More Than 3 Out of 4 Enthusiasts Reject Windows 8

[SIW2]

You're both right.

It is possible to make 8 more usable on a desktop - but only by working around MS intention.

The phone interface is to push users into the clouds and promote other MS services - Bing for example.

That is the point of 8.

I absolutely hate windows 8 it's only for Tablet PC's and not other pc's.

That's rubbish, I use both Win 7 and Win 8, and Win 8 works fine with a mouse. You don't need a touch screen. The desktop is still there. It plays all my games. Classic Start lets you ignore the Start Screen, and then you wouldn't know whether you were in 7 or 8.

8 is no better or worse than 7. Just different.

I'd be far more concerned about MS' push to the cloud and subscription-based software, than a new interface that any idiot should be able to learn. Or avoid/bypass.

Wenda.

 

[PaulGo]

Blue state: Microsoft's tricky strategy to strike back against Apple and Google

...After years of domination, Microsoft is finally facing serious threats at the cores of its business, Office and Windows. Consumers and businesses alike are largely purchasing devices based on their capabilities and form factors rather than the software contained within. Windows is slowly becoming commoditized and Microsoft’s traditional allies are looking at Android and Chrome OS as viable alternatives, a trend that threatens the Windows monopoly. Microsoft faces a tricky balancing act as it faces a future that’s very different from its existing business.


Protecting the two cash cows, Office and Windows, by licensing software to businesses and OEMs has long been the strategy in Redmond — but things are starting to change. Microsoft is moving towards the cloud, and beyond that it sees Blue.


...The other shift with Blue — software as a service — also requires consumer buy-in, moving from a product you own to something you rent and pay for annually or monthly. If Windows and Office are truly becoming commoditized then Microsoft has to convince the average customer that it’s worth paying to access its software and services in a move away from traditional licensing. It’s a big ask, and Office 365 subscriptions are a testbed for moves elsewhere in the company.

Blue state: Microsoft's tricky strategy to strike back against Apple and Google | The Verge

 

[SIW2]

Looks like the author has been following my posts.

Finally .... someone else is starting to catch on

Microsoft is moving towards an era where it may eventually sell access to Windows or its services as part of a subscription, in the same way it has started to do so for its Office 365 service.

May?

I suppose they might have to adjust if they get enough resistance.

 

[Layback Bear]

Microsoft cloud of programs ect. was created not because the masses requested. Not because the masses need it.
It has a purpose that allows Microsoft to monitor various things and of course a different price structure.
If during Microsoft's monitoring they should be a to control Counterfeits much quicker and easier. Which has a value of probably billions.
They will have the ability of selling, renting or leasing many programs and apps. Every time one uses one of these programs or app it could be checked for Authenticity.
Try to remember that Counterfeits cost billions and billions of dollars every year. (Music, Movies, Programs,Operating Systems,ect.) Companies will continue trying to stop such theft. Of course this will also punish the honest people and companies.
I do believe that cloud computing will also put a strain on the internet. Some how the ISP's will have to try to solve this heaver usage problem. Let me guess it will cost more money for the consumer.
--------
Microsoft did not make Windows 8 or a cloud for every thing because the consumer needs or wants such things with a PC or Laptop. They made it to force consumers into using them so Microsoft has more control and makes more money.

 

[mart4494]

If during Microsoft's monitoring they should be a to control Counterfeits much quicker and easier. Which has a value of probably billions.
They will have the ability of selling, renting or leasing many programs and apps. Every time one uses one of these programs or app it could be checked for Authenticity.

I agree with all attempts to stop piracy even though I will confess to it in my early computing 'career'. Software theft be it in the form of programs, music downloads, etc simply stymies future development of the product in addition to depriving folks earning from their efforts which is of course morally wrong and definitely illegal.

What I do not believe are some of the figures that are plucked out of the air by both software companies, music and film distributors, etc to simply justify enforcement. They are best based on a guestimate and then probably exaggerated. It is automatically assumed that if a piece of software, music, video is pirated (stolen) then if that route hadn't been available then the individual would have purchased it - a total nonsensical conclusion. It's rather like suggesting that if someone steals a Mercedes then if they hadn't been able to they would have gone and bought one!!

Whatever efforts MS or indeed anyone else puts into place to make sure that the software they are using is authentic, then you can bet your bottom $ that there will be a hack available to overcome it. MS are loosing overall market share and they see their revenues under attack. So it's off to subscription cloud computing and paid for downloaded apps.

Not for me, I'll stay with Win7. Maybe one day Linux will really get up to speed or who knows there could just be a desktop Android released that will run traditional desktop programs. Now that would be interesting.

 

[sygnus21]

Please, Microsoft isn't going anywhere. And, it seems to me, Apple is the one who relented by allowing Windows to run besides it's OS. I'm sure the HUGE Windows market share, and the proliferation of Windows software played a hand in the decision. Without it, I don't think Apple's PC would have the market share they have now. They were simply too walled off.

Now here comes Microsoft, wanting to gain a foothold in the Android and social media market, enter Windows 8. Yeah it's a radical change from anything we know, but I honestly don't see Microsoft abandoning this.

