How do you confirm USB3 is operational

[Reggie49]

G'Day All,
I have an fairly new ASUS laptop that has a USB 3 port onboard. In preparation for buying a WD passport USB 3 drive I decided to downloaded the latest USB 3 driver from the ASUS website. When I tried to install it the installation ceased and gave an error code.

I rang ASUS tech support, they gave me a link to another driver which I downloaded and the same problem occurred. After many follow up calls I came to the conclusion they were of no help at all, especially when they finally suggested formatting the hard drive and doing a fresh installation, which I wasn't prepared to do seeing everything else seemed to be humming along okay!

Okay so what's the problem I hear you ask:
Seeing this driver wouldn't install correctly, could the original USB3 driver have been corrupted, because when I connected my WD passport drive, I'm not convinced it's operating as a USB3 device and with my limited knowledge I have no way of telling if it is.

I've checked the BIOS and the only option for USB3 is to change from 2 switching modes, which I don't want to fiddle with yet until I hopefully hear from someone with some suggestions.

When I checked under the USB Heading in Device Manager there are USB 3 options listed along with a Composite driver. On checking the Drives heading in Device Manager for the WD passport drive, the driver shows the date of 2006 which is the same date as that used for the Composite USB.

This didn't seem right to me so I tried to do a driver update from both the software that came with the WD passport drive, and from the net. Windows reports the latest driver is already installed installed.

I found a thread here about USB3 ports not working, (http://www.sevenforums.com/hardware-devices/120199-usb-3-0-ports-not-working.html) But I'm not sure whether this is relevant to me as I my USB listings don't show any errors with the drivers, I just don't seem to be able to access the USB 3 setting.

Hoping somone is able to help. Cheers Ron

 

[Golden]

Hi Ron,

This is an area I am also interested in pursuing ie. how much faster is USB3.0 v USB2.0. My understanding is it has to be enabled in the BIOS for some motheboards. Anyway....

This is perhaps a crude method, but should give you a definitive answer:

1. Copy a file of known size (preferbaly a large file) onto a classic USB2.0 device.
2. Copy the same file to your new USB3.0 device

and then compare the time it takes to do that.

Regards,
Golden

 

[jessejw]

Hi Ron,

This is an area I am also interested in pursuing ie. how much faster is USB3.0 v USB2.0. My understanding is it has to be enabled in the BIOS for some motheboards. Anyway....

This is perhaps a crude method, but should give you a definitive answer:

1. Copy a file of known size (preferbaly a large file) onto a classic USB2.0 device.
2. Copy the same file to your new USB3.0 device

and then compare the time it takes to do that.

Regards,
Golden

My friend was just over and he brought his external 700gb 3.0 USB and its a ton faster i copped a 902MB file in about 15 seconds.

 

[Reggie49]

Doing just that is what made me think I wasn't being connected as a USB3 device.

I saved a 3Gb folder from the laptop to the WD passport and it took 2+minutes to save. I then copied the same folder from the passport drive to my desktop computer via a USB2 port and it took just over 2 minutes.

Any comments guys on how to verify this please

 

[Phone Man]

First thing if to be sure you have the proper cable. Then after the unit is plugged in go to Device Manager and right click on the USB Hub and look at the Advanced Tab.




Low Speed = USB 1.0
Full Speed = USB 1.1
High Speed = USB 2.0
Super Speed = USB 3.0

Jim

 

[Reggie49]

Thanks for the reply Jim.
Checked the device manager, in the list there are 2 Generic Root Hubs and 2 Universal Root hubs, none of them seem to be associated with the WD passport HDD, and all indicate they are running at high speed. So as I guessed the drive isn't operating at the right speed

As the drive is packaged as a USB3 drive from Western Digital, I'm assuming the lead they supplied is correct for this purpose. A wrong assumption do you think?

Any clues as to how to get the drive to connect as a USB3?

 

[Phone Man]

If you check on the Power tab it should list which devices are on that hub. The USB 3 cables are different so don't know what you have.

