6 months now and still no solution to audio Crackling/Popping/Dropouts

[ICIT2LOL]

Ok mate well the SSD I think I am right in saying doesn't have drivers I saw that a few days ago on another thread and I have four in use in my machines I certainly haven't had to download any. The only thing with SSD's really is the firmware.

I was thinking maybe if it was a spinner then the inner mechanisms were worn out or wearing out.

Temps fine in fact the CPU is really good for a laptop.

Now the RAM usage is fairly high and I am wondering how much RAM the machine will take - that depends on the chipset supporting say 8GB.

Now the other thing we could do is a memory test because the DDR2 is fairly old but still ok. Did you try reseating the stick/s ? if not try that and then if it still persists a memtest is in order.

For that you will need to make a bootable disk from this Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool and let it run for at least 8 passes.

Just download that test burn to a disk and then set the BIOS to boot from the optical.

 

[thedoc735]

Ok mate well the SSD I think I am right in saying doesn't have drivers I saw that a few days ago on another thread and I have four in use in my machines I certainly haven't had to download any. The only thing with SSD's really is the firmware.

I was thinking maybe if it was a spinner then the inner mechanisms were worn out or wearing out.

Temps fine in fact the CPU is really good for a laptop.

Now the RAM usage is fairly high and I am wondering how much RAM the machine will take - that depends on the chipset supporting say 8GB.

Now the other thing we could do is a memory test because the DDR2 is fairly old but still ok. Did you try reseating the stick/s ? if not try that and then if it still persists a memtest is in order.

For that you will need to make a bootable disk from this Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool and let it run for at least 8 passes.

Just download that test burn to a disk and then set the BIOS to boot from the optical.

Kwitel already said that the problem goes away when the network is disabled. I have the same problem, but I don't want to have to disable the network connection every time I listen to music. Surely if it was a memory or CPU issue it would effect much more than just the audio output? Maybe the PC/laptop wouldn't even boot properly (maybe not at all) if the memory/CPU was faulty? All my drivers are up to date on windows 7. Also using pentium 4 CPU/DDR2 3Gb. All other functions work perfectly. Thanx!
The network card is a tenda W322p/PCI.
The same problem exists with either the motherboard on-board sound, or seperate sound card.
It sounds like a fast repetitive stutter similar to a vinyl LP styli that has got stuck in one groove over and over again; e.g. "gra-gra-gra-gra-grateful".
It's definitely a high dpc latency thing, but what to do?

 

[kwitel]

Ok mate well the SSD I think I am right in saying doesn't have drivers I saw that a few days ago on another thread and I have four in use in my machines I certainly haven't had to download any. The only thing with SSD's really is the firmware.

I was thinking maybe if it was a spinner then the inner mechanisms were worn out or wearing out.

Temps fine in fact the CPU is really good for a laptop.

Now the RAM usage is fairly high and I am wondering how much RAM the machine will take - that depends on the chipset supporting say 8GB.

Now the other thing we could do is a memory test because the DDR2 is fairly old but still ok. Did you try reseating the stick/s ? if not try that and then if it still persists a memtest is in order.

For that you will need to make a bootable disk from this Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool and let it run for at least 8 passes.

Just download that test burn to a disk and then set the BIOS to boot from the optical.

I have no idea how to do what you just mentioned...that is, make a bootable disk.
Why do I need to do that?

Also, I think I am just going to buy another 4gb stick.
Im usually low on memory anyways so it cant hurt, being that I am only at 4gbs.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

In short to test the memory for any defects and lets be honest it isDDR2 and has had a fair bit of use and abuse for all we know.

To do this you download and save the memtest ISO from that memtestsite I gave you to Downloads (I keep mine as an icon on the desktop - to dothat type Downloads in search and right click save to desktop) then usesomething like Imgburn to make a bootable disk from that download.

Then you set the BIOS to boot from the optical drive insert the disk in the optical go to the BIOS and Exit and save settings and itwill do just that it boots in the memtest application it will not activate anyOS or suchlike. .

