Need help with windows 8 clean install on retail pc.

[NoelDP]

I haven't read the entire thread - just the first post so forgive me if I cover old ground again...

My understanding is that if you use Retail or OEM System Builder media to do the install on a BIOS-activated (SLP v3) Win8 machine, it should 'just work'. However, I've never had the opportunity to try it.

Have you made sure that you have the same edition media as machine? and the same version? You cannot use Win8.1 media on a Win8 machine, and likewise cannot use Win8Pro media on a Win8 core machine (or vice-versa). Check the Win8 Sticker - is if for Pro or Core? The colour should tell you if the wording doesn't - but I can never remember the colour code.
Note that MSDN media may have problems as well - I believe they/some are now locked so that they demand the Key whatever

If the original drive can be read reliably, ProduKey or Magical Jelly Bean may be able to retrieve the Key remotely if you attach the drive in a USB housing (see the details at ProduKey - Recover lost product key (CD-Key) of Windows/MS-Office/SQL Server )

 

[andrew129260]

I haven't read the entire thread - just the first post so forgive me if I cover old ground again...

My understanding is that if you use Retail or OEM System Builder media to do the install on a BIOS-activated (SLP v3) Win8 machine, it should 'just work'. However, I've never had the opportunity to try it.

Have you made sure that you have the same edition media as machine? and the same version? You cannot use Win8.1 media on a Win8 machine, and likewise cannot use Win8Pro media on a Win8 core machine (or vice-versa). Check the Win8 Sticker - is if for Pro or Core? The colour should tell you if the wording doesn't - but I can never remember the colour code.
Note that MSDN media may have problems as well - I believe they/some are now locked so that they demand the Key whatever

If the original drive can be read reliably, ProduKey or Magical Jelly Bean may be able to retrieve the Key remotely if you attach the drive in a USB housing (see the details at ProduKey - Recover lost product key (CD-Key) of Windows/MS-Office/SQL Server )

Ok, I just went over this all again. If I read things correctly?
The PC came with Windows 8.1.
The tamper sticker doesn't say Pro so we are assuming its only 8.1 Core.
8.1 Pro was installed because that is what was on hand and that was the only key that would let Windows install.
The OEM key has been retrieved but won't work because its a Core key and Pro is installed.
Andrew is now trying to install Core in a 30 day trial mode so he can try his OEM key again.

If the original install was the regular OEM, not the single language version, the embedded key "should" be used automatically. That makes me think it was the Single language version. If so Andrew will have to hunt up that ISO. If he does get 8.1 Core installed and his OEM key still won't work, I think that would confirm my suspicion. There were one or two other threads like this and I'll see if I can hunt one up.

Windows 8.1 Core/Single Language Installation w/ Win8 key Post #5 may help.

Correct.

Thank you.

I will report my findings as soon as I have time to do this. Thank you everyone.

BTW:

I looked here:

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/howtotell/Hardware.aspx#PCPurchase

And discovered the pc does have a genuine Microsoft label tamper evident seal, but not a coa. In fact every pc with windows 8 I have seen does not have a coa sticker. Should they? I mean that is what I was talking about when I said I missed the windows 7 days with the sticker having the key on it. And that page says every windows professional pc should have one. But even on laptops and desktops sold with windows 8 pro installed on it at stores I do not see a coa on them. So what is going on with that?

I thought coa was replaced and no longer used on windows 8 and new pc's going forward. But Microsoft's own page makes me think otherwise.

The color shifting ink though should help me determinate what it really is (but I am positive its 8 core as most new pcs sold are not 8 pro), so the page did help me a little. I will report back when I have time.

 

[ThrashZone]

I doubt the recovery disk is any different than a oem :/
I also doubt the recovery disk is free either so pick you poison give the money to Newegg or .... or the manufacture that pretty much stacked the deck

I got one of the win-8 upgrade activation keys from Robin I don't believe it works anymore either
Not that I give a hoot but just saying Microsoft might of change the playing field ?

