Why is W7 Saying Not Enough Backup Space?

[RealGem]

Hi,

I have now tried two ways to do a Windows Backup. My desktop hard drive is only 250GB and I know I have 755GB fee on my 1TB external hard drive, because it told me (both in the System Image setup and on the drive properties; y'know with the pie diagram).

So I know I have over three times as much space as I need. But it won't let me do a Backup nor a System Image onto the external hard drive, and the reason given is "not enough free space"! :shock:

Anyone know why this might be?

Thanks a lot

 

[Orbital Shark]

Hi,

You may have to defragment the external HDD, if it's too fragmented it might not allow a backup the same as when shrinking a partition.

Also, what format is the HDD? NTSC or FAT32?

 

[Arc]

You may try it with another program like Macrium Reflect FREE Edition - Information and download or Free Backup Software: Paragon Backup & Recovery (Advanced) Free Edition - Overview .

 

[pparks1]

Check to be sure that your "system reserved" partition is not the one that is less then 50MB or whatever it is complaining about. I had that happen to me once. My C drive was fine, my external was fine, but the hidden System Reserved partition was causing the issue.

The strange part was why the system reserved was mostly full. A few reboots later and it had magically cleared up space on it's own and I was fine.

 

[RealGem]

Hi,

You may have to defragment the external HDD, if it's too fragmented it might not allow a backup the same as when shrinking a partition.

Also, what format is the HDD? NTSC or FAT32?

It is NTFS, but I just got a worrying error box; saying I will have to format the external HDD if I want to use it.

But it has everything from my old PC that I want to keep! (less than 200GB that's why I bought a 1TB ext hard drive). I'm assuming formatting will get rid of everything on it!

Yes, I will defrag it, but I will use my old PC, or the new one might format it.

You may try it with another program like Macrium Reflect FREE Edition - Information and download or Free Backup Software: Paragon Backup & Recovery (Advanced) Free Edition - Overview .

I always used Syncback on the old PC, and was currently thinking of the paid version Syncback SE. I will look at your recommendations too, thanks

Check to be sure that your "system reserved" partition is not the one that is less then 50MB or whatever it is complaining about. I had that happen to me once. My C drive was fine, my external was fine, but the hidden System Reserved partition was causing the issue.

Thanks, how do I find out whether it is System Reserved causing the problem?

 

[mjf]

What is the precise error message? If it has a reference to "shadow..." then

The system reserved partition needs shadow storage space. You can check this in Disk management (right click Computer>Manage>Disk Management) the system reserved (100MB) should be around 70% free. If you've got 50% free or more then this isn't your problem.

But you should also check the VSS space on the storage volume.
From an elevated command prompt
>vssadmin list shadowstorage

will show you the available shadow storage space on your backup volume.

 

[RealGem]

What is the precise error message? If it has a reference to "shadow..." then

The system reserved partition needs shadow storage space. You can check this in Disk management (right click Computer>Manage>Disk Management) the system reserved (100MB) should be around 70% free. If you've got 50% free or more then this isn't your problem.

But you should also check the VSS space on the storage volume.
From an elevated command prompt
>vssadmin list shadowstorage

will show you the available shadow storage space on your backup volume.

Thanks, this may be a dumb question, but are you referring to the external HDD being more than 50%? (The C drive is only 46% I think). Because I'm afraid to even connect the external HDD now because of the problem mentioned above:
...error box; saying I will have to format the external HDD if I want to use it.

But it has everything from my old PC that I want to keep! (less than 200GB that's why I bought a 1TB ext hard drive). I'm assuming formatting will get rid of everything on it!

When I attempted the System Image, I got something mentioning the "Shadow..." I'll dig out the error screen shot I took.

Sorry but the last sentence in the box above doesn't even make sense to me. I must be thick, but I don't get it. I'm a lesdyxic confused visual learner, so diagrams are better than words (and numbers) for me.

But like I said, none of that makes any difference if the £100 external HDD I bought is gonna be formatted and I lose the last backup from my old PC!

That is my more pressing concern now, as this is a problem no matter what tool I use for backup, so anyone have any suggestions, other than buy another ext. HDD?