You must let it run for at least 8 passes and if possibleovernight any red warnings will let you know if there is a problem. If the redwarnings start popping up straight away then you need go no further.


The extra RAM yes go ahead by all means if that boardsupports more than 4GB which I think it does but looking at the prices it is really quite expensive. With RAM as a matter of interest it is best bought in"kits" that is to say twp sticks of the same brand in the samepackaging because they are more likely to be made at the same time as eachother and therefore more likely to be evenly "matched". If you cannotafford a kit then at least try to get the same brand.

The Official ImgBurn Website

To make the disk run Imgburn and use what I circled and follow theinstructions - you then have the bootable disk.







* To doc mate I am just trying to eliminate any straightforward physical problems first if you think you know what the answer may bethen please I am more than happy to let you take over as I am not an expert byany means

 

[thedoc735]

Ok mate well the SSD I think I am right in saying doesn't have drivers I saw that a few days ago on another thread and I have four in use in my machines I certainly haven't had to download any. The only thing with SSD's really is the firmware.

I was thinking maybe if it was a spinner then the inner mechanisms were worn out or wearing out.

Temps fine in fact the CPU is really good for a laptop.

Now the RAM usage is fairly high and I am wondering how much RAM the machine will take - that depends on the chipset supporting say 8GB.

Now the other thing we could do is a memory test because the DDR2 is fairly old but still ok. Did you try reseating the stick/s ? if not try that and then if it still persists a memtest is in order.

For that you will need to make a bootable disk from this Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool and let it run for at least 8 passes.

Just download that test burn to a disk and then set the BIOS to boot from the optical.

I have no idea how to do what you just mentioned...that is, make a bootable disk.
Why do I need to do that?

Also, I think I am just going to buy another 4gb stick.
Im usually low on memory anyways so it cant hurt, being that I am only at 4gbs.

make a bootable disk = you need to burn those files to a blank CD/DVD using a 'writer drive' and then boot from the CD/DVD drive, rather than the HDD.

I only have 3GB memory and my PC never uses more than about 34%, I have almost 2GB spare most of the time. I can't see why your 4GB is not sufficient?

I have also swapped out my memory sticks/CPU temporarily which made no difference to the audio problems?

 

[thedoc735]

In short to test the memory for any defects and lets be honest it isDDR2 and has had a fair bit of use and abuse for all we know.

To do this you download and save the memtest ISO from that memtestsite I gave you to Downloads (I keep mine as an icon on the desktop - to dothat type Downloads in search and right click save to desktop) then usesomething like Imgburn to make a bootable disk from that download.

Then you set the BIOS to boot from the optical drive insert the disk in the optical go to the BIOS and Exit and save settings and itwill do just that it boots in the memtest application it will not activate anyOS or suchlike. .

You must let it run for at least 8 passes and if possibleovernight any red warnings will let you know if there is a problem. If the redwarnings start popping up straight away then you need go no further.


The extra RAM yes go ahead by all means if that boardsupports more than 4GB which I think it does but looking at the prices it is really quite expensive. With RAM as a matter of interest it is best bought in"kits" that is to say twp sticks of the same brand in the samepackaging because they are more likely to be made at the same time as eachother and therefore more likely to be evenly "matched". If you cannotafford a kit then at least try to get the same brand.

The Official ImgBurn Website

To make the disk run Imgburn and use what I circled and follow theinstructions - you then have the bootable disk.
* To doc mate I am just trying to eliminate any straightforward physical problems first if you think you know what the answer may bethen please I am more than happy to let you take over as I am not an expert byany means

I only have 3GB memory and my PC never uses more than about 34%, I have almost 2GB spare most of the time. I can't see why anyone's 4GB is not sufficient?

