MS-6585 motherboard installation

[gregrocker]

I only mention that because I've not yet been able to install Win7 onto the HD in a dual core machine and return the HD to a single core, or vice versa, and get it to run straight away. But you can try it to be sure.

 

[nsutherland]

Greg,

As it says - it an add on for HDM Suite or Pro.

You have to own the products to get it.

They were giving away to anybody a variation of it in RC form, I think it is called Virtualization Manager 2009 RC - don't know if they still are.

It looks as though Virtualization Manager 2009 is now a commercial product, but available as a free add-on to Partition Manager 10 Personal which costs $40. I think I'll read the manual (available at Paragon Virtualization Manager 2009: Free Add-on for Partition Manager 10 Personal - Overview) to see if it's likely to help.

 

[nsutherland]

And finally ...

I've not been posting for a while, as I've been in regular correspondence with Microsoft's support staff about my installation problem. They too have concluded that there is a a hardware incompatibility that cannot be overcome. So that's it really. Serves me right for trying to instal 2009 software on a 2002 machine.

I did learn something about the Windows Upgrade Advisor. According to the support technician I spoke to, the WUG first identifies the hardware components, then checks the manufacturers' web sites for known incompatibilities. So, responsibility lies with the hardware manufacturer rather than with Microsoft. Surprise!! - but fair enough, when you think about it.

I'm going to write this one off to experience, and move on. But a big thanks to Gregrocker for trying to help!

 

[spapakons]

Hello, I am a computer technician and a customer gave me his computer to install Windows 7. It already had it installed, but due to some virus etc, I have to reinstall them. I could not boot from Windows 7 DVD, so I installed Windows XP and then copied all Windows 7 files to a folder and started installation from there. Common sense says I should not have any problem, since I don't boot from any DVD, but this sh*t motherboard has another opinion. I don't know what trick did my customer, but I guess the only option is to install Windows 7 to another PC and then put it back. As far as I have read in this thread, this has problems too, bacuase probably Windows 7 try to find drivers for this piece of sh*t and stucks. But I thought of another trick: Why not keep Windows XP, install it to another PC, upgrade to Vista, and finally upgrade to 7. This way all SiS drivers needed for MSI motherboard will be present, and hopefully, it will work when placed back at customer's PC. I'll let you know.

 

[gregrocker]

Unplug all other HD's and peripherals,

Boot into BIOS setup, reset to defaults, save changes. If an EFI BIOS, enable Legacy BIOS or Compatibility Support Module, set DVD drive first to boot, HD second. Then set SATA controller to AHCI. Save changes and Exit.

Then boot into installer DVD or flash stick burned or written using tool and latest ISO for your licensed OS version here. If the new DVD your burn from latest official ISO doesn't boot then try the flash stick method in the blue link.

At first installer screen Press Shift + F10 to open a Command Box, type:

DISKPART
LIST DISK
SELECT DISK 0 (after confirming Windows 7 target HD #)
CLEAN
CREATE PARTITION PRIMARY SIZE=102400 (for 100gb partition, adjust as desired)
FORMAT FS=NTFS LABEL="WINDOWS 7"
ACTIVE
EXIT
EXIT

Next click Install Now, then Custom install to Clean Install Windows 7 to the partition you created. If it fails then report back at which step and the verbatim error message.

In addition read over these steps to understand the tools and methods which work best to get and maintain a perfect Clean Reinstall - Factory OEM Windows 7. The steps are the same for retail.

After install you can adjust partition size or Create new partitions for data, etc. in Disk Mgmt.You are creating the partition here for the purpose of marking it Active which overcomes certain install failures.

If these steps fail then boot into a boot disk which will start itself like Partition Wizard
to wipe the HD, which will force the installer to autostart too.

 

[spapakons]

Hello!

Thank you for your answer. The motherboard is Intel socket 478 with SiS (Shit InSide) 648F chipset, in simple English the worst possible chipset for Celeron & Pentium 4 socket 478 CPUs (in my opinion from worst to best SiS->VIA->ATI->nVidia->Intel chipset). This means is has a legacy text mode BIOS (forget EFI) and has a limited hardware support. It cannot boot from UDF DVD-ROM as in Windows Vista, 7 & 8, only from ISO 9660 DVD-ROM as in XP, and of course it cannot boot from USB Flash drive. To circumvent this issue, I installed XP and copied all Windows 7 files in a folder. Then I tried both the root SETUP.EXE and that in the SOURCES folder. Neither managed to complete installation. Windows Setup is copying all necessary files, expanding them and then restarts to proceed. In all cases I see the splash screen after restart and then system halts due to some incompatibility. I guess at this point Windows Setup tries to find some drivers or do some other stuff and these are not supported by the chipset. I also tried to upgrade XP to Vista in another PC. I put the disk back only to freeze at the Microsoft splash screen. I even had a disk with preinstalled Windows 8 Consumer Preview (it doesn't require NX or PAE) but couldn't manage to load, it stuck at the splash screen.

