The big bang theory

Time and space, collectively spacetime, started from big bang :D
 

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@seeker: might as well delete your posts re: heckling. As you pointed out... there is no point. I'll delete this post after a bit so it doesn't confuse people. Besides, the answer has been know for quite some time.

The answer has been known for quite some time. The universe is made up of three separate worlds: the Upper World, the Lower World, and This World.

This World, a round island resting on the surface of the waters, is suspended from the sky by four cords attached to the island at the four cardinal points of the compass. Each direction of This World is identified by its own color and hovers somewhere between the perfect order and predictability of the Upper World and the total disorder and instability of the Lower World.

  • East is the direction of the morning sun. East is represented by the color red.
    Red is the color of sacred fire, of blood and therefore with life.
    Red is also the color of success.
  • North is the direction of cold. North is represented by the color blue.
    It represents trouble and defeat.
  • South is the direction of warmth. South is represented by the color white.
    White is peace and happiness.
  • West is the moon segment. West is represented by the color black.
    It provides no warmth and unlike the sun is not a giver of life.
    Black is the region of the souls of the dead and for death itself.
Mankind's goal is to find some halfway path or balance between the Upper World and the Lower World while living in This World.
 
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I think it's an interesting topic for "Chillout".
I've worked in science/engineering research all my life and this is my view for what it's worth.
Science as viewed by people occupied in other life endeavors is given an almost religious majesty. It's nothing more than observing physical events and developing mathematical models to explain them. The Big Bang is based on the mathematical concept of a singularity in space. What came before this? Quantum physics relies on mathematics to predict subatomic behavior. The deeper we delve into the atomic structure the more particles we invent.

I think this metaphysical stuff is fascinating but I doubt that the human species will ever know the real picture. I'm not particularly religious but I think the concept of a "God" fills that gap we will never know. Just be happy and keep developing those models.:party:

PS: By the way I love mathematics - the purest form of logic.
 

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@seeker: #22 is just as acceptable as any other "theory" It's the big bang and other astrophysics in simple terms.

This world - the now, we are observing on a planet island in the "waters" of the universe

suspended by four cords - string theory
each direction defined by color - the Doppler effect

Upper world - when the expansion of the universe slows and everything everywhere is "peaceful"
None of that creation of stars / destruction of galaxies stuff going on

Lower world - when contraction is increasing
Everything is getting crushed or smashed

Same thing - different words and understanding.

No big deal



@mjf: Science is observation, developing an explanation for that observation, and testing that hypothesis. If it can't be tested, well it's still just a guess. Perhaps a very good guess, but it's not science. Your statement "The deeper we delve into the atomic structure the more particles we invent" basically supports what I'm trying to say. The invention of something to explain that which we do not fully understand - That's religion.

-->edit: I'm not saying "if a test fails..." I'm saying "If if can't be tested.." I'm also not saying that we should stop guessing. - thought I'd try to clear that up before someone says "just because a test fails..."



I really enjoy these conversations - there is no right or wrong, but it does keep this old mind active. Anyway, keep the faith, I'll probably be kicked off the forum if I keep this up.

l8r
 
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It may be just as acceptable as any other theory, but that doesn't mean that I have to agree with it.
 

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@seeker: Fair enough, well put.

->edit: I went back and you did say "I agree with most of your..." I guess I have to read Dale Carnegie again.
 
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MJF - You can't predict subatomic behavior with Quantum physics. Quantum Mechanics was invented by physicists to offer an explanation for something we don't know. It's simply a theory put to model that can't even explain itself. It's even been used to explain how Santa Claus can be everywhere at once. :) It's just another tool like the invented place holder 0 (zero) until something better comes along. Time was invented by man to explain an event but means nothing beyond our planet. Scientist still use it to explain events that may not even be time relevant.