I have also swapped out my memory sticks/CPU temporarily which made no difference to the audio problems? I have also done the memtest thing anyway and used extensive testing with post probe/micro-scope (micro 2000) which revealed no issues. I also dismantled it and gave it a thorough dusting and 'contact' clean, non of which has made any difference at all?
Tthe problem goes away when the network is disabled. I don't want to have to disable the network connection every time I listen to music! All my drivers are up to date on windows 7. Also using pentium 4 CPU/DDR2 3Gb. All other functions work perfectly. The network card is a tenda W322p/PCI.
The same problem exists with either the motherboard on-board sound, or seperate sound card.
It sounds like a fast repetitive stutter similar to a vinyl LP styli that has got stuck in one groove over and over again; e.g. "gra-gra-gra-gra-grateful".
It's definitely a high dpc latency thing, but what to do?

@ ICit2lol = hey man! ~ let's all work together on this thing. I think I have now eliminated those physical possibilities though? Keep up the good work/suggestions, you never know, you might just end up being someones saviour

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Doc mate that is what I said if you read my post - make a bootable disk now I and I am guessing most people in here anyway would know that means downloading the memtest to your downloads site on the machine then burn a disk (with Imgburn - image to disk) I think I used a DVD as I am not sure which it is as there are some that are just over the CD limit - anyway you then take that disk and reset the BIOS to boot from the optical and insert the DVD (or CD) and exit the BIOS keeping the changes and the machine will "boot" from that disk straight into memtest and then you just let it run. Now as I also said it needs at LEAST 8 passes preferably overnight to get a proper test done unless you see red errors strait popping up almost straight away or a few passes into the test.
I didn't say anything about using the HDD mate the only way it is used is to keep that download in downloads.

Well that is very good if your RAM only uses that much mine hovers at about 2GB of 8 and that is what I would expect it to be and the fact that the OP has some older RAM type in there suggests to me unless he has replaced it within the lat couple of years it has had a fair bit of use. Like I said I am just working down the elimination process starting at the simple stuff because too many times we jump to th worst case scenarios straight away when in fact it may be some thing quite simple, I mean you would not swap out a cars engine because the wrong key wouldn't start it would you?

Hey but if you want to carry on and help this chap out then please be my guest I am only doing what I would do if it were my machine/s

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Well Doc what makes you think I haven't already helped anyone out?

Not blowing my own trumpet mate but I have been on here for some time and while I am no expert I think I have done a few things right from time to time.

Anyway you seem to have it under control you can take point.

 

[kwitel]

My problem is actually getting worse over time.

My audio dropouts can now last up to 2 seconds.

Im about ready to buy a new computer.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

My problem is actually getting worse over time.

My audio dropouts can now last up to 2 seconds.

Im about ready to buy a new computer.

To be brutally honest kwitel if you have done all the drivers and stuff you cannot see what is going and put that new RAM in I think the Dell may have seen better days.

Your last comment I think is probably going to save you a lot of grief in the long run mate. That is if the budget will run to it of course. It frequently happens you fix one thing and something else lest go bit like older cars really.
Now it is entirely up to you but if you do get a new machine I would be very wary of getting one with Windows 8 on it unless of course you really like it.
Personally I think it is leading us down a path that I do not like the sound of but it is up to you.

 

[thedoc735]

Well Doc what makes you think I haven't already helped anyone out?

Not blowing my own trumpet mate but I have been on here for some time and while I am no expert I think I have done a few things right from time to time.

Anyway you seem to have it under control you can take point.

I'm sure you must have helped many people, sorry for the misunderstanding. I'm sure you have been doing a good job for quite some time and will continue to do so in the future. I apologise, I'm sorry!

I don't want to take over, I have similar problem to kwitel and now I have eliminated a memory and cpu problem, and discovered a high latency problem when the network card is running - what next?
Do you have any ideas please?

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Apology accepted Doc as I am not really in the habit of getting caught up in "jousting" for any reason. Personally I do this because I have always enjoyed electronics and and the fact I have had to give away my biking and woodworking days because of a bad shoulder fracture (gold prospecting) plus for my upcoming retirement. I am certainly not into the reputation side of being here and frankly do not like those who put "rep me if you... etc etc " on their posts.

Having said that I have been searching for anything to do with the Intel chipset to see if there is any bearing with it in relation to this problem. What is causing that latency could be a multitude of things from even something as simple as a faulty capacitor to a dry joint - whatever - hence why I try to work through the really basic stuff first.

