Windows 7's Unexpected 'Killer' Feature

[Kari]

Squonk, I mostly agree with you though I have some reservations. I read the post in question a couple of times and tried to answer in about the same style. He told about his wife's opinion and about his kids, I told my wife's opinion.

Every single computer user has right to his / her opinion. My point was to compare this eternal (it seems so!) XP vs. Seven battle with new car vs. old car. I still think it is quite a good comparison though not as good as Dinesh' TV comparison.

I think this politeness is going a little bit too far; I have some difficulties to understand why it is allowed to use quite harsh language and pseudo-facts when critizising Seven but us pro-7 geeks should always remember to use polite and politically correct language when answering.

I'll try. Here's my post once again, this time politically correct:

I am sorry to say, Xzaviar, but in my humble opinion you are wrong. The overwhelming majority of members, both here on the Seven Forums and other forums are normal users. It is quite easy to see and understand by reading through these forums.

You are asking why should you migrate your household computers to Seven when XP is still working. I think it is like my friend Dinesh so nicely put it; why to buy a new big screen plasma TV when the old CRT 14" is still working.

As an example you told about your wife, how she does not want to have Seven on her computer. I am interested to know in what kind of information her opinion is based. Has she tried Seven?

In my opinion you should mention that your post, though written as an objective list of facts is mostly only your subjective opinion. In my line of work, consulting small and middle size companies in IT matters I see and hear a huge interest in Seven. I have been talking with a lot of people about the migration and at the moment it seems that about one third of our customers are going to migrate before the end of Q2/2010, about half before the end of next year.

You give us an example about a Windows "bug", your issue with hybrid sleep. I am sorry to tell you but that is a driver issue and has nothing to do with Windows. Using a car comparison, once more, it is like blaming Ford when your local repair shop has no spare parts to your car. I have now installed Seven on five computers at home and about the same amount at work. Not a single one has got any problems. When you prepare the installation and do it correctly, all modern computers can run Seven smoothly.

Yours, sincerely

Kari

 

[SquonkSC]

Hi Kari,

I will answer you in PM.

 

[Lee]

People have the right to disagree. If you come to a forum and post something that is akin to a Rant then you have to expect to be brought to task for your remarks. As a member of my college debating team it was made abundantly clear that you had better be prepared for what you would be facing from the other teams.

To criticize someone for answering another's rant is in reality against the rules. Do not post a rant or an opinion if you are not looking for a debate. To post something that is going to bring about a debate is to expect a come back. Beside a debate is a good thing. It helps bring out something to both sides; both sides can learn from a debate even one that gets heated.

I love a good debate, and this has been just that a good debate. So for "Pete Sake" allow the debate to go on; you who criticize may just learn something.

 

[Xzaviar]

The great debate.

It's my experiance that when a vehicle gets to be about four years old they develope little minor rattles and and the vehicle is just not like new. I like new stuff and trade each of my three vehicles every four years.
Every time I install XP, guess what? It's new, it's familliar, it's solid.
I was quite excited when I got 7 and still am. I really like the OS and the Hybrid sleep issue is not that big for me. I do think that it's occurance is to common and should have been better addressed.
I'm not giving a market analysis, I just predecting what I feel the success rate of 7 will be. I think it will take time before the average user feels the need to change.
People posting to this forum are not average computer users. Average computer users are on facebook and ebay while you are reading this. Average computer users have never even seen a forum like this. Most people don't want to spend $200.00 if they don't feel the money is going to enhance their quality of life. For these people XP/Win7 will make no difference.

Good night Keri

 

[Zidane24]

It's my experiance that when a vehicle gets to be about four years old they develope little minor rattles and and the vehicle is just not like new. I like new stuff and trade each of my three vehicles every four years.
Every time I install XP, guess what? It's new, it's familliar, it's solid.
I was quite excited when I got 7 and still am. I really like the OS and the Hybrid sleep issue is not that big for me. I do think that it's occurance is to common and should have been better addressed.
I'm not giving a market analysis, I just predecting what I feel the success rate of 7 will be. I think it will take time before the average user feels the need to change.
People posting to this forum are not average computer users. Average computer users are on facebook and ebay while you are reading this. Average computer users have never even seen a forum like this. Most people don't want to spend $200.00 if they don't feel the money is going to enhance their quality of life. For these people XP/Win7 will make no difference.

