Is there a way to load and run Win7 from D:

[sigma6]

Wow it has taken me a long time to be able to formulate this specific question. I needed to understand the pros and cons of EasyBCD. And Win7 itself. Which is just enough to install, backup and reinstall, and in particular, to move them to another HDD if necessary. A lot of study for relatively a few number of tasks learned...

A part of the difficulty was that I previously ran OS's on C: and then D: in particular, and as a natural progression, I was running Win7 on D: (while XP was on C: ) Apparently, the 'new thinking' is that the OS ALWAYS has to be C: That may be the 'new thinking', but the OPTION to run an OS on the 2nd partition as D: should still be OPTIONAL! But this looks more like politics than anything. The major OS manufacturers in their infinite egos (MS being the leader) couldn't bear the thought of their OS running on D, or E etc, 2nd to another OS! ... (or so it seems)... I have put myself through what amounts to a lot of wasted effort trying to tease out some program or technique that would simply tell Win7 to load and assign itsself D: (and behave!... lol) We know that it IS possible as it will do it after being installed after XP...
And perhaps the answer is in the question... Is that why Win7 did install like that? because it was installed from inside the OS of XP on C:??? Is that part of the answer?

Hmm... if so I wonder if I can recreate an install like that, then copy a saved image afterward, again, that just doesn't sound like an efficient or elegant solution to what should be simple and straightforward... but I no longer underestimate what can go wrong when messing with the wonderful world of boot loaders...

Nonetheless I put this question to the forum... Does anyone have a way of loading a Win7 OS to run on the 2nd partition as D. At this stage it is almost intellectual curiosity. But I would still like to have that option, if I so chose...

 

[TwoCables]

The OS drive is always going to be C: Always. This can't be changed. C: is home.

You can have 4 hard drives, one for XP, one for Vista, one for 7, and one 8, but the drive letter for the OS that you're currently booted into will always be C: no matter what. It doesn't matter what the drive letters are for the other hard drives. For example:

While you're in XP, the XP drive will be C:. You can have Vista drive being D:, 7 being E:, and 8 being F: It doesn't have to be exactly like that either but the XP drive will be C:. The other drives won't be OS drives from within XP. They will just be storage drives and they'll be treated as such from within XP, but this is not specific to just XP, this is just the way it works.

While you're in Vista, the Vista drive will be C:. You can have XP being D:, Windows 8 being E:, and Windows 7 being F:. Again, it doesn't have to be exactly like this, but the Vista drive will be C:. The other drives, again, will just be storage drives and will be treated as such from within Vista.

So then when you're in 7, the 7 drive will be C:. You can have Windows 8 being on D:, Vista being on E:, and XP being on F:. It doesn't matter. You might have noticed that I didn't put these in the same order but instead I said 8 first, 7 second, and XP last just to show how unimportant it is which drive gets which letter from within the OS you're booted into because again, they'll just be treated as storage drives from within Windows 7 because in this example, you're sitting in Windows 7 just like how before in the other examples you were in XP and then in Vista.

So, it's the same with Windows 8. The Windows 8 drive will be C: from within Windows 8 just like the others, and the other drives will get whatever drive letters that Windows 8 assigns them just like like XP, Vista and 7 will do. This isn't limited to just XP, Vista, 7 and 8 though: this is just they it works.

Therefore, the C: drive is always going to be the drive letter of the OS that you're currently booted into. It doesn't matter what drive letters are assigned to the other drives: they might not even have those same drive letters from within the other operating systems, nor do they have to because the different installations of your operating systems are not depending on each other or talking to each other or anything like that. They're completely independent from one another.

So let's say that you have two hard drives: a Western Digital hard drive, and a Seagate. Let's say that you install Windows 7 to the Western Digital drive. From within that installation of Windows 7, the Western Digital drive will be C: and the Seagate will be D:. Now let's say that you install Windows XP, or Vista, or 8 or something to the Seagate (or even another copy of Windows 7). When you boot into that installation of Windows on the Seagate, the Seagate will be C: and the Western Digital will be D:. That's just the way it works.

