Should I disable my Page File?

arkhi

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Hello everyone!

Currently I have 16 GB of memory. I've heard on some posts that I should disable my Page File for optimum performance. However, on some Microsoft articles, they stated that due to how Windows manages memory, it is advisable to just leave it there since Windows knows best when to use it.

So I decided to enable it and leave it at 600MB. Thing is, during heavy gaming, I see that my page file is 95% used even though I'm only using 8-9 GB of my RAM. So what gives?

Performance-wise, should I leave my page file as-is or disable it?

ALL opinions greatly appreciated!
 

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Some programs will insist on using the Page File, it wouldn't matter if you have 160GB of RAM.

I have 16GB myself and keep a 1GB Page File on the C Drive. I am also not a big gamer. From what you describe I would experiment with a 2GB Page File and see how full it gets while playing that same game. If it still maxes out I might try something even a little bigger. Whether I left it there or not would depend on how well the game ran and whether you saw any improvement. :)
 

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Leave it as system managed, plain and simple.
 

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I think 600MB would be a good minimum size with 3GB as max. (Next guy will have other ideas) Yes Win 7 needs a page file to work smoothly.
 

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Your specs indicate your operating system is 2000 not Windows 7 is that correct.
OS Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195
Installing Windows 7 is all the memory tweaks you will need.
 

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I have it set to 640MB fixed on my system SSD and an additional 8GB on a spinner. I understand you need to have some amount of pagefile in order to take a system dump. I believe it is a lot less than 640MB though. you have lots of memory, so you really prob don't need much pagefile.
 

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Your specs indicate your operating system is 2000 not Windows 7 is that correct.
OS Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195
Installing Windows 7 is all the memory tweaks you will need.
:tip:
 

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Depends on what you're running

It seems that not everyone understands what a paging file is and does.

The OS decides when and how much of an application's working set -- the memory it needs to run -- to keep in memory and how much to put out in a page (swap) file. When an app wants something that's not in memory, that's called a page fault, and the OS brings that chunk of memory back into RAM (probably swapping some other memory out).

If you want to see this in action, open up the task manager, select View|Select Columns, and check the boxes next to

  • Memory Usage
  • Memory Usage Delta
  • Peak Memory Usage
  • Page Faults
  • Page Faults Delta
  • Virtual Memory Size
Look at the Page Faults column (click the heading to sort descending); if your machine has been running for a while (I never turn mine off, and only reboot when absolutely necessary) you will be blown away by the number of page faults. At the moment, Explorer is up around 3.8 million page faults -- and it's not the biggest memory hog, either.

An interesting thing to do is sort by the PF Delta column and watch what happens; this is the change in the number of page faults between updates. It appears that my update rate is 1 second, and Firefox (in which I'm typing this) is running between 200 and 250 PF/sec, periodically jumping to 4-600, a couple of times to around 1700, and once as high as 5000; watch what happens when you have three windows open, two minimized, and you restore and re-minimize the two that are minimized -- on my system, the PF Delta jumps to 1000-1500 for that second.

What happens when you don't have enough swap? A phenomenon called thrashing, where one part of the app references a block of memory that's swapped out, which then references the first block, which then references the second block, which... It doesn't need to be this direct, but if the same blocks of memory are being cycled in and out over and over and over again, you can guess what happens to your performance.

Running on my XP box, with only 3.5GB of accessible RAM, I typically allocate 3-4x the swap as I have physical memory, and I still occasionally get a popup notification that my VMEM is running low. On my new Win7 box, I have 8GB of RAM, and I believe I gave it 32GB of swap -- on my SSD. I haven't had a chance to test it yet, but typically have at least 40 windows open at any given time. I do a lot of different things, each of which requires one to several applications, some of them major memory hogs (Photoshop and Lightroom, for two examples).

Lest anyone think to tell me to just run fewer apps -- that's both none of your business and totally beside the point. I've been working very successfully in the same manner for over 25 years, and am not inclined to fix something that's not broke when I can just add RAM, swap, and an SSD; and it has nothing to do with whether to use swap or whether to put it on a SSD. The only thing that matters is performance, and...

