Doing a Clean Install with a Upgrade Windows 7 Version

[gregrocker]

OK, so I took a few days off from here because my Windows 7 STILL has not arrived. (Fist pumping to Best Buy!!!)

Here are my remaining questions:

That recovery partition will be disabled (if it is factory installed) when you install Windows 7 so you can delete it, but you might want to make your recovery disk set if you haven't yet since those disks are generated from that partition. You would only need them if you wanted to restore the computer to factory condition so you can sell it, but want to migrate your WIndows 7 to your next computer.

THen delete them both after booting from the installer, create one big partition (that's what it's called even if it's one) and format it.

Because I have the DELL, I have the recovery disks. But I don't really care about that anyway - I never want to go back to Windows Vista (I am assuming).

When I load Windows 7 from boot, before I delete the Recovery partition - does it *already* recognize that I have Vista on the computer? Meaning - does deleting that partition do anything to hurt the "upgrade" in recognizing that I had Vista on my system before I reformat and install 7 on the new full partition?

If your system is a Dell, installing Windows 7 does not disable your recovery partition. And Dells do not have a "create recovery disk set" process. The recovery is all contained in the D:\RECOVERY\Dell\Factory.wim file which is run through the F8 Windows Recovery enviroment by the files in the D:\RECOVERY\Tools folder. Again, that is if your system is a Dell.

Additionally, early reports indicate the mere existence of the D:\RECOVERY partition (which contains a Windows Preinstallation Environment besides the Factory.wim file and the Tools folder) obviates the need for tweaks or hacks to get an upgrade version of Windows 7 to clean install and activate on the first try.
Tom

I DO have DELL, actually. I understand that does not disable the Recovery partition - but would I have any use for it after installing Windows 7? Would Windows 7 utilize it? Otherwise, I think it would be obsolete for me? (Pointing to the second paragraph) would deleting said partition make doing the clean install/activate more difficult? Sorry, not very knowledgeable about partitions and their uses.

Not at all, just boot from your Win7 install disk, choose Custom and delete all the partitions, create new ones you want, then format and install Win7 to the first one.

Recovery partition has no bearing on the new OS, just wastes space and won't work anyway in most cases after new OS is installed.

Plenty of reports in this thread that clean installs were done from boot without any traces of previous O.S., so it can be done, and if necessary the workarounds to get activated.are right here.

 

[SilverGator]

I would really prefer NOT to use a workaround. I just want it to work how it is supposed to. Just want to make sure that deleting the partition won't affect it working.

Also, I keep seeing how I should NOT register it at first but do it later. Why is that? I mean, I am 100% legit about it - so what is the danger? I almost feel like I would prefer to register it during installation rather than after. I need a good reason (or two) not to.

 

[gregrocker]

I put my key in when it first asked and it took it, then I installed from boot to a formatted drive and it activated as soon as I got online. So there should be no problem giving your key because it is able to somehow detect the previous O.S. even after formatting.

However I just tried to zero the drive which wipes all traces from it, and that would not activate without doing the second Upgrade (repair) install over the installation.

So I've confirmed here I believe that it is somehow reading a previous OS before installing from boot.

But if it won't take your key and you want, you can restart and run the installer from your XP/Vista desktop and still get a clean install (just not format) which will immediately detect your qualifying OS. A shortcut to do this is a registry edit here: http://www.winsupersite.com/win7/cle...rade_media.asp

 

[zrtom]

Dell Factory Image Restoration

Before this gets out of hand with speculation as to whether the Dell Factory Image Restoration process works or does not work after installing Windows 7, I thought I'd drop in to say it works; it's no longer "automated" but it works. The file Factory.wim is a windows image file. If you know anything about windows imaging you'll know that just that one file is all you need to restore the computer the way it shipped from Dell.

I'm working on a tutorial for Dell owners but for the time being, here is how to restore a Dell to factory-shipped conditions when the option is no longer present in the F8 "Repair your computer" Windows Recovery Environment. This is for Vista Operating Systems.

1. Boot Vista DVD that was shipped with computer. 2. Work your way to the command prompt. 3. Navigate to D:\Tools. 4. Type PCRestore.exe. 5. Authorize reformatting, sit back and 10-15 minutes later you'll be at the OOBE like the first time the computer was turned on.

If for some reason the above doesn't work....
1. Boot Vista disk. 2. From command prompt navigate to d:\Tools. 3. Type the following:
imagex /apply D:\Dell\Image\Factory.wim 1 C:\

There you have it. Back to factory shipped conditions in about 10 minutes. The key thing about "factory shipped" conditions is not so much to actually use Vista but for troubleshooting those real tough problems. The computer worked when it left the factory and if it doesn't work after restoring the factory image, it is almost definately a hardware problem.

