Windows 7 PC Sales Ended on Friday 31 October 2014

[jimbo45]

Hi there



You can try out the latest build as a VM without losing any of your W7 stuff. A really new build(9865) is due imminently --this is the THIRD version (Second update) since the original build came out.

You can use W10 just like W7 if you are primarily a desktop user.


jimbo

When will 9865 be out? I have to disable grub to install it. I am using 9860. 9861 was the first build that I used.

You can use W10 just like W7 if you are primarily a desktop user.

Not quite. Application background color issues. I can't seem to get a gray theme like I have in windows 7 but I got close to it. Shut down is in the wrong place.

Hi there

Just keepchecking in the "Check for new builds" in the control panel pc settings.

Remember that these are TEST / PREVIEW builds so there will be features missing / changed before final release. Still if you want to do some FREE testing on a VM why not try it --it does address MOST of the concerns that traditional desktop (i.e keyboard and mouse) users have. Remember though that in the current builds so far the emphasis is on traditional keyboard / mouse usage so Touch isn't very well implemented - so you will probably be disappointed if you want to try it out on a touch enabled device.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[Barman58]

I think that all of us who remember the Windows 7 Beta, and Pre beta program, have probably gone a little soft Beta software has to be expected to have issues, that's the whole purpose of a Beta test

Not all beta software will be ready for prime time, as W7 was

 

[jimbo45]

HI there

For what it actually does W10 Tech preview has very little serious issues (other than the touch facilities) -- quite a few are really using it as their main OS -- wouldn't recommend that approach yet with a PREVIEW - however it does seem to be remarkably stable. I've run it as a VM and on a real machine with no issues (other than mentioned).

Cheers
jimbo

 

[Barman58]

I cringe sometimes when I see people using Beta Copies of Security / Anti-Malware packages - That's what VMs were invented for

But from what I've seen of Ten it does seem pretty stable, and polished for what it is

 

[Night Hawk]

I think that all of us who remember the Windows 7 Beta, and Pre beta program, have probably gone a little soft Beta software has to be expected to have issues, that's the whole purpose of a Beta test

Not all beta software will be ready for prime time, as W7 was

I remember when we were saying 7 was ready to run right out of the box by the time the RC builds were available in May '09! There were a few initial problems encountered mostly with some of the programs like video capturing corrected once we were past the first public beta stage and into the RCs. The RC ran like the finished pre SP1 7 back then.

With the first 8 builds the preview there however was buggy due to the new secure boot where adding 8 into 7's BCD seemed to work out but not the reverse where 7 was added in causing both to stall. Had to isolate both drives at the time to clean up the disk errors.

Fortunately I was able to get people here out of XP a bit before the deadline came up. The second OS drive on my main case will be seeing the 10 preview there shortly where I will be taking notes to see if the next all platform version is upto par. From what I heard so it walks right past 8 and 8.1.

 

[Fantail]

Doing some testing at work for the 2014 (tax year) releases mostly using VM boxes so I agree with barman58. Speaking of, unofficially testing our jazz with 10 in a box on the laptop even though its not covered in the sprint, seems ok.
Then something odd happened, I got a tech call from someone actually using 8.1

 

[Night Hawk]

Here I built the present desktop case with dual OSing in mind and have both options for VMs or a second HD to try out any OS on keeping the boot loaders, etc separately. VMs are great for the fast looks but for trying out a variety of programs some not being able to run on a VM you end up slapping something new on a spare drive. Plus you get a first hand look at the recovery options when hitting the F8 button. But when only having one drive running a laptop you can at least get the close look with a VM.

What will be sad now will be no longer seeing 7 preinstalled on the newer laptops coming out since the OEMs as well as retailers will be discounting their current inventories especially for Black Friday in order to clear them out. But it comes as no surprise when looking back at seeing the 9x desktops going quickly for ME and then XP that was rushed out and then the long gap before Vista since you only had about 3-5yrs. at the most to buy new with each version except for XP having a longer shelf life.

 

[sixwheeler2011]

Their are many that like W-8. Their just isn't enough of them to suite Microsoft's needs for sales.

Microsoft's yard stick to measure success is sales.
Just like every other company.

Hello,

Since the Blast of 8.0 UI with new and pre-existing windows 8 users and purchasers. Myself included
I do quite a bit of work on My Now win 8.1(current 11/27/14) And do not mind the functionality, as I have had
an HP Compaq with start win vista 64bit/to win RT 8 Enterprise for 90 days, win 7 professional, and currently win 7 Home Basic. Using the bi pass of the Boot to Metro, to boot to desktop, just currently adding the Start menu via shell extension. I have no issues with windows 8.1.

 

[Night Hawk]

Well you will be finding yourself even more happy once you get into the next W10 to come since the preview and almost time for second build surpasses 8 or 8.1 where MS finally is realizing their goal of a one for all version of Windows to be. All platforms that is not RT and then Windows with RT gui thrust at you.