...according to MS (blogs.msdn.com/b/e7/archive/2009/05/05/support-and-q-a-for-solid-state-drives-and.aspx), swap files are one thing that you should keep on your SSD:
Should the pagefile be placed on SSDs?
Yes. Most pagefile operations are small random reads or larger sequential writes, both of which are types of operations that SSDs handle well.
In looking at telemetry data from thousands of traces and focusing on pagefile reads and writes, we find that

  • Pagefile.sys reads outnumber pagefile.sys writes by about 40 to 1,
  • Pagefile.sys read sizes are typically quite small, with 67% less than or equal to 4 KB, and 88% less than 16 KB.
  • Pagefile.sys writes are relatively large, with 62% greater than or equal to 128 KB and 45% being exactly 1 MB in size.
In fact, given typical pagefile reference patterns and the favorable performance characteristics SSDs have on those patterns, there are few files better than the pagefile to place on an SSD.
YMMV, but the first thing I put on my SSD was my swap. I still have Windows on my HDD -- I just didn't feel that it was worth the space to have Windows start up faster (particularly since in normal use I don't restart very often). I did, however, put some apps that are notably sluggish on startup on the SSD; they seem to start up much faster, but that could be because of the SSD, the 8GB of RAM, or the quad-core 3.33 GHz processor. :-)


The bottom line is that if you are a relatively light user, in terms of what you have running and what you do with it, you may not need swap, and it doesn't necessarily need to be on the SSD if you do. However, if you're running a lot of memory-hogging apps and editing 750K image files and don't have enough swap allocated -- be prepared to spend a lot of time waiting.
 
Last edited:

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Ditto Japastor. :party:
 

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I would certainly leave the PF as it is, and on the SSD unless sopace isd a major issue. in that case, leave at least 500MB on the SSd, and a System manged Elsewhere.
But still, better off leaving it one place.

You could lower its size. Say, 2-4GB, but I wouldn't disable it.
 

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japastor; in reading your post several time. A lot of information there. I think what your are suggesting is let Windows 7 handle the memory and if needed just add more ram. Is that correct?
 

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Follow-up in response to a couple of other posts

Layback Bear said:
japastor; in reading your post several time. A lot of information there. I think what your are suggesting is let Windows 7 handle the memory and if needed just add more ram. Is that correct?
Um, no, sort of the opposite. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

Most of the stuff I've read about not putting page files on SSD dates from the time when they were much more expensive and, people had the idea -- at the time not unreasonable --that they had to do everything to minimize the amount of space used by "unnecessary" things like page files.

SSD prices have come down significantly, so should be able to get a big enough one to hold ample page file(s) and any apps that are very slow to start up at a reasonable price. I just bought a Crucial 128 GB m4 2.5-Inch Solid State Drive SATA 6Gb/s CT128M4SSD2 from Amazon for $165.78 with free shipping. I've gotten 2TB HDDs for less, and RAM is cheap -- but
  1. performance for a HDD isn't in the same league as a SSD
  2. most people have an upper limit on RAM, be it 4, 8, 12, 16, 32GB, or more -- but typically 4-12
So at some point, you max out RAM -- but can always add swap (page file).

Truth in advertising disclosure: my system will support 32GB of RAM, so technically I could have upgraded from the 2x4 I have to 4x8 -- but that would actually have cost more, even with off-brand memory. And with the SSD, I have enough room for all of my hardcore graphics apps and enough swap to support 32GB of RAM when I decide it's necessary.

I don't let Windows manage my swap, because it never allocates as much as I want: I typically set the minimum at the amount of actual RAM I have, and the max at 3-4x that -- so for my current 8GB I believe I have max of 32GB of swap allocated.

Recall from my first post that I had 4GB of physical RAM and 16 of swap on my Win32 XP box, and was constantly getting "Virtual Memory is low" messages -- so it was using swap, and lots of it.

Again, if you're a light user, this is all irrelevant -- but if you push the limits of what your machine can handle, it makes a big difference.

Finally, I haven't tried this yet, but I believe that major memory hogs like Photoshop will let you allocate temp space for them in a location of your choosing; SSD may or may not be perfect for this (I don't know whether it uses memory in a SSD-friendly way), but it's got to work pretty well, and if my SSD wears out in a couple of years, I'll be happy to replace it -- by then, I can probably get 512GB for what I paid for 128 last month.