By the way, Dells generally don't ship with trialware or bloatware. I think the only thing you might find besides the Operating System itself is Dell Support Center and maybe Windows Live Essentials. I don't think they even put Google Desktop on anymore; at least not on my Mini 10 from May.

Lastly, the redeployed factory image makes an excellent base with which to do an inplace upgrade to Windows 7. I generally advocate clean installs only. However there is a time and a place for everything. Before everyone gets on my case, think about it. It is a clean install of Vista with all the drivers that work; it's not an upgrade of a system that has been botched and hacked for two years; there's no data nor user (sometimes incorrectly) installed software.
The upgrade goes very quickly and frankly, I've tried upgrade from Vista (fresh factory image) vs. fresh install on two high-end Dell Laptops side-by-side. I cannot see any difference at all with both subjective observations and objective benchmarks.

What I have been doing on a couple of client's Dell computers is run the Factory Image Restoration process, upgrade it to W7 and dual boot that with a fresh W7 installation. The client has 30 days (more with rearming the software licensing manager) to decide which one they like better. Once they've decided, pick one, get rid of the other and activate. Why dual boot this way? Some W7 drivers aren't quite ready and Vista with good drivers upgraded to W7 is smoother than W7 with "green" drivers. That should all change in the upcoming months as more and more W7 drivers are refined.
Tom

 

[Dave76]

+ Rep

Thanks for the info zrtom,

I think everyone with a Dell (any OEM) should keep the recovery partition.

If for some reason you can't keep it on your HD then keep a backup image of it or burn it to DVD.
Your reasons for keeping it are valid.

Looking forward to reading the tutorial.
Can you extract the WIM file and run it?
Would you need the WAIK file (6001.18000...kb3aikl_en.iso) to do that?

Dell has a clause in the Hardware Warranty that you may have to install the original OS for hardware warranty issues.
Even if you dual boot just for the warranty issue, having them replace hardware would make the recovery partition worth keeping.

 

[Darryl Licht]

However I just tried to zero the drive which wipes all traces from it, and that would not activate without doing the second Upgrade (repair) install over the installation.

So I've confirmed here I believe that it is somehow reading code revealing a previous OS from formatted drive when installing from boot.

SWEET! So the old Vista (Install twice) trick still works also! Cool!

 

[Hondajt]

Sweet. My OEM Upgrade DVD Worked! It activated and is running great!!

OEM software, gotta love it. dirt cheap.

 

[zrtom]

Thanks for the info zrtom,

I think everyone with a Dell (any OEM) should keep the recovery partition.

If for some reason you can't keep it on your HD then keep a backup image of it or burn it to DVD.
Your reasons for keeping it are valid.

Looking forward to reading the tutorial.
Can you extract the WIM file and run it?
Would you need the WAIK file (6001.18000...kb3aikl_en.iso) to do that?

Dell has a clause in the Hardware Warranty that you may have to install the original OS for hardware warranty issues.
Even if you dual boot just for the warranty issue, having them replace hardware would make the recovery partition worth keeping.

Thanks Dave,
The Tools folder in Dell recovery partitions has everything you need, including imagex, to mount the factory image. None of this is "disabled" by installing Windows 7, only the WinRE option to run PCRestore.exe (that's why it has to be done manually).


I've even gone as far as doing this:

• Custom (clean) install the Operating System (Vista, W7, it doesn't matter).
• Add tweaks
• Add software (whatever... Adobe PS, Office, AV, Sling Player, etc., etc.)
• Use the tool FacImg.exe to capture the new system and replace the file Factory.wim in the D:\RECOVERY\Image\ folder with my custom image. (The Dell tool FacImg.exe isn't part of the regular Tools folder..... I "obtained" it)

I did that more before I switched to Vista Ultimate and, now, W7 Ultimate with it's own imaging. What I don't have and need to get my hands on is a copy of the Tools folder from someone who has Vista (or now W7) x64 'cause I only have 32-bit tools and I no longer use 32-bit OS's. I can still do this process, only not with FacImg.exe; I have to use imagex x64 from the WAIK.

So, anyway, I should be writing a tutorial and not this....LOL
Tom

 

[Howard Kaikow]

I have not read that here. Most advice I've read here is to make your recovery disks and then delete the partition since it is disabled anyway if/when Vista is deleted. It was also pointed out recently that Dell's recovery partition is different and should likely be kept since it has important tools and can still later recover the Vista if Vista is wiped. But I have not verified this.