Good night Keri

On the contrary...the ratio of experienced users to inexperienced users (not taking regular posters in account here) is rather astounding...but that is a moot point. While I agree that some folks will be hard pressed to upgrade from XP considering money is involved...people also have to realize that as with most things change and innovation are the driving force of technology. While Win7 wasn't as innovative as XP or Vista for that matter...it takes the innovation in System Stability from XP and Security + Features from Vista and changes it into a system that not only aims to please and get the job done but also leads the way into a new era of computing

I know folks will intend to hang unto their XP for dear life. XP is outdated technology that was great for its time (up until Vista's lanuch, NOV 2006). While it remains stable and usable...I think it is time to let it go and embrace something different. If nothing ever changed...we would still be hitting rocks together with stone tools...or for a more modern example...we would still be feeding mammoth computers punch cards

 

[Xzaviar]

I agree

Thank you, that was great.
I agree whole heartedly that it is time to switch OS's for a veriaty of reasons.
I believe Windows 7 will pave the way and is an excellent OS.
I also believe that XP will not die a quick death and for the reasons I pointed out in my first post. More likely is that it will simply fade into obscurity as people buy new systems with 7 preloaded rather then upgrade.
It's time for me to switch and I have. As for my wife, it's her choice and if momma's happy everybody's happy.:devil:

 

[Zidane24]

Thank you, that was great.
I agree whole heartedly that it is time to switch OS's for a veriaty of reasons.
I believe Windows 7 will pave the way and is an excellent OS.
I also believe that XP will not die a quick death and for the reasons I pointed out in my first post. More likely is that it will simply fade into obscurity as people buy new systems with 7 preloaded rather then upgrade.
It's time for me to switch and I have. As for my wife, it's her choice and if momma's happy everybody's happy.:devil:

I hear that last statement...my ex-fiance brought hell ashore when I secretly upgraded her laptop to Vista although later she thanked me

 

[SquonkSC]

People have the right to disagree. If you come to a forum and post something that is akin to a Rant then you have to expect to be brought to task for your remarks. As a member of my college debating team it was made abundantly clear that you had better be prepared for what you would be facing from the other teams.

To criticize someone for answering another's rant is in reality against the rules. Do not post a rant or an opinion if you are not looking for a debate. To post something that is going to bring about a debate is to expect a come back. Beside a debate is a good thing. It helps bring out something to both sides; both sides can learn from a debate even one that gets heated.

I love a good debate, and this has been just that a good debate. So for "Pete Sake" allow the debate to go on; you who criticize may just learn something.

Hi Lee,

As I am not against any debate, I will underline the heart of my post, because from your comment I can see you clearly misunderstood the point.

I never stated we can't disagree, debate and argue.
On the contrary, that is exactly what we should do!
But arguing is done by posting arguments, and with a certain common decency and politeness.

When an OP bashes Win7, he or she bashes an OS, a thing, not a person.
He or she is not addressing any person here in particular, but vents his or her frustration, and yes it's often caused by his or her own ignorance.

But if we jump in and start bashing the OP, we are bashing a person.
We make it a personal thing.

There is a big difference!

We as core members, powerusers and especially gurus, have a responsibility to keep it civil.
We shouldn't degrade ourselves and this forum to the level of some user who only joins to vent his frustration.

If a post is totally out of line, we can report it to the mods.

In the case of Xzaviar, where this debate started, it was our members who overreacted a bit.
I read the guy's post multiple times, and other than the too large font type, and he him self saying it was a rant, I see nothing wrong with his post.
It was a well argumented post, regardless of whether we agree or not.

Zid called him a troll (for which he apologized, he's a great guy), and then a few of my other friends jumped on it.

I felt compelled to stick up for Xzaviar, and remind my friends to keep it a debate.
Win7 is not our baby, although we sometimes act as it is.

I hope this clears things up.

Greetings.

Michel

 

[Lee]

Debates sometimes go into directions that may not be expected. Sometimes you have to just set on the sideline and only observe. The players need to be allowed to go into the directions they are attempting; this allows both parties to get their points out in the open. Allowing the debaters to finish what they have to say is an important step in a debate. The idea behind the debate is to see if both parties can bring their points to the for front. A debate does not necessarily have to bring about a winner only that both were allowed to get their point across to those who were observing the debate.

Sometimes debates can get a little to heated, albeit it is not my place nor anyone else to step in (unless it becomes bloody). You have to allow the process to go forward. Also remember this is being done on a forum where the individuals involve are not going to come to blows. Even if they call each other names it is hurting only them especially in the eyes of their follow forum members.