As I replied to kwitel I think maybe the machine in his case is probably in need of replacement with yours if it is the same vintage and has the same specs then maybe ditto.

Now I di find this but it is an old quote from another forum but it seems to me to be the gist of what is going on. Have a look and see what you think.
In order to lower your soundcard latency, you must first understand what latency is and why it occurs...

Latency is the product of several system variables which occur in this order:

1. The A/D (Analogue to Digital) conversion necessary to get the audio into the soundcard takes time...it can't be done instantly...

2. The audio must be 'buffered' to ensure consistant timing. This involves reading a short time ahead of the current audble position and storing this 'advanced' audio in memory. This is the main cause of latency.

3. The audio must be routed inside the PC to the relevant application e.g. Cubase.

4. The audio application must apply it's effects to the audio stream.

5. The audio must then be routed back out to the soundcard.

6. The D/A (Digital to Analogue) conversion necessary to output the audio from the soundcard takes time though not as much time as A/D conversion.



As stated above, the buffer time is the prime component of soundcard latency...most soundcard drivers allow the user to configure the number and size of the buffers...the better the design of your soundcard, the lower your buffer number and size can be and thus the lower the latency you can achieve. In Cubase, the menu item 'Options' has a sub-menu called 'Audio Options' from which you can select 'System'. This will lead to the driver configuration dialogue which in turn has an 'ASIO Control Panel'. In this dialogue, you can set the number and size of the buffers which is basically control over the latency of your soundcard. Some soundcards may have configuration utilities which are installed along with their drivers (e.g. RME Hammerfall) or software.

I must state at this point that latency has basically nothing to do with your CPU speed, amount of RAM or Hard-Disk speed. It is almost entirely a function of the number and size of buffers your soundcard uses. So, in order to lower your latency, you must experiment with the number and size of these buffers...some soundcards do not allow this with certain drivers.

 

[thedoc735]

Apology accepted Doc as I am not really in the habit of getting caught up in "jousting" for any reason.

me too! no time for jousting, like kwitel, I simply want a fix/solution; if there is one?

Personally I do this because I have always enjoyed electronics and and the fact I have had to give away my biking and woodworking days because of a bad shoulder fracture (gold prospecting) plus for my upcoming retirement.

My retirement is not too far behind yours then - haha! A year ago I lost 75% use of my legs due to peripheral neuropathy, became dual incontinent and due to an agonising slip disc can only shuffle around my home a few yards at a time causing me to be virtually housebound! Was car (maintaining/driving) and computer nut, now-a-days it's mainly computer & networking! Can't drive due to the fact that I can't find the pedals anymore with my numb feet!

I am certainly not into the reputation side of being here and frankly do not like those who put "rep me if you... etc etc " on their posts.

Me neither!

Having said that I have been searching for anything to do with the Intel chipset to see if there is any bearing with it in relation to this problem. What is causing that latency could be a multitude of things from even something as simple as a faulty capacitor to a dry joint - whatever - hence why I try to work through the really basic stuff first.

OK – finding/tracking down capacitors & dry joints?

As I replied to kwitel I think maybe the machine in his case is probably in need of replacement with yours if it is the same vintage and has the same specs then maybe ditto.

Mine’s an old Pentium 4 with DDR2. Just to get it to work at all with windows 7 I had to change the GPU, increase the memory & change the network card; now the audio has gone potty!

Now I did find this but it is an old quote from another forum but it seems to me to be the gist of what is going on. Have a look and see what you think.

“In order to lower your soundcard latency, you must first understand what latency is and why it occurs...
Latency is the product of several system variables which occur in this order:
1. The A/D (Analogue to Digital) conversion necessary to get the audio into the soundcard takes time...it can't be done instantly...
2. The audio must be 'buffered' to ensure consistant timing. This involves reading a short time ahead of the current audble position and storing this 'advanced' audio in memory. This is the main cause of latency.
3. The audio must be routed inside the PC to the relevant application e.g. Cubase.
4. The audio application must apply it's effects to the audio stream.
5. The audio must then be routed back out to the soundcard.
6. The D/A (Digital to Analogue) conversion necessary to output the audio from the soundcard takes time though not as much time as A/D conversion”.

