Not to impressed with Win 7 yet

[LarryLaser]

Ok, I have been testing the capabilities of Windows 7, both x86 and x64 for quite some time now, (since Nov 2008:sarc, starting with the first release v7-7000 to the latest v 7-7100 on as many as 6 different computers.
Some old (x86) hardware platforms and a couple of fairly new 64 bit platform hardware. 3 Laptops and 3 Desktops.

I use some of the most complex software you can imagine, Design Engineering and Diagnostics, Like Auto Desk Inventor 2008 (pretty expensive:shock and CST 2006 (Very Expensive), as well as Network Monitoring software and pretty high levels of Security software and Hardware:devil2:.

I have been informing Microsoft on a regular basis (like I hope all members here have been:roflmao about bugs, glitches, problems and especially crashes (Send Feedback links). And I have noticed quite a few improvements on many issues I have submitted.

But, The latest Windows 7 release still has a lot of glitches and bugs , and a few driver issues:mad2:. Now no insult to Microsoft Developers, or Hardware Manufactures and Driver Developers, cause "IT IS BETA", and a lot of work is still needed to make it more stable. And I do run Debugging to find out what is causing the problems.

But I recommend that everyone use a multi boot foundation or at least a separate hard drive or partition to save or maintain all of you documents, files or program completion operations. Cause just like Windows (all since v 1.1) from the beginning, "s*(t" happens and you could loose any or all files on your operating systems partition. On a regular basis I never went to the latest release for my work till the SP1 pack was released, Including Win 98 (till SE), Win 2000(till sp1), Windows XPP(sp1) and to this day I do not use Vista(cause it is still full of crapy bugs). There is no such thing a a perfect operating system.

 

[darkmax]

The RC has quite a few more bugs/glitches than the beta, I reckon. My nVidia Graphic Driver from nVidia, for example, refuses to function properly. It used to work well with the pre-7100 build.

 

[LarryLaser]

Your right about that DarkMax

Yea buddy,
I have had nothing but problems with nVidia drivers.
The latest released driver (v 185.85) for all OS's (MS) have been full of glitches and problems. I have constantly gone to the nVidia Developers forum asking questions about the bugs and never get an answer from them (the Dev team), only comments from others trying to find the solutions.

 

[jimbo45]

..........

I use some of the most complex software you can imagine, Design Engineering and Diagnostics, Like Auto Desk Inventor 2008 (pretty expensive:shock and CST 2006 (Very Expensive), as well as Network Monitoring software and pretty high levels of Security software and Hardware:devil2:.
.....

Hi there

This is EXACTLY the sort of software that IS likely to have the most problems both in Hardware and Software for using in a new OS.

1) It's expensive so relatively few (compared with the "consumer" market) installations.

2) People who often run this type of software aren't the one's usally pushing for updating their PC's / software so not too much pressure on the manufacturers to provide W7 updates.

XP compatability mode was designed for smaller businesses who use these types of applications so they CAN upgrade the PC's whilst still using the older kit until software updates are available.

I don't think you can actually blame MS for this one -- I suspect the manufacturers of the packages you are using don't feel a business need at the present time to spend a lot of effort in updating this stuff to W7 yet especially if there isn't any pressure from most of their customers.

Cheers
jimbo

 

[napilopez]

While it is true that there is no such thing as a perfect operating system, W7RC is easily the least glitchy pre-release windows or Linux OS I've ever used. In fact the only bug I have encountered is that shift-dragging files onto MS Word in tv taskbar doesn't work, no big.

Also, I don't think that is the case hear, but lots of the people who complain about RC problems have upgraded from previous builds when MS warned us not to. Haven't had a single issue with 7RC on any of the 5 computers I've installed it on.

 

[napilopez]

Also, I agree with what Jimbo said. There's only so much the deb team can do unfortunately :/ I'm surprised people are still having drivers issues, RC fixed all previous drivers issues I've experienced.