So I can assure you, this motherboard is capable for up to Windows XP, nothing more. I would even install Windows 98 on it to play safe, but then I would lose a great deal of compatibility with software and hardware. Also Windows 98 cannot use more than 512MB they give BSOD or freeze if more is installed and not limited to 512MB using advanced options in MSCONFIG.

The best I can do is install Windows XP SP3, do all the updates, and use Windows Blinds or similar if I want any visual effects and pray that for at least another 5 years, new hardware will have Windows XP drivers.

CASE CLOSED (I hate to kill your hopes, but that's all folks!)

 

[gregrocker]

Well you'd have to be able to boot a disk to work through steps which are compiled to resolve the most prominent install failure issues. But if it's not Win7-capable hardware then you're just spinning your wheels, even if you'd apply it as an image from a boot CD like Paragon Adaptive Restore which will adjust it to run on any other hardware.

 

[spapakons]

As already said, to avoid the "cannot boot from DVD" issue, I copied all Windows 7 DVD-ROM files in a folder in the hard disk and started setup from there within Windows XP. It always stucks after restart and never completes installation. So there are several incompatibilities with this specific motherboard, not just that it cannot boot from UDF CD-ROM and DVD-ROM. Eventually I formatted the disk, reinstalled Windows XP and persuaded my customer to live with it. If only the chipest was a little better (eg VIA), there would be no problem installing Windows 7 with Intel Pentium 4 1.3GHz and 2048MB (1024MB + 2x 512MB) RAM. I have done it before many times. But as I said in my previous post, SiS = Shit InSide, that explains a lot.

 

[gregrocker]

If you run Windows 7 Upgrade Advisor in XP it should pinpoint the exact weakness or incompatiblity.

 

[spapakons]

Well, Windows 7 Setup upgrade installation checks for compatibility issues before installing. It only had two warnings that the audio driver might not work in Windows 7 and another sofware might need an update. It didn't find any other compatibility, so it is not guarranteed that if a system passes the compatibility test, you can upgrade to Windows 7. Unfortunatelly there are exceptions and this motherboard is one of them. If unsure, the best is to boot from DVD-ROM (if possible) and see if you can reach the hard disk selection screen. If you do, then 99% it is possible to install Windows 7, so if you want a clean installation, just proceed, if you want an upgrade restart setup from previous Windows version. If you cannot boot from Windows 7 DVD-ROM (as in this motherboard) it is a valid sign that probably you cannot install Windows 7 on this machine, but you could try.

 

[spapakons]

As I already said, I am a computer technician. That makes me an expert user. Yes, I pressed ENTER when seeing the "Press any key to boot from CD" message and I even pressed F11 (Boot selection) and selected to boot from the DVD-ROM drive. And all I got was the error message that it cannot boot from CD because this shit BIOS cannot boot from UDF media, only good old ISO 9660 ones. I even started setup from a folder within Windows XP to avoid booting from CD issues, and it didn't work. Please read carefully what we post before you reply. Thank you.

PS: Just to make sure the DVD was readable, I made a fresh copy and even used an external USB DVD-ROM to boot from, just in case the PC's internal ATAPI DVD-ROM was faulty. So it's neither the disc nor the drive. The BIOS just doesn't support booting from UDF media, period.

 

[M J]

As I already said, I am a computer technician. That makes me an expert user. Yes, I pressed ENTER when seeing the "Press any key to boot from CD" message and I even pressed F11 (Boot selection) and selected to boot from the DVD-ROM drive. And all I got was the error message that it cannot boot from CD because this shit BIOS cannot boot from UDF media, only good old ISO 9660 ones. I even started setup from a folder within Windows XP to avoid booting from CD issues, and it didn't work. Please read carefully what we post before you reply. Thank you.

PS: Just to make sure the DVD was readable, I made a fresh copy and even used an external USB DVD-ROM to boot from, just in case the PC's internal ATAPI DVD-ROM was faulty. So it's neither the disc nor the drive. The BIOS just doesn't support booting from UDF media, period.

*bump* Yeah, sorry, but whatever.

I've got this uber-elderly board (now 12 years old) to install Windows 7.

What you need to do, is to not only download all the files off the disk to the root directory of the C:\drive, but it may help to make a 5GB partition (if you're starting from fresh) to do this. You can also do this on your XP partition if that happens to be on the first partition, and you'd like to keep the OS (a good idea, since some apps won't work on 7 the way they do on XP).

What everybody is missing, is the updated boot-code that Bootmgr needs! This resolves the problem of trying setup from the XP GUI.

Once the Files off the disk are sent to the drive in question, you now need an elevated command prompt.

Right click CMD (Either in Accessories --> Command Prompt, or Windows --> System32 folder

Select Run As (administrator) and input the credentials (password).

