in other companies making inroads into Ms' market share. Once that kind of thing happens, it's a long, long way to fall.

 

[whs]

I don't think there is anything wrong with

other companies making inroads into Ms' market share

That will keep them on the ball.

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

I don't think there is anything wrong with

other companies making inroads into Ms' market share

That will keep them on the ball.

It hasn't yet.

 

[SIW2]

LOL.

Hard to tell if they know it is coming and that is why there is this urgency to cash in on their captive customers now.

Or, if they are trying to get them tied in to MS online - making it difficult to move elsewhere.

Or both.

 

[jimbo45]

If it was the case that Ms just did not want to believe that most of us have rejected Windows 8, that must be glaringly apparent to them by now.

The conclusion is obvious that they are just going ahead with all the usual hype, moving the deckchairs around whilst the iceberg looms ahead unseen, amidst a fog of their own making.

I appreciate that there are is quite a sizeable minority who actually like 8, but I like and use desktops, so do many millions more, and the take-up of 8 (as opposed to the number of licenses issued) proves that I am in the majority.

This can really hurt Ms, and I do not like the thought of that. I learned all that I know with Windows, from 3.1 onwards, and many more Microsoft products. That is true of most computer users on the planet. Anything that might affect the ability of the company to progress beyond this glaring mistake, will result in other companies making inroads into Ms' market share. Once that kind of thing happens, it's a long, long way to fall.

Hi there.

Actually if you analyse the engineering the Titanic would have done MUCH BETTER to crash head first on to the 'berg rather than side swipe it. Even if the ship had been "holed" sinking time would have taken much longer --if it sank at all -- and people could have survived by standing on the 'berg rather than have ZERO chance of survival when thrown into water barely above 0 deg. So maybe the analogy with the Titanic isn't a good one -- Ms might be trying to crash head first into the 'berg.

(At the speed the ship was going and the rate at which it was sinking they were far too far away from the 'berg to turn around and sail back to it to use it as a life raft although I don't think that was ever mentioned as a possibility. It was foggy and they had no Radar of course so they probably wouldn't have been able to find it even if someone wanted to go back to it again).

Your statistics are also a little bit dubious -- just because someone hasn't upgraded doesn't in any shape or form mean they've "Rejected" the new OS. If you have a perfectly good capable running machine why go through all the hassle of upgrading to a new OS.

People on these Forums will try new gear and software out because they are presumably much more interested in computers than the average person out there -- If I'm basically doing email, surfing the web, maybe a spread sheet or two, a bit of word processing, maybe some multi-media playing (Music / videos / DVD's etc) and possibly even a power point application and I'm running W7 why should I even THINK of changing what runs quite nicely thankyou. That IMO would tend to be the attitude of a load of people out there now --they really don't care what OS is on their system --they just want to turn it on and expect it to work.

People are much more "Financially challenged" these days and things like new computers or upgrading to a new version of Windows come low on their priorities. This isn't a case of "Rejecting" the new OS per se but just a real appraisal of their financial priorities at the moment.

Some people I know who in the past would use a computer for nearly everything hardly use them at all - preferring tablets / ipads / smart phones and the only time they might use a computer is when they are at work and even here not everybody actually uses a computer at work.

We shall see what happens when the economy improves -- as it will --it always does (might take a while though) in spite of the Politicians and Banks.

In 3 or 4 years again the whole computing scene will be very different from todays -- that's for sure.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[PooMan UK]

In 3 or 4 years again the whole computing scene will be very different from todays -- that's for sure.

Cheers
jimbo

Yeah but so will the windows OS ... by this time we will be discussing Win 12

I just don't see the point in spending money on getting the latest OS then not liking it and spending hours on trying to hack the crap out of it to make it look and work like the OS that a vast majority preferred before ... if its not broken don't fix it.
It's quite plain to see that MS have lost a massive market share to apple, so it is plain to see that this complete change is mostly financially driven, and not necessarily in the best interest of the users.
Why do apple have a different OS on the ipad to the mac? Why can't MS do the same? I'm an IT technician but I'm also a Graphic artist, and it's virtually impossible for me to do graphics on a touch screen alone (believe me I've tried)
If a car company took away the steering wheel (start button) and replaced it with a joystick and the majority of people didn't like it, I bet you they'de revert back to a steering wheel pretty quick, but MS seem to have this mentality that there is no where else to go so we have to conform to what they say is best for us.

