Windows defragger overwrites mft zone

[him80us]

hey

there's a problem i found....
after i installed all programs i needed...and made sure i cleaned with Ccleaner...i used ultimate defrag as a visual guide(just because it doesnt work well in win 7) and saw plenty of space in reserved MFT....i assured this is setup in registry to value 1 ...meaning 12.5%....and started defragging with its original disk defragger....
...after it was done....i used ultimate defrag as a visual guide again....there was all nice and smooth....but MY RESERVED MFT WAS GONE
u can see in ultimate defrag every file positioned to the cluster no....
before defragging i assured after MFT it was MFT reserved(in ultimate defrag)...and after...there were some other files....and MFT reserved was gone....
after a restart....the MFT reserved was recreated in an inner cluster on disk....meaning...when this will be 100% fragemnted MFT in near future

in regedit MftZoneReserved its still on value 1

u can do a test....

make sure the reserved MFT is there....then defrag with original defragger then take a look again...

maybe only i have this problem

the only way to get the reserved MFT rite near the MFT is by using perfect disk boot time defrag...i tried this many times....
every time its the same....disk defrag overwrites mft reserved space....and i gotta put it back with perfect disk...

i didnt find the problem on the web so maybe u can help....thx

 

[logicearth]

You didn't find this on the web, because it is a none issue. The defragmention engine is Windows 7 is more then smart enough to know exactly what it is doing.

http://blogs.msdn.com/e7/archive/20...d-engineering-the-windows-7-improvements.aspx

 

[him80us]

hmmm....how come fragmented MFT is not an issue ???

once my mft is fragmented...it doesnt become into one piece again...i read there about the improvement of moving metadata...but MFT is still fragmented....

i tried this too....i figured that if defragger overwrites the MFT zone...it might be able to defragment it aswell...but its not my case....once fragmented...never defragged...

and why should microsoft bother to alocate value 1 to MftZoneReservation if defragger overwrites it anyway ?...why not disable it and drfragment it when it grows ??...

i dont fully understaind ...or maybe i missed something ?....thx

 

[him80us]

i did some tests.....boot defragger clears the mft zone.....and mft becomes fragmented as soon as it needs to expand.....

boot defragger is an iddle process task....but can be started with "defrag c: -b"

tried on more machines....this task overwrites the mftzone....same story

why does it do that ?

windows defrag cannot defragment the MFT after that....

i need to disable disk defragger from services....and use something else....

looks like perfect disk 10 does the job well....

PS: this problem doesnt bother anybody ?...

 

[logicearth]

PS: this problem doesnt bother anybody ?...

Because it is not really a problem.

 

[MyWin7]

Use MyDefrag (former JK Defrag) it's taking care of the MFT and I never had issues..

 

[him80us]

well....as far as i can see....almost every defragger takes care of the MFT but win defragger )

thats funny....

my question is....is that a bug ?....or something that can be fixed ?

 

[fseal]

There are also "memory optimizers" too. Just because something exists, doesn't mean it does anything useful.

Though, sadly, if your going to compete inthe marketplace and the other 5 defrag utilities that defrag the MFT then by ghod you better too!

 

[him80us]

well since vista....the point was ....that u will need less aditional software instead of maybe more....

the thing is....after a windows defrag the boot time decrease with few sec(3-5) than with any other defragger....

but MFT gets fragmented in time....

it may be a bug somewhere and the MFTzone is not securized...

i didnt try it but...i belive that if u disable superfetch u wont get a mft zone overwrite....cuz the boot defrag wont have a data collector

cheers

 

[him80us]

PS: this problem doesnt bother anybody ?...

Because it is not really a problem.

hey again....

i asked u uper....WHY isnt a problem a fragmented mft ?

just to understaind and all....

win 7 is new to me (and to other millions) and just looking for answers...from my experience....every top defragger(paragon, o&o, perfect disk, diskeeper, ultimate defarg....etc etc) has a "defrag mft" section.....if its not important....i keep asking....why ?

from that link u post it....i didnt find a thing saying that fragmented mft is a normal thing in win 7.....

and i still dont understaind why windows is setup to provide a 12.5% mft zone if the boot defragger still overwrites it anyway 1st time it has the chance

sry if im asking too much but......cant trust ur word....YET

cheers

 

[him80us]

There are also "memory optimizers" too. Just because something exists, doesn't mean it does anything useful.

Though, sadly, if your going to compete inthe marketplace and the other 5 defrag utilities that defrag the MFT then by ghod you better too!

:| good eye watson

if i wanted to disable the defragger in win 7 and go somewhere else....i wouldnt start that threat to find solutions....

and as far as i know....competition never hurt anybody....or did u like to pay 1k for a p4 till the amd got in the market and spoild the waters ?

 

[logicearth]

and i still dont understaind why windows is setup to provide a 12.5% mft zone if the boot defragger still overwrites it anyway 1st time it has the chance

It does not provide a "12.5%" MFT Zone reservation. That stopped back in Windows Vista. Now it is merely a 200 MB reservation, with 200 MB added as the MFT grows. Like I've been saying. Fragmentation of the MFT is a non-issue. These MFT defragers are stuck on a myth.

And BTW, the built in Windows Defragmentation is able to consolidate the MFT zones, since Windows Vista.

Windows Vista and Windows Server 2008 use a default size of 200MB for the initial MFT zone reservation. As the MFT outgrows the default zone due to more files being added to the volume, the MFT will create another 200MB zone to grow into. This change to fixed amount versus a percentage was done to deal with increasing size of volumes and create better efficiencies.

For example, in previous versions of Windows a 500GB NTFS volume would have a ~62GB MFT Zone Reservation (500MB x 12.5%). So if the MFT only grew to the size of 100MB, the first 62GB of the volume would be “reserved” and data would not start until the end of the 62GB mark.

Starting with Windows Vista and Windows Server 2008, the MFT uses a fixed 200MB zone reservation so as not to reserve space that will never actually be used (note that the zone reservation can be used by data once the remainder of the volume is filled up - this is the same as in previous versions of Windows).

[....]

For workstation or server profiles that have [VERY] large MFT’s, it is possible that the MFT will be more “fragmented” however these fragments will be 200MB in size a piece so the performance impact will be negligible....

 

[him80us]

i understaind what ur saying now logicearth

but my win doesnt act like ur telling me

in my regedit the MftZoneReservation=1 ....that value means 200mb ?? and if i set the value to 2 ...it will have a 400mb ??

lets say its like that....this is what it happends to me

i install win...i install all programs i need....i make sure the mft reserved is still there from cluster x to cluster y

lets say x to y its 150mb....after i install all the programs i need....

then i hit defragment ....after that....from cluster x to cluster y is no more reserved mft...actually the reserve is gone...and i have from cluster x to y lots of pieces from software i installed

so...my 200mb ur telling me it supose to be there r gone....and if i install something else the mft appears in an inner cluster....and if i defrag again...the reserve is also gone....and i get a fragmented MFT 30-40mb in one piece and another MFT 5-10mb in another piece not a 200mb a piece and a smaller piece as it grows...

thats what im trying to say....i dont even get to fill those 200mb ...why this behavior ?...cuz i didnt find anything about it....

and the 2nd problem....the defrag doesnt consolidate my mft...or is it set to do that once every 2-3 months ?....cuz i left my win 7 over 40 days to see if theres a consolidation of mft...and nothing happends

and im preety sure its not from a bad windows install....this problem i have every time i install and i did install at least 10 times now....

maybe u can help me understaind...cuz i dont see a normal behavior by that....

merry x-mas to all