USB 3.0 connector pinout and wiring @ pinoutsguide.com

4 pin USB A or USB B plug connector diagram and applications @ pinouts.ru

USB 2.0 only has 4 pins while USB 3.0 has 9 or 11 pins.

Jim

 

[alphanumeric]

One thing to consider is that just because a device is USB 3 compatible that doesn't necessarily mean it will run at the full USB 3 speed. A lot of them don't even come close to USB 2 speed. You need to read the fine print. If you compare your two external hard drives you may find that one is basically a laptop drive that runs at 5400 RPM and the other is a desktop drive that runs at 7200 RPM. Those thin small external drives usually have a 2.5 inch form factor drive inside and the larger ones a 3.5 inch drive. In any case if the drive inside the case is a mechanical drive with platters you'll never get close to USB 3 speeds from it.

 

[thefabe]

Here are a couple test programs. USB 2.0 test coml;iance Test Software http://www.home.agilent.com/agilent/product.jspx?nid=-35491.536908137.00&cc=US&lc=eng

USB 3.0 Compliance Test software U7243A USB 3.0 Compliance Test Software | Agilent
Overall article USB (2.0/3.0/Wireless) Design and Test | Agilent
Fabe

 

[Reggie49]

Thanks for your comments guys, but I'm beginning to think that there's no easy way to determine the drive is connecting to the laptop as a USB 3 device.

Does anyone know of a checklist procedure to be able to verify this.

The cable is USB 3 compliant, according to WD, so that's one step I can cross off but the others?

 

[essenbe]

If you connect it to a usb 2.0 port, you should get a pop up on your desktop saying 'this device can perform faster'. You can also transfer the same file from your friends computer to your external and see how long it takes.

 

[whs]

I think there is a lot of hype regarding USB3 for spinning disks. Lets look at the facts:

-- USB2 has a maximum transfer rate of 480 Mbps
-- USB3 has a theoritical transfer rate of up to 6 Gbps

However, let's look at the disks

-- Spinning disks (5.400 and 7.200 Rpm) have a transfer rate of 500 to 800 Mbps ( some Raptors may be faster)

So for those disks you will see at best a 60% performance improvement. In fact I made a 22GB image to a USB2 external in 12 minutes and to a USB3 external in 9 minutes. So it was relatively unexciting.

But once we get large SSDs that are affordable for storage, that will be another story.

 

[Phone Man]

If they had designed USB 3.0 to be only twice as fast as USB 2.0 it would get maxed out before it got going. With a 6Gbps speed it has lots of room for future growth.

Jim

 

[pparks1]

The easiest way to test it to simply time the transfer of a large file. Get yourself an ISO file or something else which is 1GB or 2GB in size. Copying those files via USB 2.0 would results in about 25 MB/sec. So, a 1GB file would take about 40 seconds to transfer over USB2. A 2GB file would take about 80 seconds to transfer.

If you are using a USB3 device, I would expect that you would get at least 50MB/sec...so a 1GB file would be done in about 20 seconds and a 2GB file would be done in about 40 seconds. If you are going this fast, or faster...it's certainly working.

Most USB 3 devices are limited by the speeds of the hard drive itself...not the bus speeds.

 

[Cr00zng]

The maximum throughput rate for USB 2.0 is 480Mb/s, or 60MB/s; the maximum throughput rate for the USB 3.0 4.8Gb/s, or 600MB/s.

There's no USB 2.0 device that can achive maximum transfer rate, even the best of them max out at around 320Mb/s, or 40MB/s. That's 2/3 of the maximum transfer rate; the chances are that the USB 3.0 devices will not reach the maximum transfer rate either. They probably will top out at 3.2Gb/s, or 400MB/s. Still an awesome speed and would be faster than the best SATA 3.0, or 6G, SSD drives.

The maximum transfer rate for the SATA 3.0 is 6Gb/s, or 750MB/s. Similarly to the USB devices, the current SSD devices don't even come close to the maximum transfer rate. For example the Crucial C300 series SSD (256GB) has a maximum read speed of 355MB/s and write speed of 215MB/s; not even close to 50% of the SATA 3.0 specification. Don't take me wrong, the SSD devices are a lot faster than any single mechanical drive can ever be, that's not the point.

