Am I doing something Wrong?

I shut it down at night and when the box is off and the monitor show it's off, then I turn the UPS off.
Turning it off doesn't protect you from electrical surges unless you unplug from the outlet… and if you're going to do that... why have a UPS, or surge protector in the first place.
If you turn the surge suppressor off, doesn't that disconnect the line voltage from the surge protection circuits and the outlet strip? I hear but I readily confused.
My question is why??? Would you want to turn it off??? This defeats the purpose of having one in the first place!

Here's the other side of the coin.... If the surge protector/UPS is STILL plugged into the outlet, and even though it's turned off, and you have a huge electrical surge, say lightning strike, are the items connected to the surge protector still protected? I think not! But….that would depend on the rating of the UPS/Surge Protector.

My point... even though the surge protector/UPS is "turned off", it STILL doesn't mean you're protected from an electrical surge if it's STILL plugged into the outlet, thus turning it off it useless. You have more protection leaving it on!!!

Have a look at these….
HowStuffWorks "Surge Protector Ratings"
How UPS Devices Work - Types of uninterruptible power sources - Softpedia

Good luck.

Howdy sygnus21,
Thank you for the links. The more I know the more dangerous I become :devil:
Appreciate your time.
glennc
 

My Computer

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PC/Desktop
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Self-Built
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Windows 7 Ultimate
CPU
AMD Phenom-II X4 965
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8192 MB DDR2-SDRAM
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LG Electronics W1943
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C: 500 GB Caviar Black SATA
E: 500 GB Caviar Black SATA
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Ultra LSP 750
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Ultra XBlaster
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2 Fans, CPU Fan, PS Fan
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Acer
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Logitech
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6 MB

What an excellent explanation for the uninitiated. I appreciate it, very much. So I need to keep in mind when three years are up. Do you know of any software that would test the battery beyond what is included in the APC software. I don't have any tests at all.
All tests are done in hardware. Software never tests anything. Software can only talk to and read hardware that must first exist.

Your best test (without $20 or $2000 test equipments - and yes even $20 test device would answer). Power up the computer and peripherals. Yank the UPS power cord from the wall. How long does the UPS operate? As usual, the only useful answers come with a number - this time in minutes.

That ten second startup test is doing same thing. But too short to have a useful answer. That start up test is not monitoring AC line stability. It is testing the battery as fast as possible.

Now, does not matter whether the UPS is on or off. The same tiny surge protector circuit remains connected.

Meanwhile, with the UPS on or off, appliances are still connected directly to AC mains. The protector circuit is as tiny and unproductive as possible – and still declares surge protection in its sales brochure.

Nothing sits between the appliance and AC mains. Nothing between AC mains and appliance to stops a destructive surge – despite so many myths that say otherwise.

When powered off, a power strip protector inside the UPS remains connected to AC mains.

sygnus21 - that HowStuffWorks citation is chock full of obvious electrical lies. So many lies that long posts only discuss the lies on the first pages. HowStuffWorks is a first indication that one has near zero electrical knowledge. Needs to learn some first semester electrical concepts. Is easily deceived by hearsay. HowStuffWorks was one cited in a Wikipedia article on surge protection. Then was removed for being bogus. There is no polite way around a reality that obscene. One must have insufficient electrical knowledge to think that HowStuffWorks citation is honest.

 

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Thanks, though you did agree with most of what I said ;)
 

My Computer

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Howdy westom,
That makes perfect sense. We agree about the proper solution for total surge protection. You keep me on my toes. Thanks for adding to the discussion.
glennc
 

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CPU
AMD Phenom-II X4 965
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Memory
8192 MB DDR2-SDRAM
Graphics Card(s)
ATI Radeon HD 4200
Sound Card
ATI Radeon HD 4200 High Definition Audo
Monitor(s) Displays
LG Electronics W1943
Screen Resolution
1360 X 768
Hard Drives
C: 500 GB Caviar Black SATA
E: 500 GB Caviar Black SATA
PSU
Ultra LSP 750
Case
Ultra XBlaster
Cooling
2 Fans, CPU Fan, PS Fan
Keyboard
Acer
Mouse
Logitech
Internet Speed
6 MB
With regards to your question, I cannot stress adding a surge protector to your UPS is wrong, and as a matter of fact in the manuals, this is mentioned also not to plug a surge protector to the UPS.
I can only tell you what I think, it's up to you now to make your own choice if you want to plug in a surge protector to your UPS.
Good luck my friend:)
Odd. My manual makes no mention of any issues plugging a surge protector into one of the UPS outlets, but it does definitely say that you shouldn't use one to feed the UPS. That is an absolute no-no, because the UPS loses its' response time in a brownout or fail condition, rendering the UPS moot.

I'm curious now. I'll have to do some research to make sure that I'm not giving bad advice here. So Glennc, for now, ignore my advice until I can verify this with my UPS manufacturer and another engineer.

Cheers.
 

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Mellon Labs (custom build)
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Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
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AMD FX 8350 Vishera @ 4200
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ASUS M5A97 R2.0
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16 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3-2400 @ 1866 (9-10-10-10-31)
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XFX Radeon R9 280 Double D Black Edition
Sound Card
Realtek HD Audio on MB. Sounds great.
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Acer 24", Acer 22"
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1 x Mushkin Chronos 120 GB SSD (Win 10)
1 x Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB SSD (Win 7)
1 x WD 1TB SATA Blue
1 x WD 1TB SATA Green
PSU
Corsair TX-750
Case
CoolerMaster HAF 912+
Cooling
Coolermaster Seidon 240M Liquid AIO. 6 case fans
Keyboard
Logitech G710+
Mouse
Logitech G500s
Internet Speed
Much better since I got fiber, but still way overpriced.
Antivirus
MSE, Malware Bytes for scanning
Browser
Firefox
Other Info
Corsair VOID USB headphones.

A Mellon Labs X-1 - LCD Smartie driven system status display.

Brought to you by the letter E
sygnus21 - that HowStuffWorks citation is chock full of obvious electrical lies. So many lies that long posts only discuss the lies on the first pages. HowStuffWorks is a first indication that one has near zero electrical knowledge. Needs to learn some first semester electrical concepts. Is easily deceived by hearsay. HowStuffWorks was one cited in a Wikipedia article on surge protection. Then was removed for being bogus. There is no polite way around a reality that obscene. One must have insufficient electrical knowledge to think that HowStuffWorks citation is honest.
Sorry, but I'm having a real hard time finding any "obvious electrical lies" in the links that sygnus21 posted, and I have sufficient electrical knowledge. The information he gave, and the comments in his post are spot on, and I would rep him if I could.

The HowStuffWorks article that was linked does a pretty good job of explaining how surge protection works in layman's terms. It is talking about the lower end of available surge protection, and I suspect the article is a couple of years old. Newer technology is available which is a little more efficient, and there are some companies making surge protectors with better specs, and at lower prices.

On the topic of learning "some first semester electrical concepts", you could use a little study yourself. Once again, armed with a boatload of misinformation, you are hijacking a thread and using your own personal bias to try to mislead the OP, and to try to discredit some sensible, credible advice given by others, and by your comments, insulