Unstable Win7/Pro x64 - First Post in Wrong Forum Perhaps?

[baumgrenze]

I am still learning my way around the forum. I can't see how to move a post to a different one. I do not want to get banned for cross-posting or some other inadvertent misbehavior.

I posted this on the General Discussion Forum:

Win7/Pro x64 - Increasingly Unstable - Applications Crash on Save

As he helped me to create a copy of my data disk on he suggested that I should have posted here when I first asked.

Win7/Pro x64 - Booting Very Slow - Cannot Save Files

in the last paragraph of #37 in this thread.

My most recent bit of evidence is that most of my PC must be running 'fine' because I shut down and changed boot drives (I have Win7 on one SSD and Win10 on a second) and Win 10 boots quickly and apparently stably.

When I tried to switch back to Win7, knowing that it would take ~5 minutes to boot, I walked off. When I came back I discovered that it must of automatically moved to chkdsk mode and it was in the process of 'replacing invalid security ID with default security ID for every file.' A quick search here says that my PC is going to be busy for about 24 hours as it completes this process.

Argh!

thanks in advance
baumgrenze

 

[pbcopter]

Turn off fast startup in Windows 10. When you shut down Windows 10 with fast startup enabled, it goes into a hibernate like mode that Windows 7 does not understand hence the Chkdsk when you boot to Windows 7.

 

[johncorosz]

Replacing invalid security id with default security id for file 97.
Replacing invalid security id with default security id for file 98.
Replacing invalid security id with default security id for file 99.

Some 10,000 or so files later it ended but my PC didn't restart automatically.
I pressed the reset button and after that all was hell.

For e.g.

1) My host file entries were not readable by any applications like wamp or firefox or chrome or etc.


2) I could not start some programs like MATLAB because its file also got corrupted.

3) Avira Antivirus does not update because it says Scheduler (sched.exe) has not been started even after starting it from services.msc.

I googled this problem and came to know that my account has been removed from the permissions list of the files (as seen when i saw the properties of the hosts file).

>>>MORE HERE<<<
​

​

 

[baumgrenze]

Thanks for the suggestion.

I was not explicit enough. Win 10 is on one of my SSD's and Win7 is on the other. I only have one physically connected to the MOBO at any time. I've not tried to understand dual-booting.

Is your suggestion relevant now that I have clarified this point?

From my narrow perspective, that Win10 booted quickly and seemed to run while Win7 is slow and problematic suggests that there is a problem with C:, my boot/system drive. Back on the 28th I did try the 'best known configuration' procedure and it resulted in no improvement.

I installed Win10 when MS absolutely insisted I do so but I've not found time to explore it. My days are only so long and the remainder of my life is rapidly progressing towards the vanishing point.

The invalid security code process finished far more quickly than I anticipated. I still had my ESATA external drive attached and I briefly saw reference to F: which is that drive in the messages that flashed by before I got the request for my PW.

thanks,
baumgrenze

 

[johncorosz]

This sounds more like a case of re-installing Windows again.

 

[baumgrenze]

I'm saddened to hear that. It took me most of a month to find and install all the software I use.

Right now I am really missing ZTreeWin and its 'showall' display that can be sorted by name, date, size, etc. You can even log several disks and invoke 'showall' and see where things are. Also powerful is the 'filespec' aspect where *xxx*.exe, for example, finds all the application files containing the string 'xxx' I got hooked on XTree in the 1980's.

I do have a Macrium image I created last August. I suppose it might be worth the $100 to try to restore it after buying the current market equivalent Crucial SSD, a 275GB drive.

Does Win7 keep an accessible log of applications added to a machine that can be sorted by date? That would tell me what I'd need to install to get back up to speed. Am I correct that Windows Update would tell me what I needed to download and install to make Win7 current?

I guess it might be a good idea to create a copy of the drive on my external backup drive, using TestDisk the way jumanji showed me and I used on my data drive.

I had a copy of Crucial Storage Executive but in All Programs I cannot open it. I am told that the drive or network connection the shortcut refers to is not available. Perhaps it got installed on my Data Drive. I have a copy of the contents of that drive on my external backup drive. I could try to download it again. I vaguely recall that the installation was complicated. Am I wrong.