I will be creating a dual boot Vista/Win 7 system, so I dare not delete the recovery partition, and certainly not before the warranty expires.

In any case, I would restore from most recent image backup, not from recovery disks.

Smart approach. Imaging ends reinstalls if saved externally in case of HDD failure.

Since you are concerned about preserving your recovery partition, which will most likely be disabled by Win7 install, be sure to make the recovery disks from it (or order them) to have as backup. These disks normally restore eveything including the recovery partition to factory condition.

But they also contain the bloatware, which is a good reason to dual boot with a fresh install of Win7, then copy your files between partitions via Explorer, even find drivers by browsing to the Vista partition's Windows>System32>Driverstore>File Repository.

A Win 7 install has no business deleting/disabling a recovery partition.

And I would not copy ANY OS files from Vista to Win 7.

If Win 7 needs drivers for the notebook, and I doubt that, they are likely available at HP's web site.

 

[vice86]

I'm confused with all the "upgrade" discs available. There's Full, Upgrade and Upgrade from XXXX.

I'm on Build 7100 right now and want to upgrade. According to this thread, you can do a full clean install using an upgrade disc. Does that mean I can purchase an "upgrade from Home" Ultimate disc and successfully do a clean full install of W7 Ultimate?

 

[Brink]

I'm confused with all the "upgrade" discs available. There's Full, Upgrade and Upgrade from XXXX.

I'm on Build 7100 right now and want to upgrade. According to this thread, you can do a full clean install using an upgrade disc. Does that mean I can purchase an "upgrade from Home" Ultimate disc and successfully do a clean full install of W7 Ultimate?

Hello Vice.

Correct.

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/31402-clean-install-upgrade-windows-7-version.html

 

[YolkiZelyoni]

Student upgrade (download) from Ubuntu

hello from a non-windows user. i am a student, and have been running ubuntu as my os for a few years now. generally i am very satisfied, but am very curious to check out windows 7 on my laptop. when i heard about the 30 dollar download deal, i rushed to sign up. i (quickly) read the info, and saw it said that you could do a custom install from other os. so far i have not had much success figuring out what to do here - i scanned through the others posts, but didnt see anyone in a similar position. am i just out 30 bucks? or is there some way get this done? thanks for any help

eta: would like to do this as a dual boot and not eradicate ubuntu.

 

[SilverGator]

OK so I thought I had everything all figured out now and I am confused again. I think my Windows 7 is at my door so when I get home, I want to install it.

But before I do, I want clarification on the DELL RECOVERY partition.

I read the last few posts but still don't understand - why exactly should I keep it? I REALLY want to do a complete format of my hard drive with one partition and do not plan to go back to Vista. I have my back-up discs that came with the laptop and have all of my data backed up.

What good reason is there to keep the Recovery partition? Please answer soon if anyone can.

And if anyone has any additional tips on installing Windows 7 that have not been covered - I would appreciate that!

 

[gregrocker]

From all I have read including zrtom's comprehensive Dell research reports, there is no reason to save ANY recovery partition if you have no intention of returning to Vista.

If you should ever have to restore to factory condition, it would be because the manufacturer wanted it back on to replace certain hardware under warranty, and if you didn't make the disks first they would provide them. Any copy of Vista could otherwise be used with your Vista license key to put just the OS back on.

That license key sticker on your machine is all you need to prove previous OS to MS if future reinstalls would ever call Upgrade qualification into question.

Just be sure to save externally a Win7 backup image so reinstall won't ever be needed again, just reimage the drive in 15 minutes from the Win7 installer Repair Console.

 

[Dave76]

OK so I thought I had everything all figured out now and I am confused again. I think my Windows 7 is at my door so when I get home, I want to install it.

But before I do, I want clarification on the DELL RECOVERY partition.

I read the last few posts but still don't understand - why exactly should I keep it? I REALLY want to do a complete format of my hard drive with one partition and do not plan to go back to Vista. I have my back-up discs that came with the laptop and have all of my data backed up.

What good reason is there to keep the Recovery partition? Please answer soon if anyone can.

And if anyone has any additional tips on installing Windows 7 that have not been covered - I would appreciate that!

You have read two different views on the OEM recovery partition. It's always good to have a discussion on your options.
Now you can decide, if you have the re-installation DVD you can use that if required.
If you have the space on your backup drive you can make a backup image of the recovery partition. The important thing is to leave your options open.