 

[zezasu]

Wow, I was reading for a really long time. Very interesting and a few laughs. While the whole article was about windows "Killer" features. It was nice to see someone point out why they like Windows XP, simple because it works. I quit using xp as soon as vista came out, and while i hated for dear life vista, it still felt way better then xp. No errors, okay tons of errors came up, but because i was messing with it. With XP errors popped out for no reason, even in SP3.

I do however think, Windows 7 is going to start kicking in faster despite this economic downturn, a lot of friends and others alike have been asking me about Windows 7 and how is it. Even people with Mac OSX have been asking since their sick of not be able to do anything, since it doesn't give them as much control for things.( Go figure)

Aside from that windows 7 is much more friendlier for first time users and while it make take time for some since the task-bar. I actually carry a laptop and let them play with it since its loaded with windows 7 and people like it. I should be a traveling windows 7 salesman lol.

Seriously though, people are liking it and will just buy a new computer and it will come with it. The average user wont be bothered to to change back to xp, to much of a hassle, so they will get used to it. (kind of how the avg person doesnt care what the gov. does) Love it hate it, windows 7 is here to stay !

 

[Dinesh]

Wow, I was reading for a really long time. Very interesting and a few laughs. While the whole article was about windows "Killer" features. It was nice to see someone point out why they like Windows XP, simple because it works. I quit using xp as soon as vista came out, and while i hated for dear life vista, it still felt way better then xp. No errors, okay tons of errors came up, but because i was messing with it. With XP errors popped out for no reason, even in SP3.

I do however think, Windows 7 is going to start kicking in faster despite this economic downturn, a lot of friends and others alike have been asking me about Windows 7 and how is it. Even people with Mac OSX have been asking since their sick of not be able to do anything, since it doesn't give them as much control for things.( Go figure)

Aside from that windows 7 is much more friendlier for first time users and while it make take time for some since the task-bar. I actually carry a laptop and let them play with it since its loaded with windows 7 and people like it. I should be a traveling windows 7 salesman lol.

Seriously though, people are liking it and will just buy a new computer and it will come with it. The average user wont be bothered to to change back to xp, to much of a hassle, so they will get used to it. (kind of how the avg person doesnt care what the gov. does) Love it hate it, windows 7 is here to stay !

I too carry my 7 loaded laptop and ppl go amazed looking at the new thing.

 

[SquonkSC]

Debates sometimes go into directions that may not be expected. Sometimes you have to just set on the sideline and only observe. The players need to be allowed to go into the directions they are attempting; this allows both parties to get their points out in the open. Allowing the debaters to finish what they have to say is an important step in a debate. The idea behind the debate is to see if both parties can bring their points to the for front. A debate does not necessarily have to bring about a winner only that both were allowed to get their point across to those who were observing the debate.

So far we agree.

Sometimes debates can get a little to heated, albeit it is not my place nor anyone else to step in (unless it becomes bloody). You have to allow the process to go forward. Also remember this is being done on a forum where the individuals involve are not going to come to blows. Even if they call each other names it is hurting only them especially in the eyes of their follow forum members.

Name calling and personal attacks don't belong in any debate, although politicians almost make you believe it does.
The rules of this forum are pretty clear on that.

for the record:
I wasn't trying to stop the debate, I was trying to remind my friends to keep it civil.
It is my place to do so, as it is anyone else's place to jump in and remind me to keep it civil, if I go too far or tend to go to far.

Sometimes we have to bite our tongues, take a step back and rephrase what we want to say, while we would rather like to kick somebody's *ss.

It's the only way we can keep this the best forum on the net.

Greetings

 

[Kari]

Dear geeks and Gurus, please allow me to apologize causing (once again) some tumult because of my not intended sarcasm.

I'm considering some anger management therapy to be more polite Some of my recent posts have surprised even me; I am always telling to everybody that we all have the right to express our opinions but lately, it seems, I have had some problems with this continued XP vs. Seven battle. Personally I'm starting to be a little bit frustated and tired to hear, see and read a lot of pseudo-facts and subjective opinions presented as real facts.

The above mentioned is not meant to be an excuse; Squonk put it quite well when pointing out that offending someone only because of his / her personal opinion is not right. I am a Pro-7 geek and nerd, that should be clear to everyone. I think the time we had to wait an OS to replace XP was simply too long and now I'm feeling almost euphoric because the replacement is finally here and working so nice and effortless. But defending Seven and my opinions should not involve personal attacks, however strong I feel. I admit that.