Am I correct that the Minitool Partiton Wizard surface scan technique I used on my spinning data drive does not apply to SSD's?

thanks,
baumgrenze

 

[pbcopter]

Is your suggestion relevant now that I have clarified this point?

baumgrenze

Yes it is still relevant. Whether you dual boot or boot from separate disks. How many other disks are installed?

 

[baumgrenze]

Not Installed?

I tried to outline this carefully under Hard Drives in My System Specs.

When I want to launch Win 10, I shut down, open the case, unplug the cable from the Win 7 drive and plug in the Win 10 drive.

Only one drive OS is connected at any time.

I think the Win7 OS drive may be 'compromised' but still limping along. It is one of the Crucial SSDs,

There is a Data Disk that at present shows as RAW in Disk Management. I'm working on this with jumanji I want to make one more copy using test disk because Avast popped up claiming it blocked a virus during the copy process.

(1TB WD Caviar Black (WD1003FZEX-00MK2A0) (Data drive)

At present I have an ESATA connection to an external drive. It is normally not up and running.

1 2TB Seagate 2TB (PN/ 9JB1N3-576 - ST2000DM001-1ER) (Backup Drive)

I cannot see how the Win10 drive, if not physically connected to the MOBO, can impact my boot time.

I am certainly open to education. At 77 I've learned that 'I'm not to old to learn' and that it is becoming increasingly probable that I will forget.

thanks
baumgrenze

 

[pbcopter]

I cannot see how the Win10 drive, if not physically connected to the MOBO, can impact my boot time.


baumgrenze

I'll try to be more clear. When you shut down Windows 10 with fast startup enabled, it puts the whole system, including attached disks, in a hibernate like mode. Even if you remove the Windows 10 disk, the other disks still remain in that mode. When you attach and boot to Windows 7, it does not understand the system configuration and runs Chkdsk.

Turn off fast startup in Windows 10, then shutdown and attach the Windows 7 disk and check the boot time.

By the way, I am also over 70 and in my system I attach and remove each Windows disk as well, using a front mounted disk tray, rather than multi boot..

 

[torchwood]

Its your BIOS configuration

Sounds like its set up for 10 not 7, that why when you swap in/out the SSD its failing.
YOUR BIOS IS STILL READING THE OLD 10 set-up, which is incompatable with W7,
in essence its NOT a dual boot, your trying to buck the normal single boot
SO DIFFERENT BIOS options need to be applied depending on which OS you boot.

Pbcopters advice is sound in this case - Dissable fast startup

Roy

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
More info on fast start in win-10
Most effective is to use command prompt as admin by right clicking win-10's start button and type or paste the code below and hit the enter key.

powercfg -h off

Performance & Maintenance Fast Startup - Turn On or Off in Windows 10 - Windows 10 Tutorials

It is not a good idea to share internal or external drives with a different os.

 

[baumgrenze]

Thank you everyone for your input.

I'm not 'out of the woods yet' but I received a reply from YaMoonSun to the thread where jumanji helped me to create a copy of my Data Disk (showed as RAW in Disk Management) that is readable.

YaMoonSun suggested I look at my Startup file. I am pretty sure that it was VMonitor (came with an Adafruit USB microscope) that was the culprit. For the record I removed these files from Startup and the startup speed was great.

Adobe Photo Downloader 4.0
Acrotray Adove distiller helper application
Catalyst Control Center (from Advanced Micro Devices)
VMonitor

When I have more bandwidth I will look into the Win 10 Fast Startup suggestion. For the moment it seems to not be affecting my startup speed noticeably.

For the record, my BIOS is:

BIOS: Award Software International, Inc. F6 06/18/2009 System Specs - Updated on 8/30/16

thanks
baumgrenze

 

[Megahertz07]

PBcopter, I can't understand why a hibernation process on Win 10 can affect a Win 7 boot on another disk as OP said he has always only one SSD connected. So if the Win 10 SSD with the hiberfil.sys is disconnected from the MB, how can it affect Win 7 boot?
The explanation can be that the boot loader is on a Data disk.

Baumgrenze, please boot Win 10 (with Win 7 SSD attached) launch Disk Manager, expand the columns so we can read them and with the sniping tool take a snapshot of all disks and post here as an attachment.

