Graphics Card/Onboard Graphics for Media Centre PC

[biggles1000]

yeah, good point about the Athlon. Don't touch it nowadays if you want to play decent games well

 

[essenbe]

I think the Athlon is on its way out. Look at the deals right now on all AMD chips. I think they are trying to clear them out for the new Bulldozer. For the first time since it's release you can find 1090T chips for under 200. But for performance, why buy it? The 2500K is 229 and some of the new MB are pretty reasonable.

 

[TheJay]

Argh! Right.. Just as I thought I was getting the hang of the required hardware, it all changes! That is so typical of PC hardware!

Let me get this straight, it is the AMD Athlon series which shouldn't be touched? Not AMD in general?

Could you please keep this thread updated as you get news with regards to these new pieces of hardware coming out?

Could you please compile a provisional list of the new hardware I need, kind of like the one I did?

 

[essenbe]

These are the requirements you gave us. In order to meet those requirements, you are talking about building a new computer. A 2nd generation core 15 or AMD equivelant. There is no AMD equivelant right now. You can play games on higher settings with some PhenomII chips, but for price vs. performance you can't beat the new intel chips. To give you an example, a Phenom ii x6 1090T is about $200 US. An i5-2500K is $229 US. I personally don't believe that a 1090T can match an i5 in anything except maybe heavy multithreaded applications, which games are not. Few games will use 4 cores. I had a 1055T rig before this one. It could not compare to my i5-2500K. That is my only point, for the price you pay and what you get for it. A good PHiix4 can play most games well with a good graphics card.

The choice is yours and you gave us the requirements you wanted. Do you want to do the best you can with what you have or do you want to meet the requirements and build a new computer. Assuming you use the hard drives in your computer and other things, you will need at least a new Motherboard, CPU, ram and cpu cooler. You tell us what you want to do.

 

[Fumz]

... Could you please keep this thread updated as you get news with regards to these new pieces of hardware coming out?

Could you please compile a provisional list of the new hardware I need, kind of like the one I did?

8 pages ago you asked for a "dirt cheap" graphics card. 8 pages of rejected graphics cards later you still don't know what you want, nor have you given anyone a budget to work with. Now you're asking to be kept apprised on hardware releases and asking for complete system mock-ups... Is your Google broken?

 

[TheJay]

I don't mind getting my hands dirty.

It has become apparent since using the media centre PC in the lounge that I much prefer to use that than the PC in the study. Since I bought a new Samsung 32" Full HD TV and hooked it up to the PC, I am going to need some better hardware caoable of displaying higher resolutions, particularly when playing games.

When I first put the PC in the lounge, I planned to use it purely to watch TV, record programmes etc. Now it has become much more central and I want to use it for everything, including gaming.

I have a dedicated Yamaha amplifier and speakers hooked up for the full experience, with all the kinds of connections you could require (including HDMI).

Granted, I am looking at getting a new motherboard, CPU, GPU and possibly PSU.

 

[Fumz]

A gaming card capable of delivering smooth play at 1920x1080 is going to be considerably louder than what you can get away with in an htpc: fanless. That's just something to consider since you have 2 rooms.

If you're going to use the Yamaha, then do it right and set up Bitstreaming. It's a bit complicated, more so if you want to Bitstream within Media Center, but it's well worth it. There's nothing like seeing your receiver light up with TrueHD or DTS-HD MA.

... but, really, until we get a budget, this is all a pipe dream.

 

[TheJay]

To be honest, I think the budget will depend on what I can swap/sell.

Currently, my other PC contains (copied from various invoices):

• £27.90 2x Akasa AK-FN057 Apache 12cm Fan

• £14.20 StarTech.com Black Value ATA133 Drive Drawer with Shock Absorbers

• £5.10 All in 1 Internal Card Reader Plus One USB2.0 Port Black - 3.5" Bay 108453

• £40.32 2 x LiteOn 20X SATA DVD±RW/RAM With Beige, Black & Silver Bezel + Nero - Retail 127442

• £80.90 Corsair 620W HX Modular PSU - ATX12V v2.2 APFC 114941

• £75.67 Creative X-Fi Xtreme Gamer Soundcard - Fatal1ty Professional Series 126185

• £83.27 ASUS P5K-E/WIFI-AP AiLifestyle Series P35 Socket 775 Socket eSATA 8 channel Audio ATX Motherboard 129126 (ALTHOUGH IT LOOKS AS THOUGH THE MOTHERBOARD INSTALLED IS £103.13 Asus P5Q Deluxe P45 Socket 775 8 Channel Audio ATX Motherboard 145748)

• £284.87 Intel Core 2 Quad Q6700 2.66GHz 1066MHz FSB Socket 775 8MB L2 Cache (2 x 4MB (4MB per core pair)) Retail Boxed Processor 130475 (with £36.95 Kühler CPU Zalman CNPS 9700 NT 754/775/939/940/AM2 acting as cooler)
  

• £301.91 BFG 8800GTX OC2 768MB GDDR3 Dual DVI HDTV Out HDCP enabled PCI-E Graphics Card 131671 (with £23.37 THERMALRIGHT HR-03 PLUS 90MM and £2.93 Xigmatek XSF-F9251 92mm Fan attached) - is very big and needs to be housed in a case like the £128.80 Thermaltake Kandalf VD4000BWS LCS No PSU - which I have since removed the front panel (doors) and liquid cooling system and replaced it with fans, as the idea was a liquid cooling system would be quieter, but uses fans too and there is the expense of the liquid)

• £59.28 Corsair Memory XMS2 4GB DDR2 PC2-6400 (800) Dual Channel Desktop

• £74.99 Acer V173Ab 17 inch LCD Monitor / Black (PC Shop)

• £319.99 Samsung S86 Series 22 inch LE22S86BD HD Ready Freeview Widescreen LCD TV (Electronics)

 

[TheJay]

Just for your reference, the case I am keeping for the Media Centre is Cooler Master Dominator 690 PC Case With Window / Black (PC Shop).

