Weird lag in seemingly ALL applications.

[Fletchrr]

Hey again guys.

While I agree with almost everything that you've said spyknee, the one thing I disagree with is 'Get a bigger PSU' - I put a lot of research into getting my current PSU, and it works above and beyond its specs. Corsair ftw. I don't particularly want to spend money where it isn't needed.

My temps are similar to when I was running XP.

Stew, I think if I was more experienced in tweaking and OC'ing I would definately try to follow your advice, unfortunately I dont think i'd be able to pull it off. I've actually tried running the two cl5 sticks and they still suffered from the same problem i've been having.

According to this site: ASUS P5B Motherboard Review | Hardware Secrets - my motherboard unoffically supports 1066mhz DDR2, if you overclock it manually - obviously that brings me to the same problem. One of the kits I linked was 800 mhz, but to be honest i'm not sure if I should go for it now.

What cooling would you recommend? I have a http://www.scythe-eu.com/en/products/cpu-cooler/mugen-cpu-cooler.html at the moment, which I thought was a decent cooler. I also have an OCz RAM cooler.

 

[stew2]

Stew, I think if I was more experienced in tweaking and OC'ing

There is only 1 way to get more experience and that is to try it lol. A really easy way is to just change the fsb from its stock value of 266 to something higher like 268 and there you go you have just overclocked. With every reboot just keep pushing it higher, while at the same time keep an eye at what value you ram is at and what voltages are being used, and that's it. Overclocking is really easy once you get used to working in the bios.

When i was speaking about cooling it was more to do with case fans as they can be used in any future build and so it would not be money wasted. You motherboard temp is a bit high and so adding better or more intake case fans, you could lower the temp inside the case which would also lead to cooler cpu temps etc.

If your cl5 ram sticks don't work, then try running memtest on them first to check for errors and if any errors show up then send them back to Corsair and they will send you replacements for free. All you have to do is send them off so the total cost to you will be about £3.

 

[Fletchrr]

These are the temps when my room isn't melting in the summer heat.

http://i45.tinypic.com/2hr2tr4.jpg

 

[stew2]

Summer heat. We live in Britain the temperature never goes above minus lol.

If your not bothered about the temps then just save your money, although in your first screenshot your motherboards temp is really high and i would recommend adding at least 1 intake fan to your current system if your case allows for it.

But anyway let us know what you decide on doing.

 

[Fletchrr]

Exactly Stew ;P but over the weekend it was ridiculously hot here, 30c and my room was like an oven. Don't think my case allows for another fan, it has one on the back and one near the HDD's atm.

I tried the two sticks of cl5 and I started getting the same lag again, ran Memtest for a few passes and got no errors. Again, probably because of the timings? I dont know.

I did what you said in the bios and pushed it up to 300, RAM is running at 900mhz and the voltage is at 2v, CPU voltage is on auto. Not sure if I've done the right thing or if I can go even higher or what, but it seems to be booting fine. The temps havent changed much either. Is it safe to leave them at these values?

Incidentally, w7 reports the CPU running at 2.4ghz, while the bios says its running at 2.7ghz. Why is 7 reporting a different speed?

(edit)
Checked for the lag, and its back. (This is with the single cl4 module in) Ugh.. I can't win. Seems I will have to just keep the bios settings at the default until I figure out what to do. As fiddling with them seems to be causing the lag to reappear. No idea. Put the cl4 back in and set everything to default, running ok again.
(/edit)

Just out of curiosity (hopefully you haven't lost patience with my endless questions yet lol), say I bought 2x2GB 1066mhz modules, what settings would I need to change in the bios to get them working properly? Would I have to OC my CPU aswell? Been reading around and apparently I can safely OC this to around 3GHZ with no problems. I think i'm pretty much set on buying new RAM.

 

[stew2]

If you do decide on buying that ram id use the time just now to get used to working in the bios.