As I've been saying, we live in a mobile world where everything needs to be able to communicate with one another - Windows 8 is just the beginning. The large clunky desktops, while not dead, are being relegated to the specialized or gaming community. Basically computing is getting smaller, lighter, faster, and more mobile. Businesses are on the move, and need this mobility (to include cloud), while at the same time being productive. Sitting behind a desktop is a thing of the past. Thank smartphones!

Yes, 8 has some things to hate, and yes, I fear being advertised to death with the live tiles, but once you start playing with the OS, and getting into the meat of it, it really isn't bad. Aside from the outside being butt ugly, the inside isn't that bad. And I don't even have a touch screen.

Am I ready to replace my Win 7 OS on my desktop? Not yet, but playing around with 8 shows it isn't as bad we make it out to be. And let's be honest here, for the most part, people are complaining about the looks, NOT the performance, which is just as good, if not better, than 7. And this is coming from a former Windows 8 hater (H8ter).

BTW I know laptops are optimized for startup, but still it blows my Win 7 SSD driven desktop. I just turn on the laptop and the OS is loaded - basically insta-on.

And no, I have no hacks or added start menu. Aside from adding the games from 7, which incidentally, I don't use, the OS is being used straight up, on a non-touch screen laptop.

Anyway I guarantee some of you will view it differently once you actually get past the looks and actually play with it for awhile.

 

[lehnerus2000]

Agreed

What I do not believe are some of the figures that are plucked out of the air by both software companies, music and film distributors, etc to simply justify enforcement. They are best based on a guestimate and then probably exaggerated. It is automatically assumed that if a piece of software, music, video is pirated (stolen) then if that route hadn't been available then the individual would have purchased it - a total nonsensical conclusion. It's rather like suggesting that if someone steals a Mercedes then if they hadn't been able to they would have gone and bought one!!

Just look at the RIAA.

​

One thing is certain, if "Piracy" was eliminated, Corporate profits would increase.

It's extremely doubtful that:

• IP product prices would fall
• IP producers (coders, musicians, film-makers) would actually receive any additional income

BTW, I'm not condoning "Piracy".

 

[Dallas 7]

.....Am I ready to replace my Win 7 OS on my desktop? Not yet, but playing around with 8 shows it isn't as bad we make it out to be.

IMO, not only is it as bad as we've made it out to be, it's going to get worse because Microsoft is going to double down with Blue. After Blue, it'll be W9 and we'll be lucky if there's any trace of the desktop remaining.
W8 isn't the end game Sygnus21, it's a stepping stone. Ultimately the argument isn't really about W8, it's about the destruction of the desktop.
Paul Thurrott and a lot of experts/industry watchdogs believe the writing is on the wall; Microsoft has painted a big red target on the back of the desktop.

If one is willing to sacrifice their desktop at the alter of "M$ Knows Best" or "All Change Is Good Even If It's Bad", then I guess they'll see W8 as a good thing.

Sygnus, you did state that you're not ready to replace your W7 OS on your desktop and I'm with you on that!
I have no problem with change if it's a GOOD change, but demoting /dumping the desktop is not a good change, and it's certainly not necessary.
If Microsoft sticks to that asinine course of action,
"They'll have to pry my cold dead fingers off the keyboard & mouse of my W7 Desktop!"

 

[sygnus21]

IMO, I believe it's just as bad as we make it out to be, but it's not as bad yet as it's going to be. Microsoft is going to double down with Blue.

Well...

And yeah, Microsoft is going to address issues with the release of Blue. Until it's actually released and installed, everything speculated is just guesswork.

BTW have you used 8? Not just touched it, but actually used it for some time?

 

[bobtran]

There is always React OS
ReactOS Project
Just need a billionaire to pump some cash into it and then we have a choice.

I've been waiting half a decade for that one to mature from VM.
What I've seen though looks good.

In the space of one busy thread we changed into a Linux forum.

Nyuk,Nyuk,Nyuk, as a famous bald guy once said.:roflmao:

ReactOS® is NOT linux. ReactOS® is a free open source operating systemhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system based on the best design principles found in the Windows NT® architecture and written from scratch by knowledgeable software designers.

 

[gregrocker]

There is always React OS
ReactOS Project
Just need a billionaire to pump some cash into it and then we have a choice.

I've been waiting half a decade for that one to mature from VM.
What I've seen though looks good.

In the space of one busy thread we changed into a Linux forum.

Nyuk,Nyuk,Nyuk, as a famous bald guy once said.:roflmao:

ReactOS® is NOT linux. ReactOS® is a free open source operating system based on the best design principles found in the Windows NT® architecture and written from scratch by knowledgeable software designers.

I was not referring to React being Linux. The quote is taken out of sequence.

During the middle ten chapters of this bible was discussion about how Linux may be the enthusiast's successor to Win7.

 

[SIW2]

Yes, it may be.

I am really starting to get into Linux Mint Cinnamon.

Mucking around now trying to boot all my windows and linux live from a single usb.

I can see where they are going with Zorin - it is a bit ott for me though.

Just had a look at kubuntu. It looks gorgeous. Bit bloated , and there are a couple of odd bugs.

Mint seems to have the balance right.

 

[mart4494]

BTW have you used 8? Not just touched it, but actually used it for some time?

I used the pre-release on my laptop for a couple of months and I really couldn't see the point of W8 and upgraded back to W7. Maybe we have just reached the point where we use whatever suits our needs best rather than having the latest (and usually) the greatest release from MS.

The problem MS has with it's existing user base is one of disappointment regarding W8. And nope, they don't have the same slavish like following that the fruit company has. Even that though I suspect is coming to an end.

 

[SIW2]

Has anybody managed to get windows and linux ( including the live sessions ) to boot off the same usb?

I have got it working using syslinux, might see if I can chain it the other way starting with bootmgr.

That works for bootmgr>grub4dos., so I expect there is a way.

Bit complicated as I have a lot of different os I would like to boot from one usb.

 

[mart4494]

One thing is certain, if "Piracy" was eliminated, Corporate profits would increase.

It's extremely doubtful that:

• IP product prices would fall
• IP producers (coders, musicians, film-makers) would actually receive any additional income

BTW, I'm not condoning "Piracy".

Agree 100% but in the real world 'piracy' will never be eliminated. Also folks do not consider it a crime to sell on their downloaded paid for MP3's to someone else whatever the EULA states.

 

[Dallas 7]

IMO, I believe it's just as bad as we make it out to be, but it's not as bad yet as it's going to be. Microsoft is going to double down with Blue.

Well...

And yeah, Microsoft is going to address issues with the release of Blue. Until it's actually released and installed, everything speculated is just guesswork.

BTW have you used 8? Not just touched it, but actually used it for some time?

I've seen it, researched it, and tried it in the store several times, and didn't like it at all. The only way to "Use it for some time" as you put it would be to spend money on something I don't like, to see if I might change my mind.

When I bought my car, I looked at it, researched it, test drove it and liked it, so I bought it.
If I had hated it, you're suggesting I should've bought it anyway just incase I changed my mind? LOL

Besides, I already know what I think about tablet/phone OS's, We have IPhones and an IPad. Tablet/phone OSs work fine on tablets and phones, but not on my desktop.

I bought XP, Vista, and W7, but I'm not buying W8.

 

[sygnus21]

That's fine. I'm not here to convince you. But some of the FUD I've been reading here is downright out in left field. If you're going to hate something have a valid reason, not just some slavish following to others fears and misunderstandings.

My two cents.

 

[Dallas 7]

That's fine. I'm not here to convince you. But some of the FUD I've been reading here is downright out in left field. If you're going to hate something have a valid reason, not just some slavish following to others fears and misunderstandings.

My two cents.

Sygnus I don't believe Microsoft simply forgot to include desktop friendly options in W8. I believe they threw the desktop under the bus on purpose, not by accident, and until Microsoft does something to change the direction they're moving in, I believe I have VERY "valid reasons" for disliking W8.
Read Paul Thurrott's article about W Blue entitled:

What the “Blue” Leak Tells Us About Microsoft’s Strategy
What the
"...From a strategy standpoint, however, the leaked Blue build speaks volumes about how Microsoft views the future of computing in the wake of what many see as a disastrous Windows 8 launch. And it’s very easy to communicate.
Nothing has changed.
Nothing.
That is, Microsoft still sees the touch-centric Metro environment as the future of mainstream computing. There are no improvements to the desktop environment in Windows 8—no surprise there—but also no improvements to the tenuous connects between the desktop and Metro....."

 

[Wenda]

IMO, I believe it's just as bad as we make it out to be, but it's not as bad yet as it's going to be. Microsoft is going to double down with Blue.

Well...

And yeah, Microsoft is going to address issues with the release of Blue. Until it's actually released and installed, everything speculated is just guesswork.

BTW have you used 8? Not just touched it, but actually used it for some time?

I've seen it, read about it, and tried it in the store a few times, and didn't like it at all. The only way to "Use it for some time" as you put it would be to spend money on something I don't like, to see if I might change my mind.


I bought XP, Vista, and W7, but I'm not buying W8.

You can still get a FREE 90-day trial version of Windows 8 Enterprise from Microsoft.

I used this version to try the RTM before deciding whether to pony-up for the retail version.

You MUST do a clean install, and it CANNOT be upgraded, although it CAN be re-activated
once, to give 180 days (6 months) of basically free Windows 8. It is 100% functional.

For anyone who's thinking of getting 8, but is leery of spending the money on something
they may not like, this is a damned good option. Install Classic Start, and go for it.

I (and Microsoft) recommend running it in a VM, but it CAN be used as your main OS if
desired.

Get it, and/or more info here...

Download Windows 8 Enterprise Evaluation


Hope this may be useful for someone.

Wenda

 

[mjf]

This is a spirited and very useful discussion at least for me.
Admins/Mods do you think we should move it to the VIP area??
But don't kill it. - I mean the linux discussion.