That likely depends on your definition of Recovery. Usually, what you get from the OEM (for a price) just restores an image back to the hard drive. It wipes everything out and restores it to the OOBE. The Out Of the Box Experience. It will be like it was the first time you turned it on. Pick your language etc. All you personal files are gone. All the original OEM preinstalled junk is back too. If you buy an off the shelf System builder (OEM) version you can clean install and pick and chose what gets installed. The downside is you may have to hunt up some drivers etc.

Yep there was a big stink about manufactures not including a recovery disk by default on computer sells in win-7,
The manufactures installed the recovery partition instead
Some got sued eventually Gateway/ Acer because the recovery disk's actually were clean install disks which they didn't want to provide a disk with no junkware

The manufactures were to lazy to make a system recovery disk with all of the junkware on it for free
Thus the hdd/ ssd failure vision was thought to be taken care of via a Extended warrantee or when one was purchased in the future ?
Either way it's a complete mess with win-8 because mostly Microsoft made it that way on purpose
Manufactures got a deal on the os that's all they cared about at that time :/
Customer looses in the long run,
Mobo stuck in limbo land

Retail Mobo with factory oem How many times has Noel seen that one

 

[NoelDP]

No Win8 machine pre-installed by a large manufacturer has a COA sticker - because they are theoretically redundant.
Each machine has the COA built-in to the BIOS (at it's this that the installer is supposed to read and install).

I'm not sure what the situation is with Windows 8/8.1 Retail or OEM System Builder packages, since MS effectively abolished the 'Retail' and Upgrade licenses in Win8. I've never owned or handled a Win8 machine that wasn't from a large manufacturer - and have never bought a Win8 pack other than as an Upgrade download. I *think* COA stickers come with all 'retail OEM System Builder' packs for Win8 - but have no idea what's happening with Win8.1

 

[Slartybart]

How to refresh, reset, or restore your PC - Windows Help

.....
Resetting your PC reinstalls Windows but deletes your files, settings, and apps—except for the apps that came with your PC
.....
If your PC came with Windows 8.1 or Windows RT 8.1, you’ll need the discs or thumb drive that came with your PC. Check the info that came with your PC to see if your PC manufacturer provided these discs or media. In some cases, you might have created them when you first set up your PC.

If you upgraded your PC to Windows 8.1 or Windows RT 8.1 with a DVD, use that disc.

If you don’t have Windows 8.1 or Windows RT 8.1 media, contact Microsoft Support.
.....

I think Microsoft should be able to help you here. I'd explain that the disk drive went south and you've tried almost every conceivable way you know of to install Win8.1 on a new HD.

You have tried recovery - yes? You'd need to create a recovery USB on another machine to do that though - 'cause your HD is dead ... kaput .. an ex-parrot

Anyway, there are a few tutorials on eightforums that might help, but you're in that vicious circle - no boot drive.

Maybe MS will tell you where to get the ISO without using the OEM key - or how to get the media with an OEM key (could be generic).

You might want to gather some information from your friend (where and when the machine was purchased - your friends full name, maybe some authentication pin or key(I don't recall the setup procedure) if they registered the machine.... nothing personal should be needed). Play end user and ask them 'How do I do that?' questions if they ask you to bring up PC settings or download a file.

If everything checks out on their end, they should give you the means to recover the machine.


Side note: Anyone else get a German language pages on Microsoft?
I've reset my machine language to US English, and looked around in my live profile, and reset the language on a few MS pages....the pages remain in Deutsch.

I'll poke around some more, but if everyone is having this issue ....

 

[ThrashZone]

Well the Microsoft support link opened in English you posted :/
Nothing else has done any differently today ?

Microsoft did get an ear full a week or 2 ago by me,
I have no idea why they insist on pushing Microsoft mouse and keyboard center on a freaking laptop
Which if loaded wipes out a touchpad settings in properties but still they push it

 

[Layback Bear]

How to refresh, reset, or restore your PC - Windows Help


Microsoft Support.