 

[bhuulo]

Some older system still has driver problems, I installed Windows 7 RC 7100 on my elder brother's notebook and I had to search for the graphics driver (915 board), mass storage and 2 or 3 other drivers which I don't remember now but one good thing was these all drivers appeared in windows Update and the only thing which I had to do is to check whether to download the drivers and install updates.... So far So Good..... But my memory consumption has increased after installing the RC, has anyone has the same problem...

 

[swarfega]

I have no intention of multi-booting, windows 7 works just fine for me. I don't use any fancy expensive applications like you but I do play some pretty demanding games.

 

[darkmax]

Also, I agree with what Jimbo said. There's only so much the deb team can do unfortunately :/ I'm surprised people are still having drivers issues, RC fixed all previous drivers issues I've experienced.

Yeah, but the drivers are new (185.85) and WHQL-ed. Once my monitor comes back on from sleep, it crashes into BSOD. Without Fail. So I rolled back into the default driver

 

[LarryLaser]

Hi there
This is EXACTLY the sort of software that IS likely to have the most problems both in Hardware and Software for using in a new OS.

1) It's expensive so relatively few (compared with the "consumer" market) installations.

XP compatability mode was designed for smaller businesses who use these types of applications so they CAN upgrade the PC's whilst still using the older kit until software updates are available.

Cheers
jimbo

Quite possibly true Jimbo
But, I don't pay to much attention to the "consumer market" groups, mainly with other Engineers that do the same type of work I do.

But, the software I use for Engineering work requires a lot of resources on an Operating System, My point of the testing Win 7 is to be able to run more than one of these apps at the same time without the system slowing down, especially using my copy of CST (Computer Simulation Technology), This app cost me $43,000.00 a number of years ago, it has the capability to simulate Physics and Engineering Technology simultaneously at the same time running the design programming using lots of graphics resources.

On my Windows XPP x64 version running these programs at the same time my resources for them go up to about 94%. On the Windows 7 x64 version (which these are Vista compatible level) run at or around 58%. The main problem always reverts to the drivers for the nVidia cards, these cards (2 of them) each have 1 Gig of their own Memory, so the graphics resource demand is not that bad. It always goes to the controllers (.dll's) in the library.

2) People who often run this type of software aren't the one's usally pushing for updating their PC's / software so not too much pressure on the manufacturers to provide W7 updates.

Most other Engineer's I know are looking for the same reasons, to reduce the resource demand for better performance and quicker testing of our designs.

I don't think you can actually blame MS for this one -- I suspect the manufacturers of the packages you are using don't feel a business need at the present time to spend a lot of effort in updating this stuff to W7 yet especially if there isn't any pressure from most of their customers.

I don't blame MS for any of the bugs still in this release, This is a BETA design, which is still under development, The biggest issues is from the nVidia Drivers. Constant Bugs and BSOD's happen and I have been running the Windows Win 7 Debugging programs to find the issues, so far almost every crash was caused by the nVidia driver issues, not all but most.

 

[RST101]

I too have no intention of dual booting win 7. I do not see the need to fill the drive(s) up with operating systems that are completely in the shadow of win 7.

Also like swarfega I do not run those type of programs but do run intensive graphic games and have no problems at all.

Like I have said many times on these forums, xp, vista and the like are well and truly established now because they have been out for many many years. Windows 7 on the other hand is still in the making, which makes it even more remarkable. Imo no other os comes close to this beauty and xp, vista etc needed service packs to just make them function properly.

Also if it is nvidia which are causing you the problems why title your thread as you have? Is it easier to blame the os?

People really need to consider the fact this operating system is still being developed(its like a baby who is still in the womb) ready for it's introduction into the world so need to think before they type.



Xp, vista etc etc will never be acquainted with my computer again.

 

[Digger]

While it is true that there is no such thing as a perfect operating system, W7RC is easily the least glitchy pre-release windows or Linux OS I've ever used.

i cant believe i have seen that statement, you are one of the few... Have you ever beta tested any other OS or video game before testing this? just curious, you may have, i dunno.