When you put the fsb to 300 dont allow the ram to go over 800 mhz as ram does not overclock well. Instead look through the list for a speed closest to but still under 800mhz. This will give you a ratio of 5:4 between cpu and ram or some other equivalent. For a stable overclock i always try and acheive a 1:1 ratio between cpu and ram which means on your pc i would use 1 of the following if it works:

fsb 350 - ram 700 - lowest cpu multiplier
fsb 375 - ram 750 - lowest cpu multiplier
fsb 400 - ram 800 - lowest cpu multiplier

As your beginning then i would set the cpu voltage to 1.30 and then try those settings. You dont need to run in a 1:1 ratio you can use other dividers, so once again its whatever runs best on your pc. Once you find a speed you like for the ram and fsb then start raising the cpu multiplier till you achieve a speed you like and that its stable and then you can start trying to reduce the voltages.

There are loads of guides on overclocking like this 1 - http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-hardware/103676-c2d-overclocking-guide-beginners.html

EDIT: forgot to say to check the temps every now and then as basically you want to try and achieve a faster or at least equal speed pc with greater stability and with lower temps if possible.

 

[Fletchrr]

Ok so I tried setting the FSB to 400, RAM to 800mhz and set the CPU voltage to 1.30v, but no luck, wouldn't boot. So I tried FSB at 350, RAM at 700 and the same CPU voltage and it seems to be working fine (3.15GHZ)

I couldnt find an option to change the CPU modifier though?

Have a couple questions. I had a look around in the bios and found CPU Ratio (Dunno if I need to change that) and do I need to change anything in the Northbridge Settings or is that just for setting the RAM timings etc?

After I posted this, I tried running the 'Windows Experience Index' to see if the CPU reading would change. I got a BSOD lol. Went and changed the FSB to 333 and the RAM to 667mhz (Dunno if that will help)

 

[stew2]

Your supposed to try it the other way round lol. Start with a lower fsb and then work your way up.

For the cpu multiplier under the advanced tab there should be a cpu configuration you can select. You then select modify ratio support and set it to enabled and then you can set it to something lower.

For the northbridge id just leave that on auto for just now, once you have got everything else set up you can try and lower voltages for the northbridge.

That guide i just posted is quite good and easy to follow. Just remember start small and work your way up and always check the ram speed after changing the fsb as its good practice, so if you do eventually buy new ram you will know exactly what you are doing.

 

[Fletchrr]

Yea.. ^^; I guess I was a little over enthusiastic. 333 seems to be working ok though. I'll go into the bios and check the settings you just explained.

Ok I had a look under Advanced > CPU Config

The only settinsg I can change there are these:

CPU RATIO SETTING
C1E SUPPORT
MAX CPUID VALUE LIMIT
VANDERPOOL TECHNOLOGY
CPU TM FUNCTION
EXECUTE DISABLE BIT
INTEL SpeedStep TECH

I assume the one I want to be changing is 'CPU RATIO SETTING'? I can change it from Auto to 6 (Min) and 9 (max) I tried changing it to 6 and the CPU speed went to 2GHZ. Is that what I want to be happening? (its back on AUTO atm)

 

[stew2]

Yeah thats the one and thats what you want to happen. Your telling the cpu that 6 is its max multiplier so it will never go above that. The lower the multiplier and clock speed the less volts it will require to run.

You just need to find what balance between the multiplier and volts you want. So for a 333 fsb you have choice of:

x6 = 1998
x7 = 2331
x8 = 2664
x9 = 2997

Obviously the higher the multiplier you use gives you a faster clock speed and will require more volts to run and produce more heat.

What speed is your ram at with a fsb of 333?

 

[Fletchrr]

Ah I see, slowly starting to sink in I think, lol.

At 333 the RAM is running at 667mhz and the CPU is at 3GHZ (with AUTO ratio)

The RAM speed is relatively easy to check after fiddling with the FSB because in this bios its linked and goes up as I increase it.

So if I lower the ratio but have a high FSB, what is the benefit compared to having a low FSB with a higher ratio? Such as 6x450 FSB or 9x300 FSB. Is it just the voltages required to run it? Also, is a 1:1 ratio preferred? If so for what reason? (Sorry about all the questions, im eager to learn is all, hehe)

 

[Wishmaster]

Bacically just running the FSB and/or RAM faster.
You can OC by OCing the CPU and effectivly RAM, or by lowering the multi and OC the the FSB and RAM leaving CPU at lower clocks.