The point is that neither the USB, nor the SATA devices live up to the specification defined speed. The actual transfer rate is anywhere from less than 50 to about 70 percentile of the specification defined speed. It sort of reminds me of buying 2x4 in the US, that has an actual size of 1.5x3.5...

 

[whs]

The maximum throughput rate for USB 2.0 is 480Mb/s, or 60MB/s; the maximum throughput rate for the USB 3.0 4.8Gb/s, or 600MB/s.

There's no USB 2.0 device that can achive maximum transfer rate, even the best of them max out at around 320Mb/s, or 40MB/s. That's 2/3 of the maximum transfer rate; the chances are that the USB 3.0 devices will not reach the maximum transfer rate either. They probably will top out at 3.2Gb/s, or 400MB/s. Still an awesome speed and would be faster than the best SATA 3.0, or 6G, SSD drives.

The maximum transfer rate for the SATA 3.0 is 6Gb/s, or 750MB/s. Similarly to the USB devices, the current SSD devices don't even come close to the maximum transfer rate. For example the Crucial C300 series SSD (256GB) has a maximum read speed of 355MB/s and write speed of 215MB/s; not even close to 50% of the SATA 3.0 specification. Don't take me wrong, the SSD devices are a lot faster than any single mechanical drive can ever be, that's not the point.

The point is that neither the USB, nor the SATA devices live up to the specification defined speed. The actual transfer rate is anywhere from less than 50 to about 70 percentile of the specification defined speed. It sort of reminds me of buying 2x4 in the US, that has an actual size of 1.5x3.5...

Your point is well taken. The reason why the max. can normally not be achieved is because the max. refers to the optimal blocksize that is being transferred. But normally the operations do not use these blocksizes.

The best example is the system itself which use a 4k blocksize in many cases. And that is usually far from being optimal - even for a SSD. If you look at the Atto Benchmarks in this thread, you can clearly see that.

 

[Reggie49]

Thanks

From this information, it seems that my USB 3 port is working as after doing some more tests on the HDD with HD Tune. I'm realising 24Mb/Sec at USB 2 and 50Mb/sec through the USB 3.

I've now got another issue, (for those who might be able to help there please see: "Can't update to latest USB 3 Driver") I downloaded and tried to update the USB 3 driver and now have other issues.

Thanks to all who have given me the benefit of their wisdom, most appreciated.

 

[Phone Man]

If we compare MAX design speed, all the devices fall short. However when you compare operation speeds between USB 2.0 and 3.0, the 3.0 does perform better. I believe the protocol of 3.0 was tweaked to handle the overhead better and this is where the difference shows up. Here is a link to my post from last year. Same external drives tested on 2.0 and 3.0 so the only difference was the interface.

http://www.sevenforums.com/hardware-devices/75945-usb-3-0-vs-2-0-a.html

If your auto has a max speed of 50mph and mine is 70mph it does not matter if they raise the speed limit from 75mph to 100mph since neither one of us can reach either limit, but my auto still goes faster.

Jim

 

[Reggie49]

G'Day Jim,
Thanks for your analogy, puts things into perspective.

My problem is, I think I bought a Ferrari, it's running a bit better than a Model T, and I'm wondering if the new USB 3 drivers can ever be installed, (Getting error 1605), if the performance will get me to at least a Shelby Mustang!

Cheers Ron

 

[Ponmayilal]

Talking of USB3, I have plugged in a SYBA USB 3.0 two-port PCIe card into the only slot in my GigaByte motherboard. (didn't want to spend on a new motherboard with USB3 )

These PCIe cards and as I believe most other motherboards, use the NEC/Renesas USB 3.0 Host Controller chip UPD 720200/720200A.

Though I have a Seagate GoFlex 500GB portable External drive, I haven't yet purchased the the USB3 cable/adapter for it.

The following info may be pertinent here.

Device Manager - View devices by type



Device Manager - view devices by connection (showing a pendrive plugged into the USB3 port of the card )



Benchmarking the USB 3.0 performance of the Seagate GoFlex

Source:Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex 500Gb Ultra-portable Drive Review