 

[jimbo45]

In 3 or 4 years again the whole computing scene will be very different from todays -- that's for sure.

Cheers
jimbo

Yeah but so will the windows OS ... by this time we will be discussing Win 12

I just don't see the point in spending money on getting the latest OS then not liking it and spending hours on trying to hack the crap out of it to make it look and work like the OS that a vast majority preferred before ... if its not broken don't fix it.
It's quite plain to see that MS have lost a massive market share to apple, so it is plain to see that this complete change is mostly financially driven, and not necessarily in the best interest of the users.
Why do apple have a different OS on the ipad to the mac? Why can't MS do the same? I'm an IT technician but I'm also a Graphic artist, and it's virtually impossible for me to do graphics on a touch screen alone (believe me I've tried)
If a car company took away the steering wheel (start button) and replaced it with a joystick and the majority of people didn't like it, I bet you they'de revert back to a steering wheel pretty quick, but MS seem to have this mentality that there is no where else to go so we have to conform to what they say is best for us.

Hi there
Market share Loss to Apple --- that's a laugh if you look at the stock prices.
AAPL is getting absolutely crucified in the markets as investors don't see any new profitable income stream coming from AAPL and todays price is the 52 week LOW,

They don't have a corporate market like Ms does, the Ipod is virtually dead - music can be supplied very easily now on smart phones with micro SD cards in them, the Ipad is getting challenged by new competitors, the Iphone is perceived as decidedly "Uncool" now and even the ITunes model is getting challenged by alternative services like Spotify etc. All AAPL have now are the Macbooks --nice though they are they are HIDEOUSLY expensive for most people and will remain a small niche market.

Enc Stock graphs of AAPL (Apple inc - or "The Fruit Company") and MSFT (Microsoft corporation) . Prices are from the US market.

AAPL Todays price 430.47 down another 10 USD. 52 week range 730-430 !!! Down down down.

MSFT Todays price 27.95 up 0.15. 52 week range 32-26 reasonably stable and off the bottom.

Your other point -- perfectly valid -- if your current system does what you want it to do efficiently and you are happy with it - don't upgrade -- nobody is forcing you to.

Plenty of people are still running Windows 98 !! so you don't always have to upgrade every time something new appears.

I'm perfectly happy with my car even if it is around 12 years old -- can see no purpose at all in buying a new one even though my old one doesn't have Sat Nav, or even a Radio in it !!.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[PooMan UK]

Like you've said before pal, allot of what you read online is sometimes speculation and hype... just because the share price drops doesn't mean your smaller than the opposition

Apple is now worth more than Microsoft and Google combined | Mail Online

Apple Now Worth More than Google and Microsoft Combined

Your other point -- perfectly valid -- if your current system does what you want it to do efficiently and you are happy with it - don't upgrade -- nobody is forcing you to.

Plenty of people are still running Windows 98 !! so you don't always have to upgrade every time something new appears.

Actually MS are forcing us to upgrade .... if a system bites the dust and you have to purchase a new unit MS make it very difficult to downgrade to an OS that you prefer, point in case have you tried to install win7 on a new unit that comes with win8, it isn't a walk in the park and not very pleasant for someone with no IT knowledge.
I've sold 12 pc's in the last month (all with win8 OEM) of the 12, 10 people purchased an additional retail win7 so they could downgrade, and 1 got me to change win8 to classic win7 shell http://www.classicshell.net/ because he couldn't get his head around win8

 

[SIW2]

Those share prices can be very misleading.

However, I think it is the case that Apple will find it tough to grow at anything like their previous rate.

That is good for us - it means Uncle Tim might be prepared to take chances and really go for it.

nice though they are they are HIDEOUSLY expensive for most people and will remain a small niche market.

Are you sure?


While we are talking Apple - they had a great Xmas - that shows if you make a product people really want, they will buy it. That is not happening with win 8 is it ?

 

[PaulGo]

Windows 8 fails to impress holiday shoppers

Following the seemingly tepid launch of Windows 8, critics were told to wait until after the holiday shopping season was over to properly assess Microsoft’s (MSFT) newest operating system. The latest monthly numbers from analytics firm Net Applications are in and Windows 8 usage remains low.

Full article at:

Windows 8 usage: February 2013 numbers remain low | BGR

 

[lehnerus2000]

Share prices are a sick joke

AAPL Todays price 430.47 down another 10 USD. 52 week range 730-430 !!! Down down down.

