Windwos 7 instalation problems (can't get to final instalation stage).

[HellAngel]

First of all hello

Yesterday I was trying to reinstall system on my friends laptop.
It's a Samsung ultrabook with 500gb hdd and 16gb ssd. It had a recovery partition with Windows 7 OEM but since she had Windows 7 Ultimate she decided to go for it instead.
After getting to installation screen of recovery I removed partitions with system .At that point i was informed that to complete this disks have to be "disengaged" or something like that - I know it's not specific description but I was kinda in a hurry . After my confirmation installer removed partitions. From here I switched to USB bootable installation of Win7 Ultimate.

At stage of disk selection I removed rest of the partitions (including the one with recovery files), created and formatted new ones, and proceeded with installation as usual. Installation proceeded up to the point of rebooting the system to finish the process, at which point issues have started.

After rebooting system didn't load as it should. Instead information of "lack of operating system" was displayed. At that point I repeated whole process again (removing partitions, creating new ones, installing the system etc.). This time I left USB stick with system installation files in laptop. It went straight to preparing new installation of operating system as if nothing was installed the last time (about 4 repetitions of whole process brought same results).

At that point I started to look closer what is going on.
So new created partitions had strange letters assigned to them (f.eg. 100mb system reserved partition had letter "c:" assign to it, while main partition with system was marked as "d:"). At that point I booted GParted, removed all the partitions with it, created new Partition tables and tried again with same effect - after installation system reserved space ends up with "c:" and system wasn't booting at all.

After that I proceeded to DISKPART using this tutorial - http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/91339-ssd-hdd-optimize-windows-reinstallation.html and clean all option. Yet again results were the same as before. I tried pre-creating partitions on both SSD and HDD disks with same results.

Assigning proper letters to partitions ("c: to windows partition etc) with DISKPART after the installation brought me to "BOOTMGR is missing Press Ctrl+Alt+Del ".
At that stage I used "bootrec /fixmbr", "bootrec /fixboot", "bootrec /rebuildbcd" (with last one never being able to find directory c:\boot\bcd).
Every restart of the Laptop reassigns letter "C:" to System reserved partition.

Since I'm slowly running out of the ideas what to do next I would like to ask for any insight and help with that problem.
My next step will be using Linux to erase MBR and/or whole disks, but if anyone can provide me with better solution I would be extremely grateful!!

PS. Since this description might be "little" confusing I'm happy to answer any questions.

 

[ignatzatsonic]

You have 2 separate hard drives: 16 GB SSD and 500 GB HDD.

On which of those 2 do you want to install Windows? 16 GB is very tiny. Is it some sort of cache drive?

General best idea is to have only 1 hard drive connected. Did you have both connected during your install attempts?

 

[HellAngel]

It's an unltrabook (one of those slim notebooks without cd/dvd drives, and as far as I can tell no easy physical access to SSD drive - which i guess was originally used as cache drive) and because of that both drives are always connected (i guess i could take out HDD, but as you mentioned 16gb is not much for W7). I tried installing system on both. Results are always the same (wrong disc descriptions, laptop not booting without windows installation USB).

Edit:
I believe that's the exact model
http://www.samsung.com/us/support/owners/product/NP530U3B-A01US

 

[ignatzatsonic]

Assuming your Window Ultimate installation media is valid, I'd guess the problem relates to that oddball small SSD.

The previous install may not have been completely wiped out.

Do you know for certain whether your attempts at "clean all" in Diskpart operated on the SSD or the HDD?

What does Diskpart see with the list disk command? One drive or two?

I've never fiddled with cache drives and don't know if some special installation technique is needed.

 

[HellAngel]

Diskpart sees 3 drives (one of them being USB stick with installation files, HDD and SSD).
I used "clean all" on both laptop drives. Both times "Operation was successful" according to the diskpart (SSD took around 6 minutes, HDD around 2h).

And I believe that installation drive is fine. Whole installation goes smoothly up to the point of restarting the machine to finish it.