Science changes every year with new discoveries. It wasn't that long ago that scientists thought a person would suffocate if they attempted to travel faster than 60mph in an automobile. Or that a heavier than air, self-powered craft could "fly". Or more recently, that water couldn't possibly exist on Mars. ;)
 

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@Carwiz
Quantum Physics is rooted in the uncertainty principle.
Uncertainty principle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I doubt that humankind can fundamentally understand how things began or end.
Apart from maths how do we understand the singularity of the universe beginning or its end. We have limited ability to understand the world/universe we exist in.

Your comments actually support mine in some respect. These discussions are fascinating to me.
 

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I have recently ingested much information on the theories of the origin of the universe. The most widely accepted theory is that the universe began as an infinitely small point (smaller than an atom) which for some yet unknown reason began to expand at an ever increasing rate and continues to expand to this day. This theory goes on to state that our own galaxy is the result of an ancient giant star gone supernova releasing the material that makes up our planets, sun, us and everything else in this galaxy some 4.5 billion years ago. I just have to stand back and ask, do you think this is how it all began? All of the matter, antimatter, stars, planets and organisms came from one infinitely small particle in a brilliant flash of energy? Or do you think this is just a fantasy of todays “great minds” grasping at straws in any attempt to explain the unknown?

It is the opinion of many like minded people like myself that this theory is correct due to the fact that we (all sentient life and those are living in the spirit world) created this nothing into something for us to expand our knowledge of the physical world to understand it and also 'Live' it so as to experience new things. We are expanding our own skills in the spiritual world. If this world were to end then another will begin until life itself is snuffed out to the point of extinction. Basically, nothing too worry about except live your life to the full and love life as much as you can....Control negative thoughts and delete thoughts that make you unhappy. Simple isn't it! Now put it in to practice.
 

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Then again, we could just be making it up as we go along.

http://www.crystalinks.com/holographic.html said:
The Holographic Universe
Michael Talbot (1953-1992), was the author of several books on holograms and quantum mechanics, and their relationship to ancient mysticism and the theoretical models of reality. Talbot explored the works of physicist David Bohm and neurophysiologist Karl Pribram, who independently reached the conclusion that the universe operates on a holographic model. In Talbot's book, The Holographic Universe, Talbot also arrives at this conclusion and maintains that the holographic model might also explain numerous paranormal and unusual phenomena as well as offer a basis for mystical experiences.

In 1982, at the University of Paris a research team led by physicist Alain Aspect performed what may turn out to be one of the most important experiments of the 20th century. Aspect's experiment was related to the EPR Experiment, a consciousness experiment which had been devised by Albert Einstein, and his colleagues, Poldlsky and Rosen, in order to disprove Quantum Mechanics on the basis of the Pauli Exclusion Principle contradicting Special Relativity.

Aspect and his team discovered that under certain circumstances subatomic particles such as electrons are able to instantaneously communicate with each other regardless of the distance separating them. It doesn't matter whether they are 10 feet or 10 billion miles apart. Somehow each particle always seemed to know what the other was doing. This feat violates Einstein's long-held tenet that no communication can travel faster than the speed of light which is tantamount to breaking the time barrier. This daunting prospect has caused some physicists to try to come up with elaborate ways to explain away Aspect's findings. But it has inspired others to offer even more radical explanations.

consciousnessbrgrid.jpg

 

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The concept of eternity of the universe (Steady Stare Theory, pioneered by Fred Hoyle) is rejusted long ago. There are all the physical proof that the universe is expanding. it is not steady at all, so it cannot be eternal. It must have a start, from which it is expanding.

This starting point is named as Big bang. Mathematical calculations of the mass contained in the universe shows that at one time the the rate of expansion will be reduced, and from a point it will be reducing, the hypothetical situation is termed as big crunch.

Big crunch is theoretically possible, the black holes are the examples.

And, science does not deal with the existence of God seriously ....
 

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I want to add one more point ... In the strady state theory, the god is an invalid concept, coz the god has nothing to do there, as it is already created. nothing is left to be created my him.