 

[gregrocker]

Having Win7 engineered to always be on C when correctly installed from boot is done mainly to avoid issues with some programs that expect to be on C, and a few other issues that sometimes don't even announce themselves but just cause problems.

For that reason it's best to accept this convenience which is hardly some plot but genius applied in our interest.

If you want WIn7 on D for some reason then try installing it from an extant OS. This will normally force it onto the next available letter so I would clear D in advance so it's ready and waiting: Drive Letter - Add, Change, or Remove in Windows 7 - Windows 7 Forums

However this may have changed as I haven't seen the complaint about installing to another letter from C for quite a while, so perhaps this was changed in SP1.

 

[sigma6]

The OS drive is always going to be C: Always. This can't be changed. C: is home.

You can have 4 hard drives, one for XP, one for Vista, one for 7, and one 8, but the drive letter for the OS that you're currently booted into will always be C: no matter what. It doesn't matter what the drive letters are for the other hard drives. For example:...

When you boot into that installation of Windows on the Seagate, the Seagate will be C: and the Western Digital will be D:. That's just the way it works.

Thanks for speedy responses. Right, I get the zeitgeist on OS etiquette TwoCables, and I agree that it does make technical sense in a lot of regards as well, sure. As I was trying to point out, I get that... but that doesn't discount the fact I have a Dual boot system, with XP on C and Win7 on D: and it runs flawlessly... and has for years. The OS Gods have not struck my system down with lightning and I suffer no ill consequences as a result. This should tell us something. That it is not only a possibility, but it is a functional alternative. I can vouch for that from realtime experience.

I never messed with Linux, or Ubuntu, etc. and always installed additional MS OSs as they came out... so I never had to even look at "Bootloading" methodology (for lack of a better term), that totally went under my radar. But hey, welcome to the brave new world (lol)

I now have a system set up according to the "principle" of "C drive as center of universe" and it's OK, and I will probably build future systems similar. (the MS mantra, if you can't beat them, join them...)

Anyhow... It's just when I tweak my systems, I put so many countless hours into them, each one takes a character of their own, etc... so I hate dumping them all the time, and starting from scratch, it defeats the purpose... And it doesn't explain why there isn't a super simple software that can be used to set ANY OS to run in ANY configuration WE might want... (outside social conditioning 'imperatives') That still begs the question....

So I do think that some kind of decision was made that makes all OS vendors happy... the above doesn't negate this possibility. And the very absence of such utilities ... by their conspicuous absence, (it would not have been difficult to add the function into Easy BCD, I am still stunned at its absence) still it beggers the question in my mind... i.e. we (or at least I) know it IS possible and functional and practical. So what is the big deal? Same deal with creating an entire HDD as a logical drive. Who says that it doesn't have a practical use. Why TAKE AWAY the option to create it if WE SO CHOOSE... ??? (which they have in Win7...) There is a principle here, as well as a technical argument... and this principle is nothing new...


I can't believe I am so unique as being the only person on the planet that wants to run Win7 as D drive. And even if I was, the fact that it is builit into Win7 to run on D: when it has to follow the "no violate other OS's" principle, clearly shows they are well aware and able to do this when they HAVE TO...

But they don't want YOU to make that DECISION... oh no, and to make sure, YOU WILL FIND NO program, no utility, we will even condition the masses to believe that it just isn't so... It has become an occult practice... (lol) from the original latin meaning of the latin word "occult" (which simply means hidden) Take nothing for granted, question everything... you'd be amazed at what falls in your lap...

 

[TwoCables]

The OS drive is always going to be C: Always. This can't be changed. C: is home.

You can have 4 hard drives, one for XP, one for Vista, one for 7, and one 8, but the drive letter for the OS that you're currently booted into will always be C: no matter what. It doesn't matter what the drive letters are for the other hard drives. For example:...

When you boot into that installation of Windows on the Seagate, the Seagate will be C: and the Western Digital will be D:. That's just the way it works.

Thanks for speedy responses. Right, I get the zeitgeist on OS etiquette TwoCables, and I agree that it does make technical sense in a lot of regards as well, sure. As I was trying to point out, I get that... but that doesn't discount the fact I have a Dual boot system, with XP on C and Win7 on D: and it runs flawlessly... and has for years. The OS Gods have not struck my system down with lightning and I suffer no ill consequences as a result. This should tell us something. That it is not only a possibility, but it is a functional alternative. I can vouch for that from realtime experience.

I never messed with Linux, or Ubuntu, etc. and always installed additional MS OSs as they came out... so I never had to even look at "Bootloading" methodology (for lack of a better term), that totally went under my radar. But hey, welcome to the brave new world (lol)

I now have a system set up according to the "principle" of "C drive as center of universe" and it's OK, and I will probably build future systems similar. (the MS mantra, if you can't beat them, join them...)

Anyhow... It's just when I tweak my systems, I put so many countless hours into them, each one takes a character of their own, etc... so I hate dumping them all the time, and starting from scratch, it defeats the purpose... And it doesn't explain why there isn't a super simple software that can be used to set ANY OS to run in ANY configuration WE might want... (outside social conditioning 'imperatives') That still begs the question....

So I do think that some kind of decision was made that makes all OS vendors happy... the above doesn't negate this possibility. And the very absence of such utilities ... by their conspicuous absence, (it would not have been difficult to add the function into Easy BCD, I am still stunned at its absence) still it beggers the question in my mind... i.e. we (or at least I) know it IS possible and functional and practical. So what is the big deal. I can't believe I am so unique as being the only person on the planet that wants to run Win7 as D drive. And even if I was, the fact that it is builit into Win7 to run on D: when it has to follow the "no violate other OS's" principle, clearly shows they are well aware and able to do this when they HAVE TO...

But they don't want YOU to make that DECISION... oh no, and to make sure, YOU WILL FIND NO program, no utility, we will even condition the masses to believe that it just isn't so... It has become an occult practice... (lol) from the original latin meaning of "occult" (which simply means hidden)

When you're in Windows 7, is the C: drive the OS drive for Windows 7? Or is it D:?

 

[sigma6]

The OS drive is always going to be C: Always. This can't be changed. C: is home.

When you're in Windows 7, is the C: drive the OS drive for Windows 7? Or is it D:?

Ahh, there it is... yes, as surprising as it must sound to you (from your question)... but yes, of course it boots Win7 and runs on D: of course... (in my world... lol)

That is my point, there IS a principle there... MS isn't going to violate the "do not violate other OSs" principle, (it's not that in your face... lol) So yes it automatically installed Win7 on the 2nd partition (I had prepared) and to run as D: ...it had to, just in case...

It had to because MS can't predict all the possible contingencies of the previous OS and its' arrangement on a multi partitioned HD, which I am sure is also quite common these days... ie. it had to err on the side of caution, or "do the least amount of reconfigging the existing 'system' " from which it was installed from...

Anyone who naturally progressed from WinXP to the additional installation of Win7 on another partition would have this setup (I imagine, unless there was a Win7 update I missed...) thanks for your question...

 

[sigma6]

Having Win7 engineered to always be on C when correctly installed from boot is done mainly to avoid issues with some programs that expect to be on C, and a few other issues that sometimes don't even announce themselves but just cause problems.

For that reason it's best to accept this convenience which is hardly some plot but genius applied in our interest.

If you want WIn7 on D for some reason then try installing it from an extant OS. This will normally force it onto the next available letter so I would clear D in advance so it's ready and waiting: Drive Letter - Add, Change, or Remove in Windows 7 - Windows 7 Forums

However this may have changed as I haven't seen the complaint about installing to another letter from C for quite a while, so perhaps this was changed in SP1.

Thanks for this insight Greg... this is confirmation, of my continual ongoing contemplation on this issue. (still haven't got to the bottom yet of what I originally looked at as an "anomaly" (lol) from my "old Win9x to XP" point of view...) That seems to be it, the context of running it from inside another OS... They had to leave us that much... I will look into that... that may be the only way to configure the boot setup and then re-install my old back up image over it afterward... (the inelegant solution...)

The only reason I want it is my last system is set up that way... and I want to maintain the ability to upgrade it to a new HDD if necessary... Otherwise I am sure (now looking at this new "OS understanding") it is not worth the candle. But for now I still have it, and it still runs perfectly and I still like running XP on occasion... for example, I still like to create the occasional HDD as a full logical drive for pure storage purposes, and little things like that... )

And let's face it, we all like to have as much control over our systems as we can get... it's just the nature of the beast...

 

[TwoCables]

So when you are sitting in Windows 7, the drive listed as C: is the one that has XP on it and so your C: drive while in Windows 7 is your storage drive?

 

[AddRAM]

In your universe, you can call the partition any letter you want. But if it`s not C, then it`s just wrong.

As Greg states, whatever OS you`re in should be C. And that`s where it ends, There is no reason to install an OS to another partition while you`re in windows. Unless you`re using a Virtual Machine.

 

[TwoCables]

Yeah, I'd like to see screenshots from within both XP and 7.

 

[sigma6]

So when you are sitting in Windows 7, the drive listed as C: is the one that has XP on it and so your C: drive while in Windows 7 is your storage drive?

Not quite sure what you asking there, but I think I made it clear... I must have missed all the MS media programming... lol... But my drives don't move around and reconfigure themselves 1st part stays as C, and the 2nd part stays as D, and the third part stays as E. All the way to L: (several dedicated storage partitions) It was originally partitioned in XP so it was only one primary. During my testing I eventually switched it over to 3 primaries just to see what it would be like (no biggie) but of course it will follow different rules when assigning drives if I introduce another OS no doubt...

My other system, I eventually just rebuilt Win7 on C and shifted XP to D: once I could predict it's behaviour... It did work out by chance that I could still use my XP because, low and behold, even though I shifted it to D: it would boot up and start as C, assign D to the reserved partition and keep my crucial E (OS specific data drive) stationary.... all the other partitions are arbitrary, but not E... so that was a just a fluke of luck that XP insists on assigning the reserved partition as D: wonky, inelegant, and something I had no control over, but got the job done,

 

[gregrocker]

Always keep no drive letter on System Reserved from all OS's Disk Mgmt, for many important reasons: Drive Letter - Add, Change, or Remove in Windows 7 - Windows 7 Forums

We will be able to know much better what you've got if we can see a screenshot of
Disk Management - Post a Screen Capture Image - Windows 7 Help Forums

 

[TwoCables]

So when you are sitting in Windows 7, the drive listed as C: is the one that has XP on it and so your C: drive while in Windows 7 is your storage drive?

Not quite sure what you asking there, but I think I made it clear... I must have missed all the MS media programming... lol... But my drives don't move around and reconfigure themselves 1st part stays as C, and the 2nd part stays as D, and the third part stays as E. All the way to L: (several dedicated storage partitions) It was originally partitioned in XP so it was only one primary. During my testing I eventually switched it over to 3 primaries just to see what it would be like (no biggie) but of course it will follow different rules when assigning drives if I introduce another OS no doubt...

My other system, I eventually just rebuilt Win7 on C and shifted XP to D: once I could predict it's behaviour... It did work out by chance that I could still use my XP because, low and behold, even though I shifted it to D: it would boot up and start as C, assign D to the reserved partition and keep my crucial E (OS specific data drive) stationary.... all the other partitions are arbitrary, but not E... so that was a just a fluke of luck that XP insists on assigning the reserved partition as D: wonky, inelegant, and something I had no control over, but got the job done,

When you are booted to Windows XP, is your C: drive for Windows XP? Is your D: drive while you are in Windows XP for Windows 7?

When you are booted to Windows 7, is your C: drive in Windows 7 for Windows 7? Is your D: drive while you are in Windows 7 for Windows XP? Or, is it the other way around?

To make this easier, take a screenshot of My Computer while you're in Windows XP and take another screenshot of My Computer while you're in Windows 7 and post both of these screenshots.

Regarding my question about the storage drive: while you are in Windows XP, the drive that has Windows 7 on it is being treated by Windows XP as your storage drive because you're in Windows XP. While you're in Windows 7, the drive that has XP on it is being treated by Windows 7 as your storage drive. Therefore, it doesn't matter to the installation of Windows that you're booted to what's on your other drive.