Then, in the black box, type the following, where c: represents the drive you just copied the media to:

1. C:
2. cd\
3. cd boot
4. bootsect.exe /nt60 c: /force /mbr

Now, depending on whether or not you're already running your OS on C: you mightn't be allowed to do this last part. If not, then you should try the Recovery console if you're on XP, or you could use the DVD if you have one (Or the Repair disc - that's at least giving you the command prompt - select Repair as an option, then use the tools, and NOT restore an image). Then you can do the above command without the problem of having to force the drive to dismount while your current OS is running.

Failing that? You'll need to use Grub to boot the bootmgr file

That's always fun!

If you have Grub bootloader installed, then good. If you don't, then do it before you try any of this. You'll be grateful...

In Grub bootloader, press 'c' to get a commandline.

Then, do this:

1. root (hd0,0)

This denotes the first partition on the first drive, which is where we put our files... right? If it's the first drive, but second partition, then use (hd0,1). Second disk, first partition? (hd1,0) etc...

2. chainloader (hd0,0)/bootmgr

You only need to include (hd0,0) on this command if you have more than one Bootmgr file resident on your system, but as long as you used the first command, you're already pointing at it anyway, and probably don't need to use it. Still, for something this important, there's no harm in it.

3. boot

And there you have it... You've gone to the right drive with the setup files! Once you're in there though, you'll need to use the command prompt to make the transition official, because up until this point, Grub was the only chance of booting it cleanly.

Thanks for letting me bore you to tears. My MSI-6585, despite what everybody else here, and at Microstar are saying, is quite adequate for running Windows 7. Sure, I can't use Aero, even though my card isn't terrible (ATI Radeon 9550 AGP). I also find that it's running fine off 2GB of RAM. I wouldn't recommend anybody running less than 1GB, as it's using up at least 500MB CONSTANTLY. That is with Anti-virus, mind.

In the end, this board mightn't be recommended by many today, but I'm not so mean as to suggest it's rubbish. It was the best value for money mobo in the world in it's day. Yes that's a long time ago, but what do they say about form and class? Be not surprised then, that this board can run Windows 7.

 

[spapakons]

Hello!

I found the solution while trying to install Windows 8 to a Pentum 4 PC that didn't meet the PAE/NX requirements. I followed a guide describing how to extract the Windows 8 setup files from the image install.wim to the hard disk, patch some system files and then reboot to continue installation. This partly installs Windows to the hard disk and doesn't require to boot from Windows 8 setup DVD. I tried the same method to partially install Windows 7 in an old computer that could not boot from the Windows 7 setup DVD and it worked! I was able to reboot, resume installation and install Windows 7 32-bit in such an old computer! I successfully repeated the process and installed Windows 7 at two other old computers!

Here are all the steps:
1) Copy the image file install.wim from folder SOURCES of Windows 7 DVD in a flash drive. Also download and copy the utility imagex.exe (32-bit version at both cases of course).
2) If the computer has two or more disks, disconnect everything and let only the one to install Windows. This is because the disk will be wiped, to avoid deleting the wrong disk. Leave only the hard disk, the CD/DVD-ROM drive and the flash drive connected.
3) Boot with a Windows XP CD-ROM and press R when you see the relevant message to "repair" windows. This will give you a command prompt.
4) At the command prompt type the following commands:

diskpart
select disk 0
clean
create partition primary
format fs=ntfs quick
active
assign letter=W
exit
C:\imagex.exe /apply C:\install.wim 5 W:\
bcdboot W:\Windows /s W:
bootsect /nt60 W: /force /mbr
wpeutil reboot

This code wipes the hard disk, creates a new NTFS partition that takes all available space, makes it bootable and assigns letter W. Then we run the utlity imagex.exe to extract the image file install.wim from the flash drive to the hard disk and make the hard disk bootable with Windows Boot Loader. Since the flash drive is the only formatted non-CD drive, it should take letter C, otherwise correct as appropriate. Parameter 5 selects Windows 7 Ultimate, for lower versions, decrease as appropriate (1 is Windows 7 Starter etc). Assuming we did it correctly and we didn't accidentally formated the flash drive instead, last command reboots the computer. You may now remove the Window XP CD-ROM and let computer boot from the hard disk. You should see Windows 7 Setup program and installation should continue as normal. All the Windows files are on the disk, so the Windows 7 DVD is no longer necessary.

Congratulations!

PS: In case you were wondering, to install Windows 8 on the same machine, do these steps, but you must also patch some files before rebooting. You have to repeat the patch again everytime you run Windows Update and these files are replaced.

 

[gregrocker]

I've never not been able to install Win7 to older hardware that meets minimum specs possible. The steps for http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/324687-windows-7-installation-failure-overcome.html resolve 90% of failures.

I would not want such a crippled install in any case.