Thanks a lot

 

[pparks1]

I'm about 99% sure it's the system reserved partition. The error message says for volumes under 500MB, you need at least 50MB free. Well, the System reserved partition is 100MB...and if you got less than 50MB of free space on it, you will get the error message that you see above.

Right click my computer, Manage, go to Disk Management. Right click on the System Reserved partition at the front. Choose change drive letter and path. Assign it a drive, like X. Then open My Computer and check the Free space. I'd bet a dollar to a donut that you have less than 50MB free.

Here is an article explaining this exact problem;
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...80780119/e3d30717-5e1a-47ad-a774-efe2afa59b7c

In my case, the partition just magically cleaned itself up within a few hours and I was able to run backups. What caused it to drop for a period of time under 50MB is still a mystery to me.

 

[Greg S]

I'm about 99% sure it's the system reserved partition. The error message says for volumes under 500MB, you need at least 50MB free. Well, the System reserved partition is 100MB...and if you got less than 50MB of free space on it, you will get the error message that you see above.

Right click my computer, Manage, go to Disk Management. Right click on the System Reserved partition at the front. Choose change drive letter and path. Assign it a drive, like X. Then open My Computer and check the Free space. I'd bet a dollar to a donut that you have less than 50MB free.

Here is an article explaining this exact problem;
Windows 7 Enterprise Backup Image Error 0x80780119 - Microsoft Answers

In my case, the partition just magically cleaned itself up within a few hours and I was able to run backups. What caused it to drop for a period of time under 50MB is still a mystery to me.

And if one doesn't have a System Reserved Partition and gets this error, what would it be then?

 

[pparks1]

And if one doesn't have a System Reserved Partition and gets this error, what would it be then?

Perhaps a hidden recovery partition created by the manufacturer that is nearly full that they are unaware of. Again, you can check it just like I showed with the "System Reserved" partition.

I ran into this same issue when I first started using Windows 7. That's why I am always piping up saying, "hey check your System Reserved partition". It bit me once and confused me for awhile...until I really read through that error. I was positive my C and D drive had at least 1GB free and so did my external drive. So, I started looking elsewhere.

 

[sygnus21]

Hi,

I have now tried two ways to do a Windows Backup. My desktop hard drive is only 250GB and I know I have 755GB fee on my 1TB external hard drive, because it told me (both in the System Image setup and on the drive properties; y'know with the pie diagram).

So I know I have over three times as much space as I need. But it won't let me do a Backup nor a System Image onto the external hard drive, and the reason given is "not enough free space"! :shock:

Anyone know why this might be?

Thanks a lot

When you do your backups through Windows Backup, check to see what drives it's including. My guess is that Windows Backup is including another drive when creating the image. This is where you could be running out of disk space.

I have an issue (Issue with Windows Backup creating System Image) where Windows Backup (WBU) has a bug? where it automatically includes my Games (G-Drive) when trying to create a system image. Even though the G-Drive has NO boot files or folders on the drive! None.

My Issue: I have a 120Gig SSD Drive that I wanted to image using Windows Backup (WBU); however WBU for some strange reason keeps including my Games drive (G-Drive), despite the fact that there are absolutely no boot files/utilities on G-Drive. In fact I can disconnect the G-Drive, image my SSD drive, and restore it without issue. Yet when I reconnect G-Drive and I try to image the SSD drive..... It still wants to include G-Drive.

Bottom line..... it seems, and has been said, that Windows Backup is buggy when creating an image. Now, it works for backing up files, folders, and drives, it’s just borked when doing some images.

Bottom line there is my issue was never resolved; I still can’t create an image in Windows Backup without it including my G-Drive. In the end I went with Acronis True Image 2010 for my disk image.

You may be suffering the same problem I had. Check to see if the image you want to create is including another drive.

Good luck.

 

[Greg S]

And if one doesn't have a System Reserved Partition and gets this error, what would it be then?

Perhaps a hidden recovery partition created by the manufacturer that is nearly full that they are unaware of. Again, you can check it just like I showed with the "System Reserved" partition.