6x450 would be effective FSB speed of 1800mhz -- CPU @ 2700mhz
9x300 wuld be effectivve FSB speed of 1200Mhz -- CPU @ 2700mhz

In this case, therotically 6x450 would give better benchmarks even if the RAM speed is the same, because the FSB can move DATA Faster.


However, the NB will require more voltage, depending on your board, and some simply will not run stable past a certain point.

I would just stay at a x9 multi if it were me and see what I could do with it at a 1:1 ratio first.
Then try changing the RAM strap just 1 notch up and test like that as well.

I/E 333/667 Then Try 333/800

I think in the grand scheme of things youll get much better results this way.
TRUE, faster FSB speed seem to help, but in some cases it simply takes to much get stable @ really high FSB speeds to justify a small gain.

But as always with OCing, it alot of trial and error to find that "sweet spot" for your setup. you may find running a lower multi helps in your situation more.

 

[Fletchrr]

Hey Wishmaster, thanks for the reply.

I understood almost all of what you said, besides the part about the 'RAM strap' - are they the settings in the North Bridge or something else?

 

[Wishmaster]

Different Bios calls it different things.

Some call it a DRAM strap with settings such as 333/667 333/400 333/1066 for example.

Others simply call it RAM or DRAM Speed with options such as 667,800,1066.

Both should have a seperate FSB setting as well.

However it is shown, the one where you set the the base RAM speed is what effects the ratio vs the FSB speed.

1:1 ratio should be RAM @ x2 the FSB setting.
I/e if FSB is 333 then RAM at 667 = 1:1 ratio or 400FSb with 800RAM is 1:1

But I think we might be a bit off the original topic here, unless I missed something (which is quite possible)

If you still have this lag issue in PS etc, OCing will likely not help.
If the machine doesnt run stable and smooth at default speeds, it will not OC'd either.

 

[spyknee]

Be careful about OC'ing, you could destroy something real easy.

I have ruined a mobo by having mismatched ram sticks, different manufacturers. Burned out the ram slots voltage controller.

Get matching ram sticks. You have two types now, match the better kind. You want the ram to have same voltage specs and same timings, same everything, identicle even, throughout! Then try OC'ing the ram from 800MHz to
1066MHz. Put bios ram settings on auto if possible, then eyeball the values as you play. With matched ram you can set manufacturers voltage requirement and timing settings manually.

A new PSU was just my opinion. (450W????) Your GTX vid card wants juice, a lot. Its gotta pull over 200 watts alone.{guessing} If you choose to OC,??????????????????????? If you think you have enough overhead, so be it.

You got all the latest drivers?? DirectX updates? nVidia has had a bad driver lately 197.xxx?????
I use 196.21.
Precision Tune 1.91, allow you access to vid card fan. Turn it up to 100%!
Do you have vid card settings right? ie: physx enabled, pci-e slot enabled.

Sound, onboard or in a PCI slot? I have had issues with pci sound cards and pci-e vid cards. Windows, why?????, assigns irq16 to all pci slots. I started using onboard sound only. Bad sound card drivers have caused similar issues with video, for me. Disable the sound card in device manager and then try playing your games.

Heat, I use all air cooling only. I alter the cases fan positioning and add ducting to control airflow. Put in dividers so that the different air flows do not step on each other. Proper airflow is worth 10 degree C. Is the cpu cooler clean and working 100%. Is there good thermal grease contact?

There are no free fixes when it comes to bad hardware! But you can mitigate the $ $ damage fix, with a little common sense.

 

[Fletchrr]

Hehe Wishmaster, we've kinda already singled out the problem I was originally having. I'm kinda just trying to get up to speed with my BIOS and OCing before I buy my new RAM modules.