My other system, I eventually just rebuilt Win7 on C and shifted XP to D: once I could predict it's behaviour... It did work out by chance that I could still use my XP because, low and behold, even though I shifted it to D: it would boot up and start as C, assign D to the reserved partition and keep my crucial E (OS specific data drive) stationary.... all the other partitions are arbitrary, but not E... so that was a just a fluke of luck that XP insists on assigning the reserved partition as D: wonky, inelegant, and something I had no control over, but got the job done,

This is partly what I was asking! You see, you just said it yourself: when you go into Windows XP, the drive that XP is on is the C: drive. As I said, regardless of which OS you're in, the OS drive is always going to be the C: drive. Yes, you moved XP to the D: drive while you were in Windows 7, but that does not mean that your XP drive will be the D: drive while you're in XP.

 

[sigma6]

In your universe, you can call the partition any letter you want. But if it`s not C, then it`s just wrong.

As Greg states, whatever OS you`re in should be C. And that`s where it ends, There is no reason to install an OS to another partition while you`re in windows. Unless you`re using a Virtual Machine.

says who?... why deny the reality? or the existing option?... when I have an idea in my head and an external observation that goes beyond it, I have two choices, crawl back into my preconceived notion or expand awareness of a new concept... don't mistake thoughts in your head in favour of external reality... mistaking the roadmap for the road... then again everyone is free to conform their thinking according to the whim of another, if that is their comfort zone ...I would rather seek the possibilities and potentials of my environment... (enough philosophy for one day...)

to repeat there is some logic in it, but it isn't the be all and end all... and obviously isn't the only way to skin this cat, but I can see a lot of resistance to what I thought was a simple enough idea... I haven't taken any MCSE's in a looong time... makes me wonder what they are putting in those books these days...

 

[gregrocker]

We are not company guys, Sigma. We're Windows 7 guys, only interested in what works best with Win7. MS doesn't seem to even want the OS any more.

Along the way since beta we've become the top tech forums on the web for Win7 surpassing all others put together.

We're always interested in alternative ideas, but also are going to emphasize Best Practices because most of them for Win7 were developed here.

If you'd like Win7 on D then I'd reinstall or run a test install from XP on C to see if it still will block the letter to force Win7 onto the next available letter. For several years we had complaints that it did this, but I haven't seen many lately.

 

[sigma6]

Always keep no drive letter on System Reserved from all OS's Disk Mgmt, for many important reasons: Drive Letter - Add, Change, or Remove in Windows 7 - Windows 7 Forums

We will be able to know much better what you've got if we can see a screenshot of
Disk Management - Post a Screen Capture Image - Windows 7 Help Forums

OK, I will show you my "miracle set up" (lol) but just to respond... that's just it, when XP booted up (note: to avoid confusion, we are talking about the system where I have re-installed Win7 on C: and shifted XP to D: ...)

But when I boot into D: it does assign itself as C: and when I saw it had assigned the system reserved as D: I was not happy, I don't really like the system doing it's own thing like that... anyhow, I couldn't change it once it booted because it's a system partition... and it did keep my E aligned so I just accepted it... and called it a day...

 

[TwoCables]

Ultimately, I just want to see two screenshots:

1. One of My Computer while you are booted to Windows XP
2. One of My Computer while you are booted to Windows 7

 

[TwoCables]

Always keep no drive letter on System Reserved from all OS's Disk Mgmt, for many important reasons: Drive Letter - Add, Change, or Remove in Windows 7 - Windows 7 Forums

We will be able to know much better what you've got if we can see a screenshot of
Disk Management - Post a Screen Capture Image - Windows 7 Help Forums

OK, I will show you my "miracle set up" (lol) but just to respond... that's just it, when XP booted up (note: to avoid confusion, we are talking about the system where I have re-installed Win7 on C: and shifted XP to D: ...)

But when I boot into D: it does assign itself as C: and when I saw it had assigned the system reserved as D: I was not happy, I don't really like the system doing it's own thing like that... anyhow, I couldn't change it once it booted because it's a system partition... and it did keep my E aligned so I just accepted it... and called it a day...