So if you think that the problem lies in cache disk is there any way of "turning it off" (at that point i should mention that BIOS does not see it, while both linux and windows installation files can see and interact with it without any issues).

And lastly - im not really bothered with that SSD. Only target is to get Windows up and running on HDD.

 

[ignatzatsonic]

As I understand it, hybrid drives are actually just a single unit, with one area containing spinning platters and the other containing NAND to act as cache, but they may appear as 2 separate drives.

Immediately after your clean all on both drives, while still in Diskpart, did you create a single primary partition on the larger drive, format it, mark it active and then leave Diskpart and direct your installation to that specific partition---specifically not anywhere else?

If you do that, you shouldn't end up with a System Reserved partition of any type. I don't have one and don't need one.

Here's the commands:

list disk (to show the ID number of the hard disk to partition, normally Disk 0)
select disk 0 (change 0 to another number if applicable)
clean (this wipes the drive of anything on it; not needed on a brand new drive)
create partition primary (this will create one primary partition covering the entire drive)
select partition 1 (this selects the partition you just made)
active (this marks that partition active)
format fs=ntfs quick (this formats that partition)
exit (this quits the diskpart program)
exit (this closes the command prompt window)

Continue Windows 7 installation as usual. Remember to highlight and select the partition just created when you come to the partition screen asking you "where do you want to install Windows?”.


I found this quote on the Windows 8 forum related to a Dell machine with a hybrid drive. Maybe it gives you some insight:

In order to have this combination work, you have to have the BIOS set to use the Intel Smart Response Technology enabled, and once the OS is installed, you have to install the Intel Rapid Start Technology Driver.

With the Dell, the 32GB SSD was broken down into an 8GB OEM hibernation partition and the remaining space was dedicated to the caching portion. When I reloaded my OS, i simply ignored the SSD entirely and deleted the partitions on the 500GB SSD and recreated a partition on the 500GB drive in which to install Windows.

Once Windows was running, I installed the Intel Rapid Storage software (iRST). I went in and clicked on the SSD and choose to "Enable" acceleration. That was all there was to it.

 

[HellAngel]

As I understand it, hybrid drives are actually just a single unit, with one area containing spinning platters and the other containing NAND to act as cache, but they may appear as 2 separate drives.

Immediately after your clean all on both drives, while still in Diskpart, did you create a single primary partition on the larger drive, format it, mark it active and then leave Diskpart and direct your installation to that specific partition---specifically not anywhere else?

If you do that, you shouldn't end up with a System Reserved partition of any type. I don't have one and don't need one.

I believe I've done just that with one difference - I've created partition of 100gb instead of whole drive. System partition was created on that small SSD(as it always is no matter what i do) part and marked as "c:".

I found this quote on the Windows 8 forum related to a Dell machine with a hybrid drive. Maybe it gives you some insight:

In order to have this combination work, you have to have the BIOS set to use the Intel Smart Response Technology enabled, and once the OS is installed, you have to install the Intel Rapid Start Technology Driver.

With the Dell, the 32GB SSD was broken down into an 8GB OEM hibernation partition and the remaining space was dedicated to the caching portion. When I reloaded my OS, i simply ignored the SSD entirely and deleted the partitions on the 500GB SSD and recreated a partition on the 500GB drive in which to install Windows.

Once Windows was running, I installed the Intel Rapid Storage software (iRST). I went in and clicked on the SSD and choose to "Enable" acceleration. That was all there was to it.

That part points me to a conclusion that I messed up whole thing by formatting that little SSD part, because now system doesn't know what to make of it (as it is always listed as disk 0) ....


Edit:
I'll try to install the system with commands that you provided and post the results asap.

 

[HellAngel]

As previously after the first part of installation systems either doesn't start(no bootmgr) or goes straight to installation screen (with boot usb plugged in).

System reserved partition was created on small ssd part and marked as "C:", and large 500 gb partition with system was marked as "d:". It contains all windows folders apart from bootmgr (which probably should be created in last step of installation process, which never occurs due to the fact that windows partition is being marked as "d:" and installator looks for windows files on "c:").

