UPS or no UPS? What's the risk after a blackout?

[martinlest]

Hi,

I am buying a new gaming PC: i7-4790K CPU, nVidia GTX970, 2 x Corsair 256GB LX SSDs... The case is a Coolermaster Elite 130 (mini format) as I live abroad much of the year for my work and want to be able to take the PC unit as hand luggage on flights, to run MS Flight Simulator there.

Problem is, I am in Sri Lanka for my present contract (only a problem is respect of this PC - otherwise not!), where the current is very unsteady. I have a surge guard I plug into, but the real issue is sudden blackouts. Not all that common here, but much much more so than in the west.

Buying a suitable UPS adds a huge amount to the cost and for the odd occasion when a blackout coincides with my PC running, I wonder if it's worth it. Can there be hardware damage from a blackout? I've never noticed anything amiss like that before when I have lost power.

In 6 months I'll be back in the UK, so again, a disincentive to pay for a 650W+ UPS. (The PSU is 600W). Ideally I'd buy one, but getting it over here + cost... Don't want to risk any hardware damage though, needless to say. But is that really a possibility? O/S is Win7x64

What do folks advise?

Thanks,

Martin

 

[fireberd]

A power outage, while the PC is powered on, can cause untold damage. Corrupting the hard drive is one often problem. The surge protector, unless a high quality protector may not help you.

 

[martinlest]

Thanks for the quick reply. From all the threads I have read before posting here, many people seem to say that it is a spike that can cause hardware damage (of course), but a power outage is unlikely to do so. Rebooting in Safe Mode and doing a disk check is what many recommend.

But who knows what is right or wrong on so many PC forums! More precise info would be welcome.

Many thanks

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
Yes it's worth wild investment to protect your machine

The other thing that is usually not considered is the sudden turning back on voltage and if it repeat 2-3 times,

Power outages are bad enough and eventually will do damage just consider yourself lucky so far

I just spent a lot of money on a new assembly and to protect that investment I also made an additional investment in a APC XS 1500
I call it a wise investment considering it's a fraction of the total price of the machines cost

 

[fireberd]

I used to manage a large WAN/LAN Network (My area was all the Government Agency I worked for computer equipment from west of the Mississippi River to the Rocky Mountains and North Dakota to Texas). I've seen what power outages can do, if the equipment is not protected. Even here in the US with mostly "solid" AC power I will still have a UPS on my PC system and on my LCD HD TV.

 

[martinlest]

Yes, you are right I am sure. I wonder if anyone can recommend a UPS that would be suitable (small enough) to travel with and support a PC powered at 550-600W? I was looking at this, but I am not sure if it's powerful enough for the system I want to buy (can post a fuller spec if necessary)??

CyberPower VALUE 1000EILCD Value Series Uninterruptible Power Supply, 550W/1000VA: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

The next one up (720W/1200VA - option on the same page) is a big jump in price. (What is the VA value?). Is the 900W/1500VA an even better option (not a lot more than the 720W). Does the higher value give a better guarantee that the PC will stay on during a blackout? (I only need enough time to shut down the PC).

The 550W/1000VA is also a lot more transportable than the others - half the weight for one (specs down the page). Pointless though if it's not up to the job. I am not sure how the spec of the UPS corresponds to the spec of the PC. If the PSU is 600W, does that mean a 550W UPS is underpowered for that system?

Keep wondering if I'd be better with a laptop!

Thanks

 

[ThrashZone]

For a mobile I would imagine you could get a lower type
The important thing to remember is these items are best served as a chance to properly save and shut down a machine if power is lost.

If it were a fixed location the highest would give you more time to possibly wait it out until the power recovers.
Budget usually dictates size.
Careful with Amazon try to buy products they sell and ship

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

If the power to a PC is suddenly terminated while the PC is running (aka, a cold shutdown), anything in RAM will be lost. This will cause any unsaved work to be lost and various PC parameters that normally get saved when shutting down will also be lost, which can cause improper operation when you reboot. Often, a single cold shutdown will not be manifested upon reboot but each additional cold shutdown can have an accumulative effect until the time comes the PC either will reboot improperly or will not reboot at all. There also is the danger that voltage spikes and current surges can do additional (and permanent) physical damage to the PC although a good surge protector will usually protect against that.

A UPS will extend the operating time of a PC until it has time to shut down properly. Many will automatically hibernate an unattended PC a specified number minutes after an event (power failure) to ensure data and operating parameters are not lost. They also have built in live surge and spike protection as well as isolating computer from the mains after an event to give further surge and spike protection.

While a UPS is the best way to protect a computer from power outages, they are expensive and heavy, the latter being a problem when you travel. One way to protect yourself without lugging a UPS around is to never leave the PC running unattended so, if a power outage does occur, you can immediately disconnect it from the mains to avoid potentially damaging spikes and surges when the power resumes. By making frequent images of your computer and storing them externally, you can restore your original settings back to what they were at the time you made the image after a strike to reduce or even eliminate the cumaltive damage from the outages. An image restoration should be done after every cold shut down. Of course, you will lose any unsaved work with this method (although frequently saving your work will reduce the amount of loss) and there still is a possibility that damage will occur anyway but, at least, the chances of that may be reduced. A UPS is still the best alternative.

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Yes, you are right I am sure. I wonder if anyone can recommend a UPS that would be suitable (small enough) to travel with and support a PC powered at 550-600W? I was looking at this, but I am not sure if it's powerful enough for the system I want to buy (can post a fuller spec if necessary)??

CyberPower VALUE 1000EILCD Value Series Uninterruptible Power Supply, 550W/1000VA: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

The next one up (720W/1200VA - option on the same page) is a big jump in price. (What is the VA value?). Is the 900W/1500VA an even better option (not a lot more than the 720W). Does the higher value give a better guarantee that the PC will stay on during a blackout? (I only need enough time to shut down the PC).

The 550W/1000VA is also a lot more transportable than the others - half the weight for one (specs down the page). Pointless though if it's not up to the job. I am not sure how the spec of the UPS corresponds to the spec of the PC. If the PSU is 600W, does that mean a 550W UPS is underpowered for that system?

Keep wondering if I'd be better with a laptop!

Thanks

The UPS you linked does not specify that it has a pure sine wave output which means it almost certainly uses a stepped sine wave output. While, in the past, a stepped sine wave emulated a pure sine wave closely enough to be acceptable, many, if not most, modern electronic equipment, including newer computer PSUs, will not operate well on a stepped sine wave, if at all, and may even be damaged when operated for very long on a stepped sine wave. Unfortunately, pure sine wave UPSes are much more expensive and heavier than stepped sine wave units.

For travel, a laptop whould be a much better choice. Besides being far more portable, the laptop's battery would give you much more time to safely shut down and disconnect from the mains to ensure no damage or loss of data will occur from a cold shutdown and the spikes and surges when the power is restored

 

[Wandering one]

I have always set the BIOS to require manual restart after power loss. More damage will be done with a momentary returns of the power source, and the likeliest time for power spikes.
Art.

 

[martinlest]

Thanks. At the end of the day, a laptop would be false economy I think, as my 5 year-old gaming PC in the UK is now a bit lame, with its i7-950 CPU (at 3.8GHz) and as I want something to use when I am abroad that will not then be redundant back in London , I had better upgrade now, rather than get a laptop (feebler as well as dearer than a mini-PC) then upgrade the PC when I get back to the UK.

When I say I want this for travelling, in fact it will go from the UK to my workplace abroad once, then back again at the end of my contract - it's not as if I am travelling around with it, so a mini-PC, a monitor and a UPS are do-able, with the latter two well-wrapped in my checked-in luggage and the mini-PC as hand luggage.

I wasn't really aware of the problem with a stepped sine wave UPS, but Googling this a bit further, I think I had better pay out for a pure sine wave model! Thanks for the heads up. Not sure which one to get - the one's on Amazon.co.uk all have some bad reviews but I'll keep seaching. The PSU in the PC is a Corsair Builder Series CX600W. What rating UPS would I need for this, to be confident of protecting against a blackout? 650W? 750W? The power does go off for a few seconds here and then come back on, so I clearly do need to protect against that.

How about this?

CyberPower CP1300EPFCLCD PFC Sinewave Uninterruptible Power Supply (780W/1300VA)

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

While that is probably a good UPS, whether it would meet your needs depends on how much your computer actually draws when you are giving it a good workout. Just because the computer has a 600W PSU doesn't mean it draws that much. You can get a power meter, such as the Kill-a-Watt, and monitor your actual power usage. Once you know how much it draws (keep in mind you will need to keep the monitor running so you have to factor in its load as well), then you can decide how big of a UPS you need.

The UPS you linked will probably give you around three minutes run time at 600W. That means you would have only three minutes to shut down or hibernate your computer if you get a prolonged power outage. If you take all three minutes to shut down. It will take eight hours to recharge the batteries. If, in fact, you do not ever draw more than, say, 400W you would probably have about eight minutes runtime. If you can shut down within two minutes, you would have enough capacity for up to four outages before depleting the batteries, possibly more if there is enough time between outages to let the batteries at least partially recharge. Keep in mind that this is for new batteries. They will lose capacity as they age.

Personally, I would prefer a larger UPS but then, I wouldn't be lugging the thing around (the one I have weighs 75 lb.; there is no way I can even pick the darned thing up, let alone lug it around!) so, once you know how much load—PC and monitor—you have, you will have decide on a compromise that is acceptable for you (basically, it's between run time, weight, and budget).

Btw, you were smart not to take my word for anything and do your own research.

 

[martinlest]

Thanks! yes "it's between run time, weight, and budget" - and 3 minutes is ample for me to hibernate the PC. Power outages aren't that common here (unlike in India where I lived before) and back in the UK, pretty much never. But in the UK I'd be happy to have the UPS to iron out any spikes - and who knows where I might then move to (I've been moving around the world for over 30 years now, so have gathered a kind of unstoppable momentum!).

I'll probably go with the model I indicated (though there is a 1500VA/900W for only £30 more??), but I have a few more weeks before I get to the UK and order, so anything could happen!

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
Yep you'd pay a premium for a gaming laptop but they are super portable
10ib UPS isn't bad though or is it 10 stones

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Ten stone?

 

[Layback Bear]

1 Stone = 14 Lbs.

10 Stones = 140 Lbs.

 

[Layback Bear]

I have always set the BIOS to require manual restart after power loss. More damage will be done with a momentary returns of the power source, and the likeliest time for power spikes.
Art.

Very good suggestion. That is also the way my systems are set.

Staying with the computer when it's on also works well and it's free and weights nothing.

When the power goes off just unplug the computer and wait until the power comes on uninterrupted.
You will loose your new data but not your computer.

I use Surge Protectors at my home on every computer and everything that plugs into the computers.

My computers are never on unless I'm behind the keyboard or very close.
On must go to the coffee pot and drop by the John now and again. It's a never ending cycle.

 

[martinlest]

Unfortunately (for this purpose!) most of the blackouts here only last a few seconds, then the current comes back, the worst scenario really. So I will need a good UPS...

 

[ThrashZone]

Indeed with the costs of gaming computers it's a very good investment

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

1 Stone = 14 Lbs.

10 Stones = 140 Lbs.

I know. My joking shock was at Mike's joking suggestion that the OP would lug around a 140 lb. UPS in his travels.