A Win 7 on a SSD would take no more than 30 sec to boot.
Lets see what are on the disks.

 

[baumgrenze]

I am here to learn. The older I get, the more I am aware of what I don't know.

Fact: I have a working copy of Win7/Pro x64 on one of my SSDs. I have a working copy of Win10/Pro x64 on the other one.

I have not installed any program files on the Win 10 disk.

I thought it was an invitation to disaster to attach both of these drives to my MOBO at the same time. Am I wrong?

Just for the record, once I disabled VMonitor my machine began booting Win 7 as rapidly as it always did. See Post #12 above for the other programs I disabled at the same time.

I've not had the time to boot to Win 10 and follow ThrashZone's instructions to turn of fast start.

I've also not gone back through my Win 10 installation notes to read about what I did in my BIOS when I installed it. I have a vague memory that this was a problem as I stumbled my way from XP to Win7.

Yesterday, when I checked, Win 10 booted quickly and seemed to be working OK, so I shut it down and swapped the SSDs again.

I make all these points because I don't want to go chasing something that is not a real problem.

thanks
baumgrenze

 

[Megahertz07]

I don't think Win 10 has anything to do with win 7 boot problem as they are on separate disks, each one with its boot loader.

Please boot Win 10 (with Win 7 SSD attached) launch Disk Manager, expand the columns so we can read them and with the sniping tool take a snapshot of all disks and post here as an attachment.

A Win 7 on a SSD would take no more than 30 sec to boot.
Lets see what are on the disks.

 

[baumgrenze]

Please forgive my persistent questioning.

Is it really 'safe' to start a PC which has 2 bootable disk drives both connected to the MOBO?

How does the processor know which disk to boot?

I want to stay out of black&blue screen hell if I can.

thanks
baumgrenze

 

[Megahertz07]

You should always disconnect ALL other drives when installing win to make sure it doesn't install a MBR on a disk that direct to another disk. Once installation is over, connect the other drives.
There is no problem to have 2 boot able drives.
On BIOS you have a disk boot order priority, that is, if you don't do nothing it will boot from the fist on the list.
If you want to boot from another disk, when you hear the POST beep just after the computer starts, you press a F key to launch the boot menu. On Gigabyte MBs the F key is normally F12.
On the boot menu you will have all boot able drives. Choose one with the mouse or keyboard. Simple as that.

 

[pbcopter]

PBcopter, I can't understand why a hibernation process on Win 10 can affect a Win 7 boot on another disk as OP said he has always only one SSD connected. So if the Win 10 SSD with the hiberfil.sys is disconnected from the MB, how can it affect Win 7 boot?
The explanation can be that the boot loader is on a Data disk.

Baumgrenze, please boot Win 10 (with Win 7 SSD attached) launch Disk Manager, expand the columns so we can read them and with the sniping tool take a snapshot of all disks and post here as an attachment.

A Win 7 on a SSD would take no more than 30 sec to boot.
Lets see what are on the disks.

It is because Windows 10 fast start up marks the other disks that are connected and Windows 7 sees that as the disks being dirty. If there were only the Windows 7 or the Windows 10 disks connected at a time, there would be no problem.

 

[baumgrenze]

Thanks for the reminder about boot order in the BIOS. I've only entered the menu when installing an OS which is infrequent, for which I am thankful. Since the drives are identical (I'd intended a RAID array) I would need to be able to tell one from the other. Would assigned names show up in the BIOS setup?

Just to be cautiously clear, I would have a 1 GB spinning data disk and 2 Crucial 128 Gb SSD (CT128M550SSD1), one for Win7 and one for Win10. Sometime I would also have my external backup mounted as well (2TB Seagate 2TB (PN/ 9JB1N3-576 - ST2000DM001-1ER)

I will try to work these suggestions into my schedule. My top priority is sorting out my 1 TB data disk situation (a related post on the General Discussion where jumanji is walking me through the problem at one post per day as we are just about 12 hours apart in time.

thanks
baumgrenze

 

[Layback Bear]

Okay let ask again.

With both ssd hooked up do this tutorial by Golden.
Post the picture here.

Disk Management - Post a Screen Capture Image

Jack