Also, I don't think that is the case hear, but lots of the people who complain about RC problems have upgraded from previous builds when MS warned us not to. Haven't had a single issue with 7RC on any of the 5 computers I've installed it on.

This is so far from the truth, as you are misinformed by your supposed source of info. I myself do a fresh every time, as well as most of the real "seasoned" beta testers do, and ones who have taken the advice. Even still its good to possibly test the upgrade option, but for one to think that they wont see problems because of that makes them a little naive as to how "things go" when upgrading/overwritting a file system. Even if you take an installation of a game from another system drive, and copy overwrite it to a new fresh drive install, you are going to have problems with MOST, some you may not.

HG/Libraries have not improved, but faltered more since pub beta. Connections problems are abundant when this WASNT an issue with the pub beta. This feature (Homegroup) is supposed to beone of the MAIN HIGHLIGHTS of windows 7 :shock::shock::shock:

MS waited till after the pub release of RC to release the IE bug fix that was apparent in beta 7000, then had to rush an important fix not but a few days later. This right here could have all been done before the pub RC was released. So these examples here just give you a window into the problems and structure apparently MS has made for itself now to compile a collaborative OS effort. I think they find that they are running into more problems with more hands in the honeypot.

I guess i would have different feelings/thoughts/bold opinions about this topic/issue if MS was just to release this and label it Beta 2, or not release it to pub at all. For alot if not the majority of testers cant really get back to actually testing the OS itself now with other applications and such, because of the need to put out small fires created in the RC that wasnt present in the beta.

 

[patrickt]

Wow, I never realized it was Microsoft's responsibility to design an OS that was compatible with existing drivers. I always thought the companies such as NVidia had an obligation to update their drivers. Shows what I know.

 

[Digger]

Wow, I never realized it was Microsoft's responsibility to design an OS that was compatible with existing drivers. I always thought the companies such as NVidia had an obligation to update their drivers. Shows what I know.

first of all, the problems are not all driver based, connection issues, i'm gonna say probably 85% are driver related, but in beta it wasnt near my guesstimated 85%.... more and more problems are surfacing with the RC compared to beta. Besides just a driver point to argue, how about the updates they had to release for IE right after initial release?? Then the critical/important security issue with the x86 editions. I mean, can we double check the homework before handing it in to the teacher? Its carelessness like this that represents a deeper reason or call it conspiracy theory as to why now all the abundant problems.. of a fresh RC install... compared to a fresh beta install.

Do i care that i still dont have a smartcard reader driver? it would be nice, but hey, i know this is in test. All i ask for is improvement while going forward, not having to backtrack to find out why now there are issues cropping up when things werent double checked and rechecked before atleast releasing to public.

Can you tell me or provide me with any kind of mind altering proof that this RC acts, behaves, and operates better than the public 7000 beta? I'm sorry, i just dont see it at all. Hence my disapointment with the pub RC.

After my own customization of the 7000 beta for a few months, i feel that I HAVE myself my "own kind of RC"... had and have now minimal if any kind of bugs compared to RC. Who cares about the sounds and wallpaper? i mean really... the only noticeable difference... but that shouldnt be released till RC2 or RTM imo... what about the .wav files are we going to test? .themepacks were tested already and shown that they can save the files, etc. I see no point in the sounds other than a "candy gift" for the testers. One other small noticeable thing of mind is the number of flashes a window will show now, as i read about before, nice touch, but is that all you got MS? Now its RC?

 

[PhreePhly]

Hi there

XP compatability mode was designed for smaller businesses who use these types of applications so they CAN upgrade the PC's whilst still using the older kit until software updates are available.

XP Compatibility won't help much for these types of design packages. The problem with the virtualized XP is that the graphics system is emulated. A S3 Trio 64MB card is the emulated card. That won't do for design.