I kept my Dell Recovery partition, but that may not be your decision, that's what makes this world such a great place.

If you "REALLY want to do a complete format of my hard drive with one partition" then do it. If you decide to sell the laptop or Dell requests, you can put vista back on with the DVD. Most OEMs will send you the re-installations DVD for free or shipping charges during the first 6 months to a year after you purchase it, depending on the OEM.

For additional tips on your Win7 installation check this sticky thread Tutorial quick reference list for Installing Windows 7

Take a look at Windows Easy Transfer, it will transfer your user settings, you will still need to install your programs.

Always backup your HD before any installation, as you've already done, with Win7 backup or one of the great free backup programs.

Let us know how it goes.

 

[kuliddar]

Small clarification on performance with an upgrade copy of Win7.

Is there really a performance difference between a Clean Install and Custom Install (when in OS already)? Don't both spit out a Windows.old folder?

 

[Hollow Man]

Small clarification on performance with an upgrade copy of Win7.

Is there really a performance difference between a Clean Install and Custom Install (when in OS already)? Don't both spit out a Windows.old folder?

If you do a Custom install you have the option to wipe out all partitions and create new ones, thus, you will not have any remnants of your old Windows when Win7 starts.

-HM

 

[Brink]

Small clarification on performance with an upgrade copy of Win7.

Is there really a performance difference between a Clean Install and Custom Install (when in OS already)? Don't both spit out a Windows.old folder?

If you do a Custom install you have the option to wipe out all partitions and create new ones, thus, you will not have any remnants of your old Windows when Win7 starts.

-HM

Hello Hollow Man,

Thus the difference between a Clean Install and a Custom Install.

 

[Hollow Man]

Small clarification on performance with an upgrade copy of Win7.

Is there really a performance difference between a Clean Install and Custom Install (when in OS already)? Don't both spit out a Windows.old folder?

If you do a Custom install you have the option to wipe out all partitions and create new ones, thus, you will not have any remnants of your old Windows when Win7 starts.

-HM

Hello Hollow Man,

Thus the difference between a Clean Install and a Custom Install.

I would personally argue that a clean install is a subset of a custom install, but what's really important is what the user wants to accomplish, not necessarily the nomenclature people use (which varies on who's doing the talking).

-HM

 

[zrtom]

Hi Guys,
I go on and on (and on and on) about the Dell recovery partition/process only because over the last two years I've spent considerable time studying it, dissecting it and tweaking it (using the files in the Tools folder to create my own custom recovery images). If you don't intend to go back to Vista then delete it. The existence of the recovery partition has no affect on installing Windows 7. Dell's recovery process is unlike most of the others; it is more sophisticated than burning your own recovery disks (not an option on a Dell) and I daresay that in no small way contributes to the fact that (some) Dell computers cost more than others.

My main concern is that there are literally millions of Dell owners out there who know absolutely nothing about computers (think of all the new netbook users) and now they are thinking of installing Windows 7. If something goes wrong, the Dell Factory Image Restoration process can get them back to a functioning Operating System in 10-15 minutes. And then there is the warranty issue.

Hard drives (good hard drives) are a dime a dozen. For $50US you can get a really good 500GB hard drive and just install Windows 7 on that. Put the factory hard drive away in a drawer somewhere.

And one final thought. I'll spill a little secret. If you only have one hard drive, delete the recovery partition, install Windows 7 then need Vista back for some reason (I, personally, can't think of any) there is one final alternative. Call Dell Tech. support, ask for the SRCDs for your service tag (you may need to be still under warranty). System Restoration CDs (or DVDs). They'll deny they exist. Mention they are part # 59221. They'll deny again. Keep at it (it may take more than one call). Eventually a manager will come on and say "Oh SRCDs! why didn't you say so?" Then they will overnight the SRCDs.

What are SRCDs (or DVDs for Vista computers)? They are not the backup disks you can request here: https://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/dellcare/en/backupcd_form

They are a set of DVDs burned specifically to your Service Tag. You boot the first one (of 3 or 4 DVDs for Vista, 2 or 3 CDs for XP) and they start a process (using Norton Ghost) to load all of the DVDs, completely format the hard drive, install the OS the way it was shipped (including software originally purchased, drivers, etc.), create the recovery partition and recovery/restoration tools, create a recovery image to put in the recovery partition and then boot into the OOBE like the computer just arrived. Dells of the past couple years have very little bloatware (and no trialware except sometimes an AV) and the SRCDs have even less.

So that's it. If you don't want the recovery partition hanging around, delete it.
Tom