So now the question - is it Partition Tables and MBR or something associated with me formatting ssd cache..
Or maybe it's an installation drive issue...


edit:
So I've tried to remove that system partition and use windows restore tool as explained in this tutorial http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/71363-system-reserved-partition-delete.html (and the one following).
After running startup repair (http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/681-startup-repair.html) I'm ending up with System Reserved partition marked as "c:" and created on SSD drive, new partition marked as "e:" containing all the files from installation (also created on SSD - still marked as 0), and my old partition containing first installation files, marked as "d:", and No Bootmgr message on startup

Edit 2:
Running DBan provided me with additional info of SSD. It's SanDisk iSSD P4 SSD 14GB.
Apparently it's a second disk, not a hybrid.

 

[gregrocker]

Check in BIOS setup to see if you have IRST as a SATA controller choice. If so disable it for install as shown in Install Windows on System with MSATA and ISRT - Windows 7 Help Forums. This also shows how to re-enable it after install so you benefit from the SSD caching chip.

If this doesn't allow install after deleting all partitions, then work through the steps for Overcoming Windows 7 Installation Failures - Windows 7 Help Forums

 

[HellAngel]

So I've solved the problem.
Apparently it's not uncommon with Samsung laptops to fail regular windows Installation after removing original partitions.
Doing that sets SSD as a default booting disk or something like that, and OS installed on SSD doesn't boot god knows why.

To get around it I installed Windows on SSD, and instead of letting installer to run again after first reboot of system I cloned whole SSD to HDD (I used Hirens Boot USB tools, but I'm sure you can do that with some Linux tools too), wiped SSD, and set HDD partitions as primary (100mb system partition as Active) using Partition Wizard.

After rebooting system I had to run recovery from Windows installation USB, and after restart, system booted as it should and finished installation. Unfortunately it copied all the files to SSD again, but repetition of cloning and wiping disk done the trick

Now it's up and running with system on HDD, and SSD ready to be restored as a cache.

If anyone will have similar problems and will need some advice I'll be happy to help

And of course thanks for all your help guys.

 

[gregrocker]

Did you follow the steps to disable IRST in BIOS in the link I provided just above?

 

[HellAngel]

I have no such option in Bios. Nor I can find drivers for installation of ISRT on hard drive on Samsung website. Just some Windows lvl application for it.

And following steps from second topic led to same result as before
But it pointed me to the idea of cloning

 

[gregrocker]

Do you have all of your drivers in Device Manager? If not IRST do you know which is providing the caching with SSD? You may want to check your model's Support Downloads webpage for listed drivers and the Manual.

Does your Manual explain how to turn back on caching with the SSD?

Incidentally we've helped several of those with 32gb SSD caches install Win7 on it, which they preferred due to performance speed, so kept it with User folders on the HD. Is there a noticeable difference in SSD performance? Are you sure it's smaller than 32gb which is smallest we've seen here before?

 

[HellAngel]

So that's the almost exact model of the laptop that I'm working on.
All of the drivers from it work as they should.
I do not have any manual, and one on website doesn't explain anything apart from using build in recovery (which is long gone and forgotten ).

And Device Manager shows that everything is running as it should.

 

[gregrocker]

May I ask how you know that the SSD caching is working as intended? It normally is RAIDed via a setting in BIOS and requires a driver. Do you see any similar setting on any tab in BIOS setup?

Do you have IRST driver in Device Manager? If not is there a simlar driver to IRST or which provides SSD caching under IDE-ATA controllers or System Devices in Device Manager?

What is the location now of the paging file? Virtual Memory Paging File - Change - Vista Forums

 

[HellAngel]

SSD wasn't working at all as a cache - just as a regular drive
But main idea was to get the Laptop up and running again, and then worry about rest.
Currently I used drivers from Samsung website (they were in the other zip file) and reinstalled the whole system again (either booting from system reserved partition or setting SSD id to 84 prevented installer from messing up whole installation again) and will try to switch IRST again . Hopefully it will work