But in case of big bang, which explains that everything is created after a certain point of time, there might be a role of god, he has something to play with under this model.

What do you think ? :)
 

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Technically speaking, according to some respected sources, a theory is defined as:

-a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained; ie: Darwin’s theory of evolution; or the big bang theory; or the theory of creationism; or the theory of intelligent design

-a set of principles on which the practice of an activity is based; ie: a theory of education

-an idea used to account for a situation or justify a course of action; ie: my theory would be that the place has been seriously mismanaged

Definition for theory - Oxford Dictionaries Online (World English)

Since any theory seems to be a work in progress, the ideas, thoughts, and beliefs in effect today can be modified tomorrow (or even discarded) if new information is gleaned from newly accepted sources. Many years ago one of my college professors tried to illustrate why theories should be taken with a grain of salt.

In theory, it is impossible to get from Point A to Point B. In order to get from A to B one must travel half the distance. Then half the distance again. And so on and so forth. By always traveling half the distance, Point B can never be reached because there will always be yet another "half the distance" to travel. Is the theory a valid one? Yes. Providing there's nothing beyond Point B.

We don't know what (if anything) is beyond the theory of evolution; or the big bang theory; or the theory of creationism; or the theory of intelligent design.
 

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It's difficult to have a discussion on the creation of the universe without someone interjecting faith as one possibility. I think that the warning issued was warranted with regards to the approach of the argument (classical use= debate), but not the content. I could be wrong.

At the risk of bending the rules, let me present the viewpoint of a respected scientist.

Time: Eistein & Faith
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0 said:
.... Einstein did, however, retain from his childhood religious phase a profound faith in, and reverence for, the harmony and beauty of what he called the mind of God as it was expressed in the creation of the universe and its laws. Around the time he turned 50, he began to articulate more clearly--in various essays, interviews and letters--his deepening appreciation of his belief in God, although a rather impersonal version of one. One particular evening in 1929, the year he turned 50, captures Einstein's middle-age deistic faith. He and his wife were at a dinner party in Berlin when a guest expressed a belief in astrology. Einstein ridiculed the notion as pure superstition. Another guest stepped in and similarly disparaged religion. Belief in God, he insisted, was likewise a superstition.

At this point the host tried to silence him by invoking the fact that even Einstein harbored religious beliefs. "It isn't possible!" the skeptical guest said, turning to Einstein to ask if he was, in fact, religious. "Yes, you can call it that," Einstein replied calmly. "Try and penetrate with our limited means the secrets of nature and you will find that, behind all the discernible laws and connections, there remains something subtle, intangible and inexplicable. Veneration for this force beyond anything that we can comprehend is my religion. To that extent I am, in fact, religious."

Shortly after his 50th birthday, Einstein also gave a remarkable interview in which he was more revealing than he had ever been about his religious sensibility. It was with George Sylvester Viereck, who had been born in Germany, moved to America as a child and then spent his life writing gaudily erotic poetry, interviewing great men and expressing his complex love for his fatherland. Einstein assumed Viereck was Jewish. In fact, Viereck proudly traced his lineage to the family of the Kaiser, and he would later become a Nazi sympathizer who was jailed in America during World War II for being a German propagandist.

Viereck began by asking Einstein whether he considered himself a German or a Jew. "It's possible to be both," replied Einstein. "Nationalism is an infantile disease, the measles of mankind."

Should Jews try to assimilate? "We Jews have been too eager to sacrifice our idiosyncrasies in order to conform."

To what extent are you influenced by Christianity? "As a child I received instruction both in the Bible and in the Talmud. I am a Jew, but I am enthralled by the luminous figure of the Nazarene."

You accept the historical existence of Jesus? "Unquestionably! No one can read the Gospels without feeling the actual presence of Jesus. His personality pulsates in every word. No myth is filled with such life."