What will still hurt however is no longer seeing anything newer with 7 as the option except for Dell and their choice of OS offer that was originally seen when Vista first arrived. Some(blog writers mainly) seem to suggest that 10 could be the last paid for version since all updates to follow would be added on free of charge with a one time life time license. The versions to follow would still be sold retail if just upgrading as each of those came out but not for what came later.

 

[groze]

Well you will be finding yourself even more happy once you get into the next W10 to come since the preview and almost time for second build surpasses 8 or 8.1 where MS finally is realizing their goal of a one for all version of Windows to be. All platforms that is not RT and then Windows with RT gui thrust at you.

What will still hurt however is no longer seeing anything newer with 7 as the option except for Dell and their choice of OS offer that was originally seen when Vista first arrived. Some(blog writers mainly) seem to suggest that 10 could be the last paid for version since all updates to follow would be added on free of charge with a one time life time license. The versions to follow would still be sold retail if just upgrading as each of those came out but not for what came later.

Night Hawk
For clarification
Does dell sell older systems with Vista or xp sp3? Most Dells I have seen online have windows 7 or above including the refurbished ones.

 

[Night Hawk]

For a time Dell offered the choice of OS following Vista's rejection by many. The offer was for brand new models just coming up at the time as well as for the newer machines to come later with 7 preinstalled unless you ordered from them direct where you could specify what OS you wanted. This also included Linux as well as Windows.

With XP no longer supported by anyone you would have to run a search for a used pc on EBay most likely to still find anything in good shape still running that older version. Once you go too new there's no support for XP while some newer models still support Vista. Refurbished systems are those typically returned by either those who want out of the latest of ran into some type of hardware issue when buying new only to return it where Dell then has to go through it for resale.

The choice of OS offer however was mainly for brand new first owner pcs when ordered direct through them not returns as far as I know. You would need to contact them directly to see what options are seen for any refurbished systems since the brand new factory warranty would be changed to a limited version with a time limit for return or exchange.

The 2012 Computer World article seen at Dell will still offer Windows 7 after Windows 8 launch | Computerworld discusses the customer options for 7 instead of 8 due to the gap of years between the Vista launch and 8's debut. Some chatter from a 2013 discussion I ran across was a complaint that customers are being forced to choose a Windows version not another OS suggesting stopped offering the previous choice of OS offer once 8 was out.

 

[townsbg]

Since XP is no longer supported no manufacturer will offer it and probably won't even make compatible drivers.

 

[Night Hawk]

None of the latest boards even have drivers for it since there now have been four newer versions of Windows released with a fifth soon to come since XP's extended Hay day. While I still plan to keep 7 going as long as possible we all have to admit sooner or later we will be forced into something newer.

It's just sad seeing 7 no longer being sold however since most have now moved on to at least Vista or 7 while hopefully 10 actually realizes what was left behind with 8 as far as the progress 7 made! With the upcoming the idea of cross platform without abandoning the desktop platform may have been reached for the "all platform" consolidation there. I certainly wasn't ready to give up on 7 for a 7" tablet OS a few years ago!

 

[Arelem]

Refurbished systems are those typically returned by either those who want out of the latest of ran into some type of hardware issue when buying new only to return it where Dell then has to go through it for resale.

Refurbished is also, especially in Dell's case, frequently off-lease business machines and servers. These are usually pretty good machines, at most 2 or 3 years old, and nothing really wrong with them. The user just got newer ones when their lease ended or was renewed.

 

[groze]

None of the latest boards even have drivers for it since there now have been four newer versions of Windows released with a fifth soon to come since XP's extended Hay day. While I still plan to keep 7 going as long as possible we all have to admit sooner or later we will be forced into something newer.

It's just sad seeing 7 no longer being sold however since most have now moved on to at least Vista or 7 while hopefully 10 actually realizes what was left behind with 8 as far as the progress 7 made! With the upcoming the idea of cross platform without abandoning the desktop platform may have been reached for the "all platform" consolidation there. I certainly wasn't ready to give up on 7 for a 7" tablet OS a few years ago!

Night Hawk,
You won't be forced into anything. I do see the Linux market increasing though because ubuntu and its derivatives are easy to install and work on almost any hardware. I find sudo and apt-get the easiest to use. The only issue is the dvd player. You can also buy legal one for the computer or for your tv. There is also a small chance the Internet could change for the worse. I thought I would use Internet more with high speed, I did at first but I slowed way down. In fact, I am considering dropping internet in March 2015.

 

[lehnerus2000]

GUI Tools

You won't be forced into anything. I do see the Linux market increasing though because ubuntu and its derivatives are easy to install and work on almost any hardware.

The trouble is nobody bothers to fix the GUI tools.

The majority that I've tried are substandard (i.e. worse than Windows equivalents).
The exceptions are the programs that are available for Windows and Linux Distros (e.g. FF, GIMP or VLC).

The standout exception is Firefox, which actually runs a much better on Linux Distros.