Both from your post #65 and they both are in English.

 

[Slartybart]

Thanks Mike,

Thanks Jack.

I noticed this last night on one support page, now it seems to be every Microsoft support page. I'll go though my normal trouble shooting when the silly stuff starts.

I'll post what I find - who knows a restart might fix it.

Bill
.

 

[Slartybart]

Well that was easy... I removed Microsoft from my 'preserved favorites folder' and also removed *.microsft.com from the IE trusted sites.

I was playing with the Modern IE earlier today, but not yesterday. I'll tack this up to a cookie that got deleted when I removed the protection from MS sites.

All better now!

Thanks again.

 

[alphanumeric]

No Win8 machine pre-installed by a large manufacturer has a COA sticker - because they are theoretically redundant.
Each machine has the COA built-in to the BIOS (at it's this that the installer is supposed to read and install).

I'm not sure what the situation is with Windows 8/8.1 Retail or OEM System Builder packages, since MS effectively abolished the 'Retail' and Upgrade licenses in Win8. I've never owned or handled a Win8 machine that wasn't from a large manufacturer - and have never bought a Win8 pack other than as an Upgrade download. I *think* COA stickers come with all 'retail OEM System Builder' packs for Win8 - but have no idea what's happening with Win8.1

My two laptops have Windows 8 stickers on the bottom that look like Microsoft supplied stickers. They have the Windows logo in them. There is no product code obviously. I just assumed they were the new COA stickers for OEM PC's? otherwise why put them on the bottom?
Mine look like this.


EDIT: I stand corrected, it looks like those labels are a Genuine Microsoft Label (GML) as shown in the link Andrew posted earlier. http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/howtotell/Hardware.aspx#PCPurchase Not COA stickers as I had thought.

 

[andrew129260]

I cannot find anywhere a legit source (I do not consider torrents a source) to download windows 8 core. Every guide and tut says you can use generic keys and I try the ones they say but it does not work. Then they all mention that oem keys will not work either. I am calling Microsoft again....

It is standard windows 8 like I thought.

Windows 8: magenta to green

WELP, I am telling everyone I know to create recovery disks now.
(Of course the average user is screwed.)

Microsoft refuses help again.
Apparently if your hard drive dies you're screwed so sorry give us more money. You should not have to pay Microsoft or your manufacturer again to reinstall windows. That is Bull****!!!!

So now I know the real reason Microsoft embedded the key into the bios, so they can screw everyone.

 

[ThrashZone]

Pretty much
Disposable oem's who would of thunk it
All upgrade disks are junk I don't even believe a win-7 upgrade disk is any good unless you have Vista or x-p to put upgrade from :/

 

[andrew129260]

Pretty much
Disposable oem's who would of thunk it
All upgrade disks are junk I don't even believe a win-7 upgrade disk is any good unless you have Vista or x-p to put upgrade from :/

Not true, you can easily clean install with them. But they are intended for an upgrade so that is there whole point.

 

[gregrocker]

Andrew, that PC ships with 8.1. The problem is likely you weren't using the 8.1 installation media. I'd ask at Eight Forums for how to find media for that exact version to Clean Install - Windows 8.

I'm not that well-versed in Windows 8 but understand it should activate via the BIOS if you use that correct version. If not then seek help in their forums for how to activate it, or ask back here.

Several references were made to the need to call MS to activate Clean Reinstall - Factory OEM Windows 7. I'd just like to add that while I've heard this many times, I've never had to personally do this as it activates on the web every time the correct key and version is used.

 

[andrew129260]

Andrew, that PC ships with 8.1. The problem is likely you weren't using the 8.1 installation media. I'd ask at Eight Forums for how to find media for that exact version to Clean Install - Windows 8.

I'm not that well-versed in Windows 8 but understand it should activate via the BIOS if you use that correct version. If not then seek help in their forums for how to activate it, or ask back here.