Yes, I see (basically).

As stated above, the buffer time is the prime component of soundcard latency...most soundcard drivers allow the user to configure the number and size of the buffers...the better the design of your soundcard, the lower your buffer number and size can be and thus the lower the latency you can achieve. In Cubase, the menu item 'Options' has a sub-menu called 'Audio Options' from which you can select 'System'. This will lead to the driver configuration dialogue which in turn has an 'ASIO Control Panel'. In this dialogue, you can set the number and size of the buffers which is basically control over the latency of your soundcard. Some soundcards may have configuration utilities which are installed along with their drivers (e.g. RME Hammerfall) or software.

My “Creative SB X-FI extreme audio” DOES NOT have the ASIO; I checked the spec and it’s the only one (X-FI) that doesn’t have this, probably because it was the budget/base model? It does have the creative audio control panel though. However the same problem manifests with the built in (integrated) motherboard’s audio device too!

I must state at this point that latency has basically nothing to do with your CPU speed, amount of RAM or Hard-Disk speed. It is almost entirely a function of the number and size of buffers your soundcard uses. So, in order to lower your latency, you must experiment with the number and size of these buffers...some soundcards do not allow this with certain drivers.

I don’t think mine allows this? No ‘ASIO’, only the ‘creative audio control panel’ alone.

 

[ICIT2LOL]

I am really sorry to hear about your own problems and Ithink stuff like this really puts life into some sort of perspective and in away what the problem is with kwitel and your machine.

To be brutally honest in my mind the machines are in need ofreplacement and I ma not just blithely saying that because I know everyone hasfinancial and other problems ands it is probably the last thing either of youwant to hear. However my point is this could be resolved after a long period ofgrief tracking it down only to find that something is on it's last legs.

I don't know if either of you have had much to do with basicelectronics but as I think I mentioned the problem could be as simple as one ortwo faulty very simple components and without disassembling the machines andhave a look inside you are never going to find that out.

Having said all that we could carry on and try track thisdown and for that it is going to have to have someone a bit more cluey than meto do this remotely (like as we are doing right now) .

Now that latency I do have a gut feeling that it is whatfireberd said earlier on in the post just because you have tried the driversonce doesn't necessarily mean installed properly.

Now to do this it need s the exact model of your machines kwitel I find tow refs to your machine for drivers - 6400 XFR and 6400 ATG do you know which one? Doc same for you the exact model number.
These should be on a sticker on the bottom of the machine if not then you need to run that Speccy and find it as in my pic of mine. Speccy - Download < from piriform and screen shots would be real handy.

This is good for that How to Use the Snipping Tool in Vista

 

[fireberd]

Stuttering, as you note, is not really a latency problem as such. I have a home recording studio and very attuned to latency and its problems.

As you have both integrated and the separate Xfi card, make sure the integrated is disabled in the BIOS so it does not cause conflicts.

The DPC Latency checker (free download) DPC Latency Checker will look at PC System latency (not audio latency). That may help in problem determination.

Audio is always on a shared IRQ with a higher priority device and thus is also at the mercy of the higher priority device. Depending on what the higher priority device is can cause the problem.

The older hardware, trying to run all the Win 7 OS modules isn't going to be a good scenario either.

I too have peripheral nerve neuropathy due to Chemo (for colon cancer). We all are fighting old age. I'm a 75 year old "Florida Retiree".

 

[thedoc735]

I am really sorry to hear about your own problems and I think stuff like this really puts life into some sort of perspective and in away what the problem is with kwitel and your machine.
I agree with you!

To be brutally honest in my mind the machines are in need of replacement and I am not just blithely saying that because I know everyone has financial and other problems and it is probably the last thing either of you want to hear. However my point is this could be resolved after a long period of grief tracking it down only to find that something is on it's last legs.
Again, I tend to agree! ….but on the other hand I don’t like to be beaten by this thing!