It will always be C. Always. You could create a Z drive, move it to the Z drive and it will still have the exact same thing as you're seeing now: System Reserved on D and that E drive. This is because Windows XP is doing its thing independently of Windows 7, and Windows 7 is doing its thing independently of Windows XP. Windows XP did not (and does not) know that you moved it to the D: drive while you were in Windows 7.

 

[sigma6]

We are not company guys, Sigma. We're Windows 7 guys, only interested in what works best with Win7. MS doesn't seem to even want the OS any more.

Along the way since beta we've become the top tech forums on the web for Win7 surpassing all others put together.

We're always interested in alternative ideas, but also are going to emphasize Best Practices because most of them for Win7 were developed here.

If you'd like Win7 on D then I'd reinstall or run a test install from XP on C to see if it will any longer block the letter to force Win7 onto the next available letter. For several years we had complaints that it did this, but I haven't heard many lately and recently installed from Win7 on C and had the new install take C too when it restarted.

Not knocking you guys (in that sense) I didn't know that about MS and Windows 7, that is very interesting (would like to hear more of the story on that one...) and I do like Windows 7, (now that I have figured this cloning issue) I am just old and jaded, and haven't taken an MCSE for over 10 years... (lol) So I do appreciate this forum because it gave me what I needed to get up to "operating speed" again... kudos (been sitting on my techy laurels too long...lol) so I am learning it and appreciating it more and more as I go along.... It was just a rude awakening when doing something as simple as cloning an OS partition from one HDD to another HDD turned into what it did... not very sporting of them imo...

and I would pity the guy who is starting cold, trying to learn this OS's technical peculiarities... and I do like Win7, the more I play with it, I like how it seems they went back and brought together a lot of the good stuff from previous systems and integrated it into an overall OS, like giving us more accessible command prompt tools... And if you read my prior post, I clearly haven't denied the possibility that this is a "best practice"... (especially unless you are a masochist there isn't really any other option!)

I fell into this thought process, because of a real and technical existing NEED. And we all know the mantra, if it can happen once... well, it's on the board, it counts for analysis... so maybe in the long term this will be good for my MS Windows karma, I just wasn't planning on taking a MS Win7 "immersion course summer camp" like I have for the last few weeks (lol)

But also if you are following carefully what I am saying it has merit... I too have followed MS for years since it's inception, since reading the article about Bill Gates in Time magazine when he was still a wunderkind (and spoilt rich kid, from a third generation family of lawyers, whose Doctor actually advised his mother that she should let him do whatever he wants!! (oh yeah!...) but that is another story...) to the ruthless competitor stories (he was dirty as they come) and his eventual ensnarement to the government during his DOJ antitrust laws. It's no coincidence that Vista was shoved down our throats as the "result" of that deal... another story... (I wonder if anyone knows where I mean by that one...?) It has ALWAYS been about control... since day one...

Anyhow, yes I think this forum is a treasure trove of Win7 "know how" (knock on wood) an oasis. but man, if you have been following my posts. You know that what I am saying here has validity... I DO think it makes sense to install it on C (after what I just went through) but MS is one of the most manipulative and controlling entities on this planet, not including the government itself... I never, ever underestimate them or their politics... they have built an empire on the same principles as the Romans did (all roads lead to Rome... haha)

It is good for the younglings to know the true history too... Sometimes that is a better explanation than all the technical mumbo jumbo, why certain things are the way they are... politics and economic warfare played huge on this company that once sold the most mediocre OS on the most mediocre hardware platform of the bunch, that was originated from Q-DOS (remember that story?) Lets not forget MS's 'humble' beginnings and Bill Gate's war on open source software (that still rages today) and that's just the tip of the iceberg... Philanthropist (my arse...) he's now the biggest shareholder of Blackwater (renamed for obvious reasons) and promoting sterilizing the third world with vaccines... that's the Bill Gates I know...

 

[SIW2]

I have been doing it for years.

1) Either run the installer from your existing installation - then it will assign itself the next available letter .

2) Or - if you are geeky, you can fix the osletter immediately after applying the image - that involves fiddling with the registry, so best use option 1.

I have often used X as the os letter.