MSFT Todays price 27.95 up 0.15. 52 week range 32-26 reasonably stable and off the bottom.

Those share prices can be very misleading.

It's been many years since the share price reflected actual business/economic reality.
"Any resemblance to reality is purely coincidental and unintended."

The stock market is just a casino, where the rich gamble with other people's money.

However, I think it is the case that Apple will find it tough to grow at anything like their previous rate.

Agreed.

 

[jimbo45]

It seems Windows 7 is here to stay, wherever Microsoft want Windows 7 to stay or not, Windows 8's UI has become too touchscreen orientated, and I've even struggled to find files and programs Windows 8 due to the metro Start Menu.

Hi there
try some of these

15 Essential Windows 8 Keyboard Shortcuts

Note also once you've booted the system you NEVER need to look at or use either metro or the start screen AGAIN even without using a 3rd party product. Takes a little time but can be done.

cheers
jimbo

 

[jimbo45]

AAPL Todays price 430.47 down another 10 USD. 52 week range 730-430 !!! Down down down.

MSFT Todays price 27.95 up 0.15. 52 week range 32-26 reasonably stable and off the bottom.

Those share prices can be very misleading.

It's been many years since the share price reflected actual business/economic reality.
"Any resemblance to reality is purely coincidental and unintended."

The stock market is just a casino, where the rich gamble with other people's money.

However, I think it is the case that Apple will find it tough to grow at anything like their previous rate.

Agreed.

Hi there
If you really think the stock market bears no relation to reality--well I just hope you don't ever have to worry about getting a pension in future years.

In ANY activity there's always a certain amount of speculation, downright fraud and risk --that can't be avoided -- but in general successful companies (known as "Blue Chips") do have their success reflected in the Markets and failure is also rooted out very quickly --just look at the once might Kodak for example.

The Stock market actually mirrors the economic status very well over any decent period you care to take. Where I would partially agree with you is how some people get HUMUNGOUS rewards for downright failure - for example Bank bonuses etc or how privatized utility companies award their CEO's almost OBSCENE amounts of money while charging such high rates for Energy that some people have to chose between "Heating and Eating" -- and it's 2013 --21 st century where this still goes on incredibly. - Just look at British Gas for example (actually known as CENTRICA).

I'm NOT a socialist or of any particular political persuasion -- but I DO understand unlike a load of people that the Stock market plays a very important part in economic activity --for some companies it's THE ONLY WAY to raise often Huge volumes of cash needed to finance development projects or large infrastructure work.

Often Governments just don't have the money and even if they did would you want always for your invention to be vetted by a Civil servant before getting any investment cash - however the the markets supply a method where a company can get finance world wide.

The private companies can sink or swim by taking their own risks -- as a taxpayer I don't see why a govt should get involved with most private entrepreneurial schemes anyway.

Of course there will always be some nefarious practices such as "Boiler House", Market manipulation via "Insider Trading", and downright scams such as "The South Sea Bubble" and the "Dutch Tulip Crash" but on the whole the markets are regulated reasonable and getting better all the time - and people DO go to jail for LONG periods if they break the rules.

Enjoy these !!!

South sea Bubble

http://www.stock-market-crash.net/south-sea-bubble/

Boiler House scams

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/investing/article-1607734/Boiler-room-scams-shares-rip-offs.html

Dutch Tulip Crash (circa 1635)

http://www.stock-market-crash.net/tulip-mania/

Cheers
jimbo

 

[Lone Browncoat]

Hey PaulGo! Love your Avatar!

Were you a die-hard Atari ST/TT/Falcon user?
I was.

[-
Plenty of people are still running Windows 98 !! so you don't always have to upgrade every time something new appears.
Cheers
jimbo

True I was a die-hard Windows 2000 Professional user until Adobe,Java,Mozilla et al got into using VC 2010++ and then the support upgrades stopped working, even though there are three or four guys working their butts off here;
Windows NT4 / 2000 / 2003 - MSFN Forum
to keep 2000 alive, I just got tired of tweaking using the unofficial updates, surrendered and installed XPPro, as it was most familiar with the classic theme [though I liked and kept the XP start menu] and now in the process of learning W7's differences in preparation for migrating. Good thing I've always used the PortableApps suite since it came out, keeps me from having to re-install all my main work apps so I just need to install the OSs and supporting utilities.

If you click one domain up you can find the Win'98 users and see their approaches.
-Later