I don't know if either of you have had much to do with basic electronics but as I think I mentioned the problem could be as simple as one or two faulty very simple components and without disassembling the machines and have a look inside you are never going to find that out.
I built the PC myself so I don’t mind taking it to bits. I can use a soldering iron. But no expert!

Having said all that we could carry on and try track this down and for that it is going to have to have someone a bit more cluey than me to do this remotely (like as we are doing right now) .
OK. You’ve done your best for which I am most grateful. No one can do more than their best. At least you are someone who is prepared to help others and sacrifice your time; very commendable!

Now that latency I do have a gut feeling that it is what fireberd said earlier on in the post just because you have tried the drivers once doesn't necessarily mean installed properly.
I agree. In my case I have tried a clean install of windows 7 on a new HDD and it made no difference to the problem.

Now to do this it need s the exact model of your machines kwitel I find tow refs to your machine for drivers - 6400 XFR and 6400 ATG do you know which one? Doc same for you the exact model number.
My PC has no number model number as I built it myself. It does have an Asus P4C8000 mainboard with intel Pentium 4 CPU & 3GB DDR2 memory. ATI GPU (AGP), creative sound card, Tenda W322P network card, HDD, Optical drive. This problem only became apparent when I swapped out the network card a few weeks ago, before that it was fine i.e. no audio problems! My old network card was a texas instruments 802.11 b/g.

These should be on a sticker on the bottom of the machine if not then you need to run that Speccy and find it as in my pic of mine. Speccy - Download < from piriform and screen shots would be real handy.
I’ll do the speccy thing as well, real soon!

 

[ICIT2LOL]

Now the thing beating you I can understand but it is quite an old board mate and I am presuming so is the PSU.

Have you tested it out at all? could be down to it not being up to the task.

One of my testers was slowing and freezing then slowing down again to the point where I had done everything except look at the PSU flipped i a spare recycled Coolermaster and away went the problem and it has been fine ever since. So you might try this as well.

http://www.sevenforums.com/vip/257690-psu-how-test.html#post2130086 if you do go check this out PLEASE be very careful follow the instructions to the letter and don't open it up unless you are absolutely sure of what you are doing, in fact just do the check and post back what you find. Now keep in mind that because the volts are ok does not mean the current being supplied id.

 

[thedoc735]

attachment

 

[ICIT2LOL]

attachment

Ok looks very much like my tester 2 only I have an Intel board that PSU is next up and without going all the way back the drivers for the sound card have all been updated.

As a matter of interest I haven't heard that many good comments about Creative but it is worth keeping in mind another sound card the brand I have (Asus Xonar DG's) in my machines nice cards and not expensive.

 

[Britton30]

I only have 3GB memory and my PC never uses more than about 34%, I have almost 2GB spare most of the time. I can't see why anyone's 4GB is not sufficient?

I have also swapped out my memory sticks/CPU temporarily which made no difference to the audio problems? I have also done the memtest thing anyway and used extensive testing with post probe/micro-scope (micro 2000) which revealed no issues. I also dismantled it and gave it a thorough dusting and 'contact' clean, non of which has made any difference at all?
Tthe problem goes away when the network is disabled. I don't want to have to disable the network connection every time I listen to music! All my drivers are up to date on windows 7. Also using pentium 4 CPU/DDR2 3Gb. All other functions work perfectly. The network card is a tenda W322p/PCI.
The same problem exists with either the motherboard on-board sound, or seperate sound card.
It sounds like a fast repetitive stutter similar to a vinyl LP styli that has got stuck in one groove over and over again; e.g. "gra-gra-gra-gra-grateful".
It's definitely a high dpc latency thing, but what to do?

@ ICit2lol = hey man! ~ let's all work together on this thing. I think I have now eliminated those physical possibilities though? Keep up the good work/suggestions, you never know, you might just end up being someones saviour

You are fairly rude for a person highjacking someone else's thread mate. You should start your own thread for your specific problem and not post to say you have the same issue but don't know how to fix it, that helps no one.