I ran into this same issue when I first started using Windows 7. That's why I am always piping up saying, "hey check your System Reserved partition". It bit me once and confused me for awhile...until I really read through that error. I was positive my C and D drive had at least 1GB free and so did my external drive. So, I started looking elsewhere.

Here's what I have. Personally, I don't have clue at what any of it means so maybe you or someone can help.






Initially when Win 7 was installed, I had the Backup/Image problems. All of a sudden it quit and went to working fine. I have plenty of Images made with the built in System Image but decided to do one the other day. Now it's back to not working again like it was right after Win 7 installed

 

[RealGem]

I'm about 99% sure it's the system reserved partition. The error message says for volumes under 500MB, you need at least 50MB free. Well, the System reserved partition is 100MB...and if you got less than 50MB of free space on it, you will get the error message that you see above.

Right click my computer, Manage, go to Disk Management. Right click on the System Reserved partition at the front. Choose change drive letter and path. Assign it a drive, like X. Then open My Computer and check the Free space. I'd bet a dollar to a donut that you have less than 50MB free.

OK I did that and yes it's 48%.

It says "for volumes under 500MB"??
I want to backup my whole hard drive; about 150GB!

So in that case I'd need 320mb in the system partition, right?

Or does volume mean something else?

(not that I understand what a System Partition is. Searching online has been futile too, as I can't find an explanation in layman's terms what it is or how it works).

When you do your backups through Windows Backup, check to see what drives it's including. My guess is that Windows Backup is including another drive when creating the image. This is where you could be running out of disk space.

Yes, you could be right. I seem to remember two destinations on the list, and the other one could only have been the C drive (in which case, no it definitely would not fit on there, as it's about 2/3 full).

1. Anyone know how to stop it including the C drive (or any other drive)?

2. Can anyone help me with the fact it wants to format my external HDD, and I don't want to lose my old PC's last backup?

3. Why does it want to format it anyway? It's only for backups! I don't have an OS on there or anything.

thanks

 

[mjf]

I'm about 99% sure it's the system reserved partition. The error message says for volumes under 500MB, you need at least 50MB free. Well, the System reserved partition is 100MB...and if you got less than 50MB of free space on it, you will get the error message that you see above.

Right click my computer, Manage, go to Disk Management. Right click on the System Reserved partition at the front. Choose change drive letter and path. Assign it a drive, like X. Then open My Computer and check the Free space. I'd bet a dollar to a donut that you have less than 50MB free.

Here is an article explaining this exact problem;
Windows 7 Enterprise Backup Image Error 0x80780119 - Microsoft Answers

In my case, the partition just magically cleaned itself up within a few hours and I was able to run backups. What caused it to drop for a period of time under 50MB is still a mystery to me.

And if one doesn't have a System Reserved Partition and gets this error, what would it be then?

See Post #6

"The system reserved partition needs shadow storage space. You can check this in Disk management (right click Computer>Manage>Disk Management) the system reserved (100MB) should be around 70% free. If you've got 50% free or more then this isn't your problem.

But you should also check the VSS space on the storage volume.
From an elevated command prompt
>vssadmin list shadowstorage

will show you the available shadow storage space on your backup volume."

RealGem,
As I indicate above you need to look in Disk management for the small 100MB (sometimes 200MB) partition marked system reserved NOT your main partitions. It should not have a letter assigned to it and will not be visible in Windows explorer.
It's required free space for shadows copies is defined here
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd799232(WS.10).aspx

• Must have enough free space to create shadow copies of the partition.
  
  
  • If the partition is less than 500 MB, it must have at least 50 MB of free space.
    
    
  • If the partition is 500 MB or larger, it must have at least 320 MB of free space.
    
    
  • If the partition is larger than 1 gigabyte (GB), we recommend that it should have at least 1 GB free.
    
    
  
  Note We recommend that no other files are placed on the system volume, and we recommend that you discourage end-users from storing files on this partition, to avoid filling up this space.

IF it is a backup volume shadowspace problem, the offending volume should be list in the error message. Then look at what
>vssadmin list shadowstorage
says about that volume. You may need to increase the shadow storage space allocation on that volume.

Windows imaging will insist on imaging both the system reserved (containing the boot manager & BCD) AND your Windows OS partition. Any additional partitions are user selected.