Again, if you edit image files that max out at 6-12MB, this is irrelevant. I often edit 48-bit, 3200 dpi scans, and some of them have hit over 800MB. No, I'm not making that up: the average size of the files in my Scans folder at this moment is 106.5MB, and the largest is just under 885MB. I can use all the help I can get when editing these puppies.

So -- in summary:
  1. page/swap files are -- according to MS, with what appears to be solid evidence -- the first things you should think of putting on your SSD
  2. more memory is great, but there are good reasons to specify a lot of swap (including limits on how much RAM you can cram into your system)
  3. I don't let Windows manage my VMEM (Virtual Memory)/swap/page files, because it's too conservative for me
YMMV, but that's how I do it.
 

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250 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
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Japastor I think another misconception about have the PF on the SSD is that it will write often and cause premature wear to the MLC nand cells. It should be noted the PF does little hard writng and is mostly reads which does not hard the SSD.
Plus I thing have the PF or part of it on a separate HDD defeats the purpose of have a SSD and will cut performance.
I may be completely wrong too.:)
 

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Hmmmmm. Well, for certain it can't read what hasn't been written so there's got to be some writing sometime. :geek:
 

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Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
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Intel DH67BL-B3
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Integrated Intel HD 2000
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Asus LCD VH222H, Haier HL24XSL2a
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Crucial SSD C300-128Gb,
Western Digital WD5002AALX - 500Gb,
Western Digital WD7501AALS - 750Gb
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Seasonic 650W 80+ Gold Modular
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Rosewill Defender
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Logitech EX100 Y-RBH94 Wireless
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Logitech EX100 M-RCE95 Wireless
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3.0/1.5 Mbs
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Microsoft Security Essentials
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Microsoft Internet Explorer 11
Other Info
Antec Veris Premier-Multimedia IR Station,
Cyber Accoustics-3602 Speakers,
AFT XM-5U Card Reader,
Hauppauge TV-HVR-2250,
Sony LX300 USB Turntable
If your page file is not used or is seldom used, it won't cut your performance and it will leave more space on your SSD so that it can better wear level and perform better, not because it will prematurely wear your SSD.

If you have enough memory for what you are doing you won't swap. Even Microsoft says a paging file may not be required:

How to determine the appropriate page file size for 64-bit versions of Windows
 

My Computer My Computer

Computer type
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Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
Home built (GeneO industries)/Model 4
OS
Windows 10 Pro. EFI boot partition, full EFI boot
CPU
i7 4770k 4.4GHz (44-44-43-43 turbo) @ 1.248V
Motherboard
ASUS Maximus VI Hero
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16GB (8GBx2) @2200 MHz G.skill Sniper 10-11-10-30-1, 1.6V
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MSI GTX 970 Gaming 4G
Sound Card
Onboard SupremeFX Audio
Monitor(s) Displays
NEC Spectraview 2490WUXi-SV
Screen Resolution
1920 x 1200
Hard Drives
Samsung 850 Pro 256GB (OS), Samsung 2x 128GB 840 Pro SSD in RAID0, 3x WD Blue 6Gb/s 1TB RAID0, WD 2TB Black external USB 3.0, 2TB WD20EARS Green external USB 3.0, 2x 500GB Seagate and 1 750 GB external USB, 1x 350GB external USB3
PSU
Seasonic X-850 (2012 KM3 model)
Case
Fractal Design Define R4
Cooling
NH-D14, NF-F12, NF-A15; NF-P14, NF-P12,NF-A14, S12A PWM
Keyboard
Cooler Master Storm Quickfire Rapid - Brown
Mouse
Logitech G602
Internet Speed
126.4 Mb/s down, 24.3 Mb/s up
Other Info
USB 3.0 x8 , SATA III x8, eSATA, USB 2.0 x6. Samsung DVD R/W drive.

WEI: CPU 7.8, Memory 7.9, Graphics 7.9, Disk 7.9
With 4g of ram (3g available), this has worked for me over the years, xp & w7: 200mb min (as recommended by w7), 2g max. It will stay at min until it may be needed (I've yet to spot it going over the min mark) and will revert back to min after eventual use. IMO, with a 200mb min, the toll on hd space (or wear) is totally negligible, and regarding performance no gain whatsoever in running without it.
 