Several references were made to the need to call MS to activate Clean Reinstall - Factory OEM Windows 7. I'd just like to add that while I've heard this many times, I've never had to personally do this as it activates on the web every time the correct key and version is used.

Thanks, see my top post on this page though...

 

[gregrocker]

At the top of this page you say you're going to try ei.cfg removal tool. I don't think that applies here. You need an 8.1 installer and it should work.

I'm not getting involved in any argument here. You asked me to look at this thread and I told you what I spotted trying to avoid all the static. But I'm not a Windows 8 expert and have only done a few 8 reinstalls just the way I suggested. You may want to ask at 8F for exact media.

 

[alphanumeric]

Microsoft doesn't deal with factory OEM install issues, they will just tell you to contact the OEM that sold you the PC. I'm not saying that's right or wrong, that's just the way it is. If you paid them directly buy buying a Retail copy they give you tech support. It's been that way for ages.
The OEM, most times in a situation like this, will just tell you to order the recovery media. You'll pay a fee, but it shouldn't be terribly expensive. It will be cheaper than buying another full copy of Windows. Assuming it works. I made a Recovery thumb drive for my laptop when I got it and checked the option to copy the factory recovery partition to the drive. It worked on the factory installed hard drive but was useless on the SSD replacement. Likely because of the size difference.
Anyway, as suggested, starting a new thread on 8 forums may be the way to go. You can always link to this one too. I'm a member there too.

 

[andrew129260]

Greg I was referring to the spot above where I state there is no legit way to download windows 8 core iso or pro iso that a oem key can be used on. That is why I am frustrated. Appreciate you looking though.

Thanks alphanumeric I know. But before you could always reinstall windows when needed. Now they made it so you cannot and have to pay for recovery disks. That is completely unfair in my opinion when you already paid for the pc. You should be able to reinstall windows without having to pay again.

Anyways thanks everyone.

 

[alphanumeric]

There was an option to create recovery media on the original install. If people would just do this BEFORE they have issues it would save a lot of frustration. It's not your fault the owner didn't do it, but now its you that's getting frustrated. If they had done this you wouldn't have to pay for it now. My two laptops nagged me to create the recovery media.

The issue of having a hard time getting an ISO is one I've complained about many times over. When I put my SSD in my laptop I was not an MVP and didn't have access to MSDN. I had to resort to bit torrent to get an ISO to do a clean install. I just compared the hash of mine against what Microsoft lists on MSDN. You can look at all that info on MSDN without a subscription, you just can't download anything. I have no idea why Microsoft blocked OEM keys for that download?

 

[gregrocker]

We went through a period of persuading MS that it is in their interests to let their customers have the best possible install of Win7 on store-bought PC's. The result is that there is no longer any problem with downloading the ISO and when they were recently moved from Digital River to Azure servers there was no attempt to restrict them.

It helps that Clean Reinstall - Factory OEM Windows 7 has one of the top web views of any tech pages. Yet sometimes I am asked pointed old-school questions by other MVP's about the legitimacy of this, or the disaster-rate, which are pretty much vanquished when I tell them we have 0 complaints and a whole lot of happy customers. Those who persist in questioning the need sound like they're in the pockets of OEM's who don't even fight it any longer. It is an infinitely better install, period. MS Customers are not even experiencing Win7 native performance until they get rid of the factory install.

So what may be missing here is the kind of advocacy at 8Forums we did here for access to clean ISO's, helped greatly by understanding Admins who put much on the line to back it and spent much time helping to determine how it could be done with the least blowback to the forums. Somewhere along the way MS dropped sanctions on these links.

If there was a OEM Clean Reinstall culture at Eight Forums it would probably already be done, may be in the works, or achieved - which is why I suggested asking there. I can promise you there will be one at Ten Forums when the time comes. We need to see what their plans are. I am in a Ten session at Global MVP Summit while I am typing this. Maybe I 'll have the chance to ask them how OEM will be handled for reinstall.