 

[RealGem]

Thanks a lot MJF,

I have now sorted out the External Hard Drive problem (in another thread), so I am able to use SyncbackSE, which I am used to and find a lot more straightforward than Windows backup.

Thank you anyway though. I appreciate your help.

 

[sygnus21]

When you do your backups through Windows Backup, check to see what drives it's including. My guess is that Windows Backup is including another drive when creating the image. This is where you could be running out of disk space.

Yes, you could be right. I seem to remember two destinations on the list, and the other one could only have been the C drive (in which case, no it definitely would not fit on there, as it's about 2/3 full).

1. Anyone know how to stop it including the C drive (or any other drive)?

OK - Are you trying to image (make a copy) of your "C" drive? If so, this is what I'm talking about when I say Windows is "automatically" including drives when making an image. See below....



Notice how Windows Backup "automatically" (as in no choice, thus the grayed out check marks) included my games drive.

My issue with the above example is that there is NO reason whatsoever for my "Games" drive to be included in the image. There are NO boot files/folders on that drive. Yet I can not de-select that drive! Thus the bug!

My point is if you have limited space on the destination drive to place your "C" drive image, and Windows decides to include other drives, if the destination drive doesn't have enough space with the included in the image, you'll get a "not enough space" warning.

If you’re trying to create an image, you need to check to see if the Backup utility included any other drives "automatically"

Is that what you're experiencing???

 

[RealGem]

When you do your backups through Windows Backup, check to see what drives it's including. My guess is that Windows Backup is including another drive when creating the image. This is where you could be running out of disk space.

Yes, you could be right. I seem to remember two destinations on the list, and the other one could only have been the C drive (in which case, no it definitely would not fit on there, as it's about 2/3 full).

1. Anyone know how to stop it including the C drive (or any other drive)?

OK - Are you trying to image (make a copy) of your "C" drive? If so, this is what I'm talking about when I say Windows is "automatically" including drives when making an image. See below....

View attachment 141938

Notice how Windows Backup "automatically" (as in no choice, thus the grayed out check marks) included my games drive.

My issue with the above example is that there is NO reason whatsoever for my "Games" drive to be included in the image. There are NO boot files/folders on that drive. Yet I can not de-select that drive! Thus the bug!

My point is if you have limited space on the destination drive to place your "C" drive image, and Windows decides to include other drives, if the destination drive doesn't have enough space with the included in the image, you'll get a "not enough space" warning.

If you’re trying to create an image, you need to check to see if the Backup utility included any other drives "automatically"

Is that what you're experiencing???

Yes, I was experiencing that.

But as I say above, I am no longer relying on Windows for backups. But thanks for your reply.

I looked at your photo site btw. Great photos!

 

[sygnus21]

Thanks for clarifying. That's what I thought the issue was. And yeah, switching to another backup program for images is best, however for "normal" non-image backups Windows Backup works well.

And thanks for the props for the photos.

Peace

 

[sreedhav]

Dear RealJem,

This is a long shot, but has a bearing on your problem! Kindly read this article : Not enough space for successful backup(0x81000014). Iam posting an excerpt from the link which has the most relevence.

Quote"
My case is: my volume to be backed up is too full. When doing backup in Vista/Win7/Server 2008/R2, VSS backup is the way to go. While VSS will attempt to allocate free space in the drive being backup for creating shadow copy. This is the default VSS behavior but can be altered by vssadmin.exe utility. Please note elevated priviledge is required for running vssadmin.exe.


So, if the drive you are going to backup is too full, you might hit this problem. That means, even if you have free space in other drive, by default VSS don't know how to leverage them"UNquote.

The EXTN. HDDs come pre-formatted, especially the NTFS ones, it's the partitions you have to make! I have two EXTN.HDDs, one is a Seagate Free Agent Pro 750GB and the other is a Western Digital Portable "elements"1TB and both came formatted!
Regards,
Sreedhav


What were the two methods you tried to create a manual backup, as you mentioned in your first post

 

[pparks1]

OK I did that and yes it's 48%.

It's 48% full, 48% free, or it has 48MB free. If it's got less than 50MB free...that is your issue....as I have been saying all along.