Confusion about cloud

[Frank1]

From what I was reading today, the only way to completely save your data is with cloud or something similar The article states that even if you have backups on several external drives, you could lose it in case your house burned down, destructive weather or other destructive ways since everything is on a physical device. What is the difference since even if you store it on the "cloud" or any such way, the data is still stored on something physical that can be destroyed. Apparently there is something that I am not understanding. Could someone clear it up for me?
Thanks, ~Frank~

 

[Layback Bear]

If you have data on a removable drive and keep it in a different location other than where your home or business is then you odds of having it if needed is much better.
Their is always some degree of risk.
A cloud to me is the most risky because once it's in the cloud you have no control of its security.
How many backups and where to store them depends on how valuable the data is to you.
I keep my backups on a separate hard drive and in the house with the computer but unhooked except when using it.
In my case if the house burns down I got more problems than that data.

 

[Frank1]

To be honest, I'm really not comfortable with the Cloud. I have my backups exactly like you. They are on an exterior drive and it's not connected except for backups or restore. I agree with what you said, if the house burns down, I've got bigger problems than the data. Now, of course, if I had a large business with critical data I would think about storing my data elsewhere in a different building. So, I think I'll just keep doing what I'm doing. Thanks for your input.

 

[whs]

For what LB says.

And if you have less than 128GB of data you could get a 128GB flash drive and carry it on your key ring. At least you have that if your house burns down because your keys will be obsolete. :shock:

 

[Frank1]

For what LB says.

And if you have less than 128GB of data you could get a 128GB flash drive and carry it on your key ring. At least you have that if your house burns down because your keys will be obsolete. :shock:

Good point. I now feel more comfortable with the way I am currently doing it. I also create an image every day with Macrium Reflect. I keep five and when I make a new one, I delete the oldest. If my memory serves me correctly, you are the one who posted some good information about it. I am very happy with it using your suggestion of hiding it after it takes a snap shot, I can keep on using my computer for other things.

 

[spencer1]

Some folks keep a copy of their backup in a safe deposit box.

 

[GeneO]

From what I was reading today, the only way to completely save your data is with cloud or something similar The article states that even if you have backups on several external drives, you could lose it in case your house burned down, destructive weather or other destructive ways since everything is on a physical device. What is the difference since even if you store it on the "cloud" or any such way, the data is still stored on something physical that can be destroyed. Apparently there is something that I am not understanding. Could someone clear it up for me?
Thanks, ~Frank~

Depends. Depends on the provider, whether it is a backup or your only copy, and how much you are willing to pay.

Some services, like Amazon S3, can make several copies of your data, at least one at a different location. Some also make a copy to tape, which is more reliable than disk. So you can have some confidence at these sites that your data is pretty secure. S3 you pay for the space, uploading it is free, but downloading it costs.

Then there are other sites that are not that reliable I'm sure. If it is just a backup copy, then you might be OK. But you also have to consider what it would take to get your data back. Does it cost money? Do they have the bandwidth? I have heard horror stories about getting your data back from some "cloud providers".

So you need to do your homework if you are considering this.

 

[whs]

Right, there was one guy that reported that it took him 4 days flat to get his data back. I don;t remember how many GBs he had. Just try to make a daily image to the cloud and you will quickly find out.

 

[Mark Phelps]

I've been around long enough to remember when using "the cloud" really meant accessing a Mainframe computer through a private network. We had no choice back then -- there was no local storage option.

To me, the whole idea of trusting someone else to watch my data for me is just something I don't feel comfortable doing.

There's simply too much opportunity for "cloud" storage to be compromised by disreputable folks.

Storing data on an external drive, and then locking that in a safe or safety deposit box is a much safer option (to me).

 

[whs]

I am not a cloud fan either. Although I have to say that in some form I am using a cloud since years.

For my mail I have always used AOL. All my mail is stored at their site and I can retrieve mail from 6 years ago. They never lost one piece of mail (knock on wood). So that speaks for them.

In addition, I have migrated to many different system during the years including Linux systems and an Android tablet. From any of those I can get to my mail and I do not have to worry about migrating my mail files.

I guess that's the idea of the cloud. The open question is how to find a service as reliable as AOL.

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

...A cloud to me is the most risky because once it's in the cloud you have no control of its security...