That said, I have only one more thing on my mind: migrating to Seven is and should be everyones personal decision. I just hope the arguments used both pro and con would be based on facts, subjective opinions presented as they are and not trying to mask them as facts.

Kari

 

[Kari]

Good morning, Keri. Er, Kari.

Afternoon, if you allow me to refrase it. It's almost 2:30PM here.

But, Insektenmann, good morning to you.

Curry

 

[SquonkSC]

Good morning, Keri. Er, Kari.

Afternoon, if you allow me to refrase it. It's almost 2:30PM here.

But, Insektenmann, good n´morning to you.

Curry

:roflmao:

I love you Kari.

 

[Xzaviar]

Good by from the FNG!!!

This was my first time posting to a board like this. I was actually quite excited to be involved in a discussion and hoping to be a part of the community.
Thanks to those who have been kind and not disected everything I wrote, there have been many. It was just my opinion as what I feel an average user might be concidering when contemplating an upgrade to Win 7.
As far as the few that have taken anything I said as a deep personal insult. Well, you are way above average. So far above average that perhaps some professional OCD consultation may be in order.
I must say that I expected something much different. You have your group and needless to say I am outside the box.
Again thanks to those that have sought to credit me with some validity, those that think the "FNG" has no place here good by.
I'll find a less narrow minded group elswhere.
I will stick with Win 7 for myself, I really like it, as for the average home computer user, I really don't see a burning need for them to spend $200.00 to upgrade their $500.00 computer. It just doesn't make sence. Most home PC users surf the web, belong to social groups, shop, send and receive email. Your average user knows nothing of tweeking something. I have talked to many people that shelve software because they can't get it to run the way they want to. I repair computers on the side for little more than the hobby of it. None of them have attained the stature of "Senior Member" "Seven Guru"...
This is a bubble of the elite and sometimes fanatical supporters that seem to have a tenuious grip of what people outside the bubble want or need. Some of you display a distain for those that don't place the latest and greatest hardware and software and the full working knowledge of said items at the top of their personal goals.
I enjoy camping with my family. I have been a Cub Scout Pack leader for three years. I go to every one of my kids athletic events, even practices.
I had no idea the kind of personal abuse I'd suffer for writing my first post. I still stand by it and will not retract a word. It was completely without mallace and the diatribe that arose from it was illogical. (It's the bubble thing)
So good by for now. Maybe sometime in the future I throw some balance into a thread again to see you guys explode. In the end your self distruction made the harmfull words towards me an unintended pleasure.:devil:

 

[SquonkSC]

Hey Xzaviar,

Don't go now.

I think you didn't get that bad a treatment. (I've seen a lot worse, , just kidding)

Seriously though,
Remember, things in writing aren't always as clear as spoken word, and people can misinterpret it.
That combined with a slight overreacting, may have lead to you feeling less welcome.

But let me assure you when you get to know the guys, you'll find they are not as obnoxious as they seem at first. j/k

We do get a lot of folks in here who only join to dump their grief on us.
Rants, Insults, Trolls you name it.
When you had a cuople of those, and a bad day at work, one might sometimes misread a post and react a bit too harsh.

But at least two people apologized for their comments, so I think you should just accept that, and stick around to find out I am right.

This is a very nice forum, with very nice, only slightly geeky people with the best intentions.
And we all make mistakes sometimes.

Together we have helped thousands of people getting their system working again, and an extra brain is always welcome.

So what do you say? Give it another chance?

Edit: the comment by Antman was a joke. He is one of the most respected members,
and he has a cryptic sense of humor.
I assure you it was a joke.

Greetings

Michel

 

[Xzaviar]

Ok, you won me over


I think I'll sit on the sidelines and read the various threads for a while and get to know the landscape a little better before I jump in head first again.
Thanks

 

[Johnson]

Hello Xzaviar
　
Just joined to add to Squonk's points. You have to have somewhat of a thick skin when engaging total strangers in writing. As long as you don't reply in kind to ill humored people, a forum such as this pays dividends in knowlege, both from reading and also, more importantly, helping others.

I hope you stay and participate.

 

[Kari]

Hello Xzaviar
　
Just joined to add to Squonk's points. You have to have somewhat of a thick skin when engaging total strangers in writing. As long as you don't reply in kind to ill humored people, a forum such as this pays dividends in knowlege, both from reading and also, more importantly, helping others.

I hope you stay and participate.

+1

Kari