Do you believe in God? "I'm not an atheist. I don't think I can call myself a pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God. We see the universe marvelously arranged and obeying certain laws but only dimly understand these laws."

Is this a Jewish concept of God? "I am a determinist. I do not believe in free will. Jews believe in free will. They believe that man shapes his own life. I reject that doctrine. In that respect I am not a Jew."

Is this Spinoza's God? "I am fascinated by Spinoza's pantheism, but I admire even more his contribution to modern thought because he is the first philosopher to deal with the soul and body as one, and not two separate things."

Do you believe in immortality? "No. And one life is enough for me."
-more

And then, if this thread isn't dead, Fred - continue the Big Bang discussion.
 

My Computer My Computer

At a glance

x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x6...AMD A6-3420M APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics6.00 GBAMD Radeon(TM) HD 6520G
Computer type
Laptop
Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
HP Pavilion dv6-6c10us
OS
x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x64 (6.1.7601) Win7_SP1 HomePrem
CPU
AMD A6-3420M APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics
Motherboard
Hewlett-Packard 1805
Memory
6.00 GB
Graphics Card(s)
AMD Radeon(TM) HD 6520G
Sound Card
(1) AMD High Definition Audio Device (2) IDT High Definiti
Monitor(s) Displays
HP W2072a 20" LCD (1600 x 900) @ 60 Hz
Screen Resolution
1366 x 768 x 32 bits (4294967296 colors) @ 60 Hz
Hard Drives
ST640LM0 00 HM641JI SATA Disk Device
Keyboard
Logitech k520 wireless KB
Mouse
Logitech m320 wireless mouse (bundled with KB)
Internet Speed
15/5 | 54 MB Wireless 'n'
Antivirus
Realtime: Defender or Avast | On-demand: Malwarebytes, ESET
Browser
IE 11 on Win8, IE 10 on win 7
Other Info
Media: [Gimp, Audacity, VLC] || Comm: [WEmail 2012, Skype] || Productivity: [OpenOffice,| Textpad] || Utils: [Sysinternals, cCleaner, Speccy, Defraggler]
Wow, wasn’t expecting the can of worms I opened when starting this thread. :confused:
 

My Computer My Computer

At a glance

windows 7 Pro 64Bit2.2 GHz Intel Core i7-2675QM8GBIntel HD Graphics 3000/Radeon HD 6490M
Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
Samsung Chronos 7
OS
windows 7 Pro 64Bit
CPU
2.2 GHz Intel Core i7-2675QM
Memory
8GB
Graphics Card(s)
Intel HD Graphics 3000/Radeon HD 6490M
Sound Card
Realtek High Definition Audio
Monitor(s) Displays
Built in LCD and external Dell 22 inch LCD
Screen Resolution
1600x900
Hard Drives
1 TB HDD
Internet Speed
20 MBPS Down 1500 KBPS Up
A Mystery in the Galactic Center
NASA said:
February 21, 2002: In the most suspenseful detective stories, the mystery deepens even as the plot reveals more clues. So has it been in real life for astrophysicists investigating the center of our Milky Way galaxy. They hoped that NASA's Chandra X-ray Observatory would reveal a long-suspected black hole there -- and indeed it did. But Chandra's revelations have raised new questions that baffle scientists perhaps even more than before.

A black hole is an object both so massive and so compact that not even light itself can escape its staggering gravity. For decades, theorists have argued that giant stars (ones at least 10 times as massive as our Sun) routinely end their lives as supernovas -- catastrophic explosions that spray matter light-years through interstellar space, leaving behind only a dense remnant of the original star. If the remnant exceeds about 3 solar masses, it will become a black hole.

-more

Astronomers Predict Titanic Collision: Milky Way vs. Andromeda
NASA said:
]May 31, 2012: NASA astronomers say they can now predict with certainty the next major cosmic event to affect our galaxy, sun, and solar system: the titanic collision of our Milky Way galaxy with the neighboring Andromeda galaxy.

The Milky Way is destined to get a major makeover during the encounter, which is predicted to happen four billion years from now. It is likely the sun will be flung into a new region of our galaxy, but our Earth and solar system are in no danger of being destroyed.

"After nearly a century of speculation about the future destiny of Andromeda and our Milky Way, we at last have a clear picture of how events will unfold over the coming billions of years," says Sangmo Tony Sohn of the Space Telescope Science Institute (STScI) in Baltimore.

"Our findings are statistically consistent with a head-on collision between the Andromeda galaxy and our Milky Way galaxy," adds Roeland van der Marel of the STScI.

-more
 

My Computer My Computer

At a glance

x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x6...AMD A6-3420M APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics6.00 GBAMD Radeon(TM) HD 6520G
Computer type
Laptop
Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
HP Pavilion dv6-6c10us
OS
x64 (6.3.9600) Win8.1 Pro & soon dual boot x64 (6.1.7601) Win7_SP1 HomePrem
CPU
AMD A6-3420M APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics
Motherboard
Hewlett-Packard 1805
Memory
6.00 GB
Graphics Card(s)
AMD Radeon(TM) HD 6520G
Sound Card
(1) AMD High Definition Audio Device (2) IDT High Definiti
Monitor(s) Displays
HP W2072a 20" LCD (1600 x 900) @ 60 Hz
Screen Resolution
1366 x 768 x 32 bits (4294967296 colors) @ 60 Hz
Hard Drives
ST640LM0 00 HM641JI SATA Disk Device
Keyboard
Logitech k520 wireless KB
Mouse
Logitech m320 wireless mouse (bundled with KB)
Internet Speed
15/5 | 54 MB Wireless 'n'
Antivirus
Realtime: Defender or Avast | On-demand: Malwarebytes, ESET
Browser
IE 11 on Win8, IE 10 on win 7
Other Info
Media: [Gimp, Audacity, VLC] || Comm: [WEmail 2012, Skype] || Productivity: [OpenOffice,| Textpad] || Utils: [Sysinternals, cCleaner, Speccy, Defraggler]
At the risk of bending the rules, let me present the viewpoint of a respected scientist.

Time: Eistein & Faith
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0 said:
....
At this point the host tried to silence him by invoking the fact that even Einstein harbored religious beliefs. "It isn't possible!" the skeptical guest said, turning to Einstein to ask if he was, in fact, religious. "Yes, you can call it that," Einstein replied calmly. "Try and penetrate with our limited means the secrets of nature and you will find that, behind all the discernible laws and connections, there remains something subtle, intangible and inexplicable. Veneration for this force beyond anything that we can comprehend is my religion. To that extent I am, in fact, religious."

-more
My earlier comments echo these exactly and I know I'm not in the intellectual league of Einstein!
If the word "religion" is not allowed, then let's think of one that means "that large subset of knowledge that human beings will never understand".
 

My Computer My Computer

At a glance

Windows 7x64 Home Premium SP1Intel i7 2600kG.Skill Ripjaws (DDR3-1600) 2x4GBNvidia GeForce GTS 450; Intel HD Graphics 300...
Computer type
PC/Desktop
Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
Own build
OS
Windows 7x64 Home Premium SP1
CPU
Intel i7 2600k
Motherboard
ASUS P8Z68 Deluxe
Memory
G.Skill Ripjaws (DDR3-1600) 2x4GB
Graphics Card(s)
Nvidia GeForce GTS 450; Intel HD Graphics 3000(GT2+)
Monitor(s) Displays
Dell Ultrasharp IPS panel U2311H, Samsung SyncMaster P2350
Screen Resolution
1920x1080
Hard Drives
Samsung 850 Pro SSD 256GB, Samsung SSD 840 120GB, Seagates 1TB Barracuda ST31000528AS x2
PSU
Seasonic M12II 520W
Case
Lian Li Lancool PC-K60
Cooling
Case: 1x120mm, 3x140mm CPU: Hyper 212+
Keyboard
Logitech MK520 (wireless)
Mouse
Logitech MK520
Internet Speed
6-7 Mbps
Antivirus
Norton Security Premium, Malwarebytes on 2 (MSE on 3rd PC)
Browser
FireFox
Other Info
Audio: Logitech Z523 2.1