At the moment Spyknee I have only a single module in my machine. Just 'practicing' really before I manage to save enough to buy my new RAM. 450w sounds weedy but from what i've read over the few days I was deciding to purchase it the PSU is more than enough to power my system, even overclocked. techPowerUp :: Corsair VX450W Review :: Page 4 / 5

I use RivaTuner to run my GPU fan at 70% - 100% seems overkill. Usually stays around 50-70 degrees with 70% (I had forgot to apply this until recently, thats why my posted screenshots seem a little off) As far as setting for Phsyx and PCI-e, not sure how you would go about doing so but I assume they're on. I have the latest drivers (197.45) and the latest version of dx11. Sound is integrated (SoundMax)

My machine seems to be running fine at the current settings (9x333/667)

Anyway, back to the original topic. WoW is actually running pretty well besides the occasional lag spike (and having to close EVERYTHING besides WoW and Winamp) at a solid 50-60fps with just the single stick of RAM inside it. So I think it's safe to say that my RAM is the problem. Once I buy it i'll let you guys know the results and hopefully (if you're not too fed up of me already ;P) I'll be able to get a little advice about what settings to use once I do.

Thanks to everyone for your continued help.

 

[Wishmaster]

That 450 Corsair is a excellent PSU and packs a lot more punch that it would seem.

As far as the OCing goes, I slightly disagree in the sense, I do not believe letting the MOBO "Auto" adjust any major settings is a good idea.
Better off setting timings/voltages manually.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[stew2]

Hi fletch, if you are happy with the fsb at 333 and the ram at 666 then its time to lower any voltages.

Go back into the bios and start lowering the volts you give to the cpu. At some point the volts will be too low and it will not allow you to get to the desktop. Normally using a setting 2 above that value should be enough. But once again its trial and error.

Once you have the cpu set up then go back into the bios and do the same for your northbridge.

Once you have them set up and you are at the desktop, open HWmonitor and compare the volts you are now using with the ones you originally posted on page 1. You want the values of the cpu vcore and the vins to be the same or less than the original ones.

EDIT: theres a new subforum here thats got a guide on overclocking for core2quads, its here -http://www.sevenforums.com/overclocking-case-mods/

 

[Fletchrr]

Hey again ;3

Ok so I did what you said with the CPU voltage, the lowest it went (BSOD before desktop) was 1.2125v - so I set it two numbers higher like you suggested, which was 1.2375v - and it boots fine. My voltages now look like this: http://i50.tinypic.com/2n0myxl.jpg - A tiny bit higher on some voltages than before, the same on others. I also tried running it at 1.2250v and it booted, that was the lowest it would go. Would it be worth doing that or sticking with what i'm on now like you suggested?

One question though, the only options I have in my Northbridge screen are changing RAM timings etc if I disable 'Calculate by SPD' (or something like that) So I assume you mean the 'Memory Voltage' option in 'JumperFree Config'? At the moment this is set at AUTO - should I start at 2.0v (if this is the case) and work my way down or?

(Also, dunno if this is related, but after my latest boot I keep getting the USB device connected/disconnected noise for some weird reason, anything to do with it or just my PC being silly?)

(edit)
Ok after posting this I ran the WEI again out of curiosity and I got a BSOD. So I went back into the BIOS and it is now running at 1.25v - the only changes to HWMonitor are +1-2v on the VCore (it goes down to 1.19v and up to 1.22v)and +1v on VIN1.
I'll try running the WEI again now... Ok got to the CPU assesment, stopped working. Got the error 'Could not assess your computer' (or similar) - Is this something to worry about? On a plus note the USB noise has stopped.
(/edit)

 

[stew2]

If i was you id go into the bios and set the cpu multilier to 6 and then run the WEI score. If it works then go back into the bios and set it to 7 and and so on.

You can just leave the memory voltage at auto for just now . Concentrate on getting the cpu stable and then you can lower voltages for the ram.

But you should really read your way through some of the guides iv posted so you know what each setting does and what the benefits of lowering or raising each one does. Remember the goal is to create a stable pc, not a pc that's good for benchmarking and then crashes lol.