Actually, you do have control of your data's security. The most reliable cloud backup services are paid services and those install software on your computer that encrypts your data before it ever leaves your computer and unencrypts it when you retrieve it. The service cannot access your data. If you are really paranoid (not necessarily a bad thing, btw), you can apply your own encryption before the service applies their own encryption.

If you use free cloud storage (which I discourage), you can always use your own encryption software.

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Right, there was one guy that reported that it took him 4 days flat to get his data back. I don;t remember how many GBs he had. Just try to make a daily image to the cloud and you will quickly find out.

The amount of data I have in the cloud would take weeks, if not months, to retrieve. It's my last layer of defense and I'm highly unlikely to ever need to retrieve all of it. I would have to lose my two local backups and the backup in my safe deposit box at my credit union to have to resort to retrieving my cloud data.

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

I am not a cloud fan either. Although I have to say that in some form I am using a cloud since years.

For my mail I have always used AOL. All my mail is stored at their site and I can retrieve mail from 6 years ago. They never lost one piece of mail (knock on wood). So that speaks for them.

In addition, I have migrated to many different system during the years including Linux systems and an Android tablet. From any of those I can get to my mail and I do not have to worry about migrating my mail files.

I guess that's the idea of the cloud. The open question is how to find a service as reliable as AOL.

In order of reliability and expense: Amazon (the commercial service, not the free ones), Carbonite, Crashplan (again, not the free service).

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Keep in mind that any storage media, be it HDDs, the cloud, stone tablets, etc., is subject to failure. The "secret" to avoiding data loss due to media failure is distributed redundancy. Even if you have your data duplicated on multiple HDDs, if those drives are all in the same place, such as your house, they could all be destroyed by fire, flood, etc. or stolen. Having multiple copies in multiple locations reduces the chances all will destroyed or stolen at the same time.

The downside of most offsite backups is they are always out of date. Cloud backups can negate that issue because they can be updated at anytime. The downside is retrieval takes a long time unless you use an expensive business plan. I get around that issue by depending on the HDDs in my safe deposit box for retrieving most of my data and getting the rest from my cloud backup (Carbonite).

 

[Layback Bear]

I wonder if one could email NSA and retrieve data. I hear tell they have one hell of a cloud that stores data.

 

[whs]

I wonder if one could email NSA and retrieve data. I hear tell they have one hell of a cloud that stores data.

That's why there is all that rain and snow. Half of the country is covered by that cloud.

But now a district court judge has ruled that they have to stop. And it may be unconstitutional what they were doing. He has that checked.

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

I wonder if one could email NSA and retrieve data. I hear tell they have one hell of a cloud that stores data.

Dilbert (in the comic strip) got himself in trouble by hacking into NASA to retrieve his data.

 

[Layback Bear]

The judge said it might be going against the 4th amendment. I think what he/she is indicating is he/she would like to see someone challenge NSA in the Federal Supreme Court using the 4th amendment.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Our Constitution was wrote by men who spoke what I call High Affluent English but still wrote the Constitution very simplistic and straight forward so most anybody can understand it.
If you ever get a chance read the Federalist Papers
you will understand that they had the ability to wright the Constitution where only some lawyers could understand it but chose not to.
Warning: The Federalist Papers is very dry reading but has a wealth of information leading up to the creation of our Constitution.

http://thomas.loc.gov/home/histdox/fed_14.html

 

[Double]

I use the cloud daily and have had no problems. I store different stuff in different clouds, that's how I get around. Obviously, retain the financial and personal records (which shouldn't be on your computer anyway), but everything else? Throw it up to the cloud.

I dislike external hard drives because of how stationary and vulnerable they are. If you contracted a virus, then hooked the drive up, the virus can infect the drive.. and vice versa. Uploading to the cloud can prevent reinfection, assuming the system was clean before the files were uploaded.

 

[strollin]

There is more to the cloud than storage, programs or even the OS itself could be cloud based. But since the OP asked about storage, what Lady Fitzgerald said regarding "distributed redundancy" is right on. I'd be willing to bet that whatever Cloud Service you use, they have data backed up in case one of their servers crashed so there is a bit of redundancy built-in there.

A combination of local backup in conjunction with cloud backup should be sufficient for most home users. A company with data critical to the business would probably have multiple backups, in multiple forms, in multiple locations so as to ensure that the data will be safe.