My Computer My Computer

At a glance

win7 home premium-64bit-SP1-IE10T6600 2.2Ghz4 GbATI Mobility Radeon HD 4530
Computer type
Laptop
Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
HP pavilion DV6
OS
win7 home premium-64bit-SP1-IE10
CPU
T6600 2.2Ghz
Motherboard
HP Model 3628
Memory
4 Gb
Graphics Card(s)
ATI Mobility Radeon HD 4530
Sound Card
IDT High Definition
Screen Resolution
1366x768 @ 60Hz
Hard Drives
500Gb Western Digital
Antivirus
MSE
Other Info
Malwarebytes Antimalware + Spybot-Search&Destroy
I'm going to schedule vacation for when that happens ;)

A Guy
 

My Computer My Computer

At a glance

Windows 10 Home x64INTEL Core i5-750 Quad-Core 3.37GHzHyperX Fury Black Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 1866MhzEVGA GeForce GTX 750 Superclocked 1GB 128-Bit...
Computer type
PC/Desktop
OS
Windows 10 Home x64
CPU
INTEL Core i5-750 Quad-Core 3.37GHz
Motherboard
ASUS P7P55D
Memory
HyperX Fury Black Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 1866Mhz
Graphics Card(s)
EVGA GeForce GTX 750 Superclocked 1GB 128-Bit GDDR5
Monitor(s) Displays
LG 32MA68HY 32" IPS
Screen Resolution
1920 x 1080
Hard Drives
Samsung 840 Evo 120GB, SEAGATE 500GB Barracuda® 7200.12, SATA 3 Gb/s, 7200 RPM, 16MB cache
PSU
ANTEC TruePower New TP-550, 80 PLUS, 550W
Case
ANTEC Three Hundred Illusion
Cooling
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus, 4 x 120mm 1 x 140mm Noctua's
Internet Speed
85 + Mbps
Antivirus
Avast
Browser
Vivaldi
I'm going to schedule vacation for when that happens ;)

A Guy
I'd better book my ticket before the big rush. Where are we going again?
 

My Computer My Computer

At a glance

Windows 7x64 Home Premium SP1Intel i7 2600kG.Skill Ripjaws (DDR3-1600) 2x4GBNvidia GeForce GTS 450; Intel HD Graphics 300...
Computer type
PC/Desktop
Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
Own build
OS
Windows 7x64 Home Premium SP1
CPU
Intel i7 2600k
Motherboard
ASUS P8Z68 Deluxe
Memory
G.Skill Ripjaws (DDR3-1600) 2x4GB
Graphics Card(s)
Nvidia GeForce GTS 450; Intel HD Graphics 3000(GT2+)
Monitor(s) Displays
Dell Ultrasharp IPS panel U2311H, Samsung SyncMaster P2350
Screen Resolution
1920x1080
Hard Drives
Samsung 850 Pro SSD 256GB, Samsung SSD 840 120GB, Seagates 1TB Barracuda ST31000528AS x2
PSU
Seasonic M12II 520W
Case
Lian Li Lancool PC-K60
Cooling
Case: 1x120mm, 3x140mm CPU: Hyper 212+
Keyboard
Logitech MK520 (wireless)
Mouse
Logitech MK520
Internet Speed
6-7 Mbps
Antivirus
Norton Security Premium, Malwarebytes on 2 (MSE on 3rd PC)
Browser
FireFox
Other Info
Audio: Logitech Z523 2.1
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