I find sudo and apt-get the easiest to use.

It's unbelievable how often I have to type "sudo blah" into the Terminal.

I never use "apt-get", unless I can "Copy & Paste" the appropriate command from an Internet forum.

IMO, trying to find and then type in a package name and version is horrible (even with wildcards).

 

[Night Hawk]

You won't be forced into anything. I do see the Linux market increasing though because ubuntu and its derivatives are easy to install and work on almost any hardware.

The trouble is nobody bothers to fix the GUI tools.

The majority that I've tried are substandard (i.e. worse than Windows equivalents).
The exceptions are the programs that are available for Windows and Linux Distros (e.g. FF, GIMP or VLC).

The standout exception is Firefox, which actually runs a much better on Linux Distros.

I find sudo and apt-get the easiest to use.

It's unbelievable how often I have to type "sudo blah" into the Terminal.

I never use "apt-get", unless I can "Copy & Paste" the appropriate command from an Internet forum.

IMO, trying to find and then type in a package name and version is horrible (even with wildcards).

Well that's what you get from the open source community is a lack of mandatory updates. I try to stay with the 64bit flavors mainly for live recovery sticks these days over fussing with trying to get the 64bit flavor off FF to go on separately(now the latest WaterFox 33 also running well on 7).

I still have the option to run any OS on the second OS drive until W10 goes on being a little behind on that lately for a good lookover. Ubuntu and a few other small distros can be custom installed onto usb flash drives where you don't plan on those for every day use but for live recovery when not planning a second OS and then running into a variety of not able to do situations like video capture, finding the correct media player, etc. Plus unlike people here who may try out the flavors of the month most of the people I know wouldn't even touch a distro on machines they want me to debug at times.

While MS was busy looking at the immediate lack in desktop sales(mostly OEM desktops not custom builds still being put together!) and is busy working out the RT gui bugs with 10 and beyond I think the desktop will re-emerge again likely sooner once the smart phone fad wears off a bit. With the mico atx boards becoming more power house over time smaller cases still seeing multiple HDs will be the thought as well as newer All in One OEM systems.

 

[groze]

Just for info, you get updates in Linux all the time or at least I do. You can also run the software updater at any time. I see nothing wrong with the Linux GUI, you have multiple choices of desktops. There are ways to limit sudo and root usage. No difference than UAC prompt in windows. You can also find one close to you desktop in windows. Mine is xfce 4. As I have said before I use Lubuntu 64 bit and installed xfce 4 plus I also installed wine 32 bit. Xubuntu which includes Xfce 4 didn't work to well because it missed some hardware dependences for my system. Xfce 4 is really close to windows 98se start menu.

 

[Night Hawk]

I wouldn't mind dropping 98SE back on an old tank case sitting unused anymore since it be used online just to run some of that old dos Legacy type stuff like the Duke emulator that crashes after you finish the first level in Windows being a flop for that old title. But as far as having the present desktop revert backwards to a Legacy look?

This is another reason I was glad in many ways I moved out of XP before 7 came along not for not having the Classic not Aero theme running on Vista but Linux as the main OS or Linux Legacy look? An updated 7 not Metro but updated 7 look would hold more interest at this late date aesthetically speaking. I've tried out numerous flavors of the month over the years with a number of desktops combos but only kept any particular distro as a second OS on for so long and cleaned it off. I wasn't interested in chasing each newer version every few months for various reasons while VMs would serve the purpose much better.

 

[lehnerus2000]

Just for info, you get updates in Linux all the time or at least I do. You can also run the software updater at any time. I see nothing wrong with the Linux GUI, you have multiple choices of desktops. There are ways to limit sudo and root usage. No difference than UAC prompt in windows.

UAC and "sudo" work in opposite directions.

Simplistically:

• In Windows 7, the initial user account has Admin powers, but they are blocked by UAC
• In Linux, the initial user account has no Admin powers, unless you add them by using "sudo"

UAC is actually more complicated than that (it uses two security tokens).
UAC Processes and Interactions


Regarding the GUI, I wasn't referring to the desktop, I meant the tools and programs (I phrased that poorly in my previous post).

The trouble is nobody bothers to fix the GUI tools.

The majority that I've tried are substandard (i.e. worse than Windows equivalents).
The exceptions are the programs that are available for Windows and Linux Distros (e.g. FF, GIMP or VLC).

The standout exception is Firefox, which actually runs a much better on Linux Distros.

Compare Caja/Nautilus to Windows Explorer.

Caja/Nautilus has features that Windows Explorer should have:

• Sidebar view options
• Tabs
• Optional twin file panes (also with tabs)

However, there are only a few file "Details" column options compared to Windows Explorer.
The tooltips are also lacking compared to Windows Explorer (note: XP had better tooltips than W7).

Windows Explorer also has better integration with installed programs.
I can rename/move/delete objects in the "Open" or "Save" dialogue windows, which is something I can't do in a lot of Linux programs.