I appreciate I would have to purchase the items before I could consider selling old components, but is there anything worth transferring to the new media centre? Would the sound card be any good for bitstreaming (I did try to find out more but didn't have much luck - I was looking mainly on AVForums). DVD drives, HDD caddy and other peripherals will obviously be useful.

What are your thoughts?

 

[Fumz]

No, a sound card isn't going to help you Bitstream. Bitstreaming is passing all audio through the PC to the receiver. Basically, the receiver becomes the sound card.

Guide: Setting Up Bitstreaming With Your Windows 7 HTPC – PART I

You can't do it with a sound card, optical cables don't have enough bandwidth and even first generation hdmi cables aren't sufficient to handle master audio tracks. You'll need hdmi 2, aka hi-speed hdmi cables. In the docs it will specify that they're able to handle TrueHD and DTS-HD MA... as well as uncompressed PCM streams.

 

[TheJay]

That is sweet! Audio through GPU. My Yamaha DSP-AX863SE can output Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD.

Will this impact on my choice of GPU or is this something which should be available from the Motherboard (and would thus affect choice of motherboard)?

Doesn't look too difficult on the software front. There is a lot of detail about the software, but not much about hardware required from what I gathered.

 

[Fumz]

Up until recently you could only Bitstream with ATI/AMD. I don't know which nVidia cards are now able to pass through audio, but if you're in the market, this would be the place where you roll up your sleeves and get dirty.

I use an AMD to Bitstream.

HOW TO GET: Uncompressed PCM, Dolby TrueHD & Dts-HD MASTER Audio - Blu-ray Forum

High-Def FAQ: Blu-ray and HD DVD Audio Explained | High-Def Digest

 

[TheJay]

Ah, thank you! I will certainly look into that once the hardware has been decided.

Do you have any thoughts about some of my existing hardware, parricularly regarding how useful it would be in the Media Centre? I'm thinking a budger of around £300 at the moment. This really does depend on how well this will suit the needs addressed most recently in relation to sound quality and performance for gaming.

 

[Fumz]

Ah, thank you! I will certainly look into that once the hardware has been decided.

Do you have any thoughts about some of my existing hardware, parricularly regarding how useful it would be in the Media Centre? I'm thinking a budger of around £300 at the moment. This really does depend on how well this will suit the needs addressed most recently in relation to sound quality and performance for gaming.

Might it be a good idea pick hardware based on what you want it to do instead of picking hardware then seeing if it will work?

As for you old rig... what are you going to do with it?

 

[essenbe]

I don't know anything about the media center part, but for the specs you listed for gaming, I don't think you can match them for 300 pounds.

 

[TheJay]

Ah, thank you! I will certainly look into that once the hardware has been decided.

Do you have any thoughts about some of my existing hardware, parricularly regarding how useful it would be in the Media Centre? I'm thinking a budger of around £300 at the moment. This really does depend on how well this will suit the needs addressed most recently in relation to sound quality and performance for gaming.

Might it be a good idea pick hardware based on what you want it to do instead of picking hardware then seeing if it will work?

As for you old rig... what are you going to do with it?

Reuse parts which are useful, sell any other bits I can.

I did mean that I wanted hardware which would suit my uses (regarding media centre and gaming).

 

[Fumz]

I'd use the cpu, motherboard, psu, ram, hdd, and dvd for the media center, and add to it a cheap $50.00 fanless Radeon 6450, set up Bitstreaming and call it a day. As for gaming, you have another machine/room to do that... and there I'd build my gaming setup.

Gaming while sitting on the sofa sounds like a great idea... but on the PC that's going to be problematic. Wireless keyboards and mice suck when it comes to gaming. Lack of support outside your lap also cuts down on the precision.

 

[TheJay]

Hello there Fumz, I just wanted to take this opportunity to thank you for all your help and patience. I realise I have been vague at times and possibily boarderline ignorant other times.

Unfortunately, keeping the other PC in another room is not an option. The missus likes the idea having a free room to use for other things. I'm still serious about getting a gaming PC set up in the lounge, even if that means getting special support for the keyboard and mouse (I have quite a good set up already). Wired/wires is of no consequence, I have got plenty of wired peripherals, including a Razer DeathAdder mouse.

Do you have any suggestions for how much I could sell some of the components to buy new/like new parts for this new gaming rig which will allow me to play the game specified on full settings, on my 32" LCD TV?

 

[Fumz]

I have no clue what someone else would pay for your hardware; however, I can suggest that you not get your hopes up.

Forget about selling the fan... nobody wants a used dusty fan that will probably die soon when a new one is only a few dollars. ATA133 drive drawer... I'd donate it to the Smithsonian so they could set it up next the the Commodore 64 display. Same with the 2.0 card reader, the 17" monitor, and the DVD. You might be able to get some money for them from someone... but I couldn't begin to hazard a guess as to how much?

Components I'd keep would be the P35, the quad core, sound card, PSU and RAM.

You might have some luck with the 22" monitor... not sure about the 8800. If money were to be had for them, I'd have prolly sold the one sitting in my closet a while ago... but hey, spares are never a bad thing to have laying around.

 

[TheJay]

So it's fair to say it will be hit and miss selling any of the components. I will do some research to find out how much they might go for.

The components I have spare from the other PC wont be sufficient for my gaming requirements will they? So do I wait now until more is heard about this new hardware coming out soon?