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I set mine to 2GBs on all my SSDs and never had a problem. You also have the hiberfile of the size of RAM. That you can delete with the powercfg - h off command.
 

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Hmmmmm. Well, for certain it can't read what hasn't been written so there's got to be some writing sometime. :geek:
Good point. Where the wear comes in is when a write is attempted to the same nand cell. If any part of the cell is occupied the garbage collection function needs to clear it before any new data is written. So if the PF does mostly reads the wear doesn't come into play.
 

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Home Built Desktop By DataTech
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Windows 7 Ultimate X64 SP1
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ASUS P8Z68-V PRO/GEN3
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If your page file is not used or is seldom used, it won't cut your performance and it will leave more space on your SSD so that it can better wear level and perform better, not because it will prematurely wear your SSD.

If you have enough memory for what you are doing you won't swap. Even Microsoft says a paging file may not be required:

How to determine the appropriate page file size for 64-bit versions of Windows

Yes, but they also say "Yes. Most pagefile operations are small random reads or larger sequential writes, both of which are types of operations that SSDs handle well...In fact, given typical pagefile reference patterns and the favorable performance characteristics SSDs have on those patterns, there are few files better than the pagefile to place on an SSD."

Obviously, if you have enough RAM to support what you're doing without swapping, you don't need swap space. I have said this several times, but also pointed out that (a) some people don't have the option of adding RAM (for one reason or another) and (b) swap can never hurt, even if you don't think you need it. I also suggested monitoring your VMEM use to see whether you are, in fact, using it: Task Manager will show you as much as you need to know about VMEM use.
 

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Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
Dell Precision Workstation T1600 Mini-Tower
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Windows 7 Pro 64
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Intel Xeon Quad Core E3-1245 (3.30 GHz,8M L3, 2GT)
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8 GB DDR3 NON-ECC SDRAM at 1333MHz (2 DIMMs)
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1 GB NVIDIA Quadro 600,Dual Monitor,1DP & 1DVI
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Samsung XL24
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250 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
Crucial 128 GB m4 2.5-Inch Solid State Drive SATA 6Gb/s CT128M4SSD2
Hmmmmm. Well, for certain it can't read what hasn't been written so there's got to be some writing sometime. :geek:
Good point. Where the wear comes in is when a write is attempted to the same nand cell. If any part of the cell is occupied the garbage collection function needs to clear it before any new data is written. So if the PF does mostly reads the wear doesn't come into play.

See what MS has to say about read/write patterns and wear on SSDs.

This article provides copious detail to support its conclusions, but the punchline is "In fact, given typical pagefile reference patterns and the favorable performance characteristics SSDs have on those patterns, there are few files better than the pagefile to place on an SSD." [emphasis added]

The question for most of you is: "Why did you buy SSD in the first place?" There are only 2 main reasons I can think of:
  1. for shock resistance in portable devices
  2. to improve performance
For (2), unless you really, truly, are not using any swap, putting it on your SSD is a win for two reasons:
  1. it's faster, period
  2. you're not contending with normal disk I/O for paging operations, which speeds up all disk access (and coincidentally reduces wear on your HDD).
Good enough for me to put a SSD in my desktop machine.

As far as premature wear is concerned, everything I've read is talking about possibly reducing the life of the SSD to a couple of years. At that point, you'll be able to replace it for 1/4 what you paid yesterday. I'm OK with that if it gives me blazing speed in the next 2 years.
 

My Computer My Computer

Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
Dell Precision Workstation T1600 Mini-Tower
OS
Windows 7 Pro 64
CPU
Intel Xeon Quad Core E3-1245 (3.30 GHz,8M L3, 2GT)
Memory
8 GB DDR3 NON-ECC SDRAM at 1333MHz (2 DIMMs)
Graphics Card(s)
1 GB NVIDIA Quadro 600,Dual Monitor,1DP & 1DVI
Monitor(s) Displays
Samsung XL24
Screen Resolution
1920x1200
Hard Drives
250 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
Crucial 128 GB m4 2.5-Inch Solid State Drive SATA 6Gb/s CT128M4SSD2
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