Ironically, given how much they cost, the problem with most of those packages is that they are really not very well coded. They are designed for a very narrow band of hardware and unless you stick to exactly that list, you will run up against their limitations. The developers take many shortcuts in the coding that are usually not MS approved, so that they will be quite fragile. However, when they work, they are second to none, so engineering firms are held hostage. Typically, the OS that runs those packages are a release or two behind the rest of the enterprise in order to maintain uptime.

PhreePhly

 

[RST101]

It would be quite difficult to prove anything like that on-line you would have to be at the users computer for it to be substantiated (or take users word for it). in my experience of using windows 7 from build 6801 (which I still retain a copy of) is one of progression.
In those earlier builds I was finding myself with a frozen/hanging computer and on numerous occasions had to do a hard shutdown because it would become totally unresponsive. It got better with build 7000 but still was quite buggy hanging/freezing you know the one. Build 7022 had no joy at all with it so stayed with build 7000 until 7048 made an appearance, installed, liked, kept.

Now since build 7057 that's when things have really start to stabilize and get more responsive, things are not hanging/freezing and overall good. Then we find ourselves at build 7100 where imo is immaculate in every sense of the word but, I am just a regular home user with enough juice to play the latest titles.

I have had one problem and that was with the latest whql 185.85 driver for nvidia. I roll back to 185.81 and it's as sweet as a nut(so to speak).

That is just my own personal experience of windows 7. It has progressed in it's development.


See how it would be hard to prove.

Suppose you could always pop over with a hard drive full of music and we'll sit down and have a cuppa while I prove it's progression on MY set up

 

[Snufffed]

Yea buddy,
I have had nothing but problems with nVidia drivers.
The latest released driver (v 185.85) for all OS's (MS) have been full of glitches and problems. I have constantly gone to the nVidia Developers forum asking questions about the bugs and never get an answer from them (the Dev team), only comments from others trying to find the solutions.

It seems to me there are some folks using BETA OS's that forget the WORD Alpha and Beta in reference mean "mostly crap, full of bugs, and MS fixed these on the reverse pyramid scale. One (1) complaint is nothing but when they get like 1 or 2 thousand "same complaints" the pyramid tips and programers start working on a fix ... it takes many many fixes to get them all fixed, and If the problem gets to complex. MS simply sh*t CANS that part. But then you would have to go back to Win95 (codenamed Chicago), or (codenamed Memphis and formerly known as Windows 97), (codenamed Whistler) Windows 98 and Windows 98 moved to Windows 98 SE (second edition), and X2K, scared every body and they had Windows 98 ME (Millenium Edition). to kill the major time-date messup.
Microsoft did cancel Neptune and Odyssey and mixed them into Windows XP. (Codename Longhorn is now Vista) Enough RANT and RAVE, it still is mostly BETA and some ALPHA mix in to keep making $money. You do know that Microsoft is already working on Windows 8 (Alpha).
STOP USING BETA DRIVERS ON BETA OS'S or keep sending in the Reports.

 

[bhuulo]

This is the only OS I'd like to Install again and again,

Xp, vista etc etc will never be acquainted with my computer again.

I agree with RST101...Forget About Vista (Much Bulkier then 7) and XP (old Dated and my HDD is SATA so without SATA Drivers No detection of HDD in XP), So whatever it is but I like it.

 

[RST101]

(and XP (old Dated and my HDD is SATA so without SATA Drivers No detection of HDD in XP), So whatever it is but I like it.[/QUOTE])


To true, I would need 3rd party apps to get the sata system up and running even if I were to consider xp or vista again, *screams*.

 

[Snufffed]

Guys your too hard on Vista. Win7 is nothing more than Vista SP2. with a new name...
I really wonder what the new Windows 8 is like. I can hardly wait to see what it functions like, and other threads, Win7 will RTM in 2009, Mary Jane, Russia & China all give slightly different dates. but for ea it is their
ITForum. so that I can see is why different dates.
I do have my Order placed in China for the US-EN edition of Ultimate Edition.
I have ask for a Sign Edition if possible for the 69.00 price. to set beside my Vista Signed Edition of Ultimate. (un-used)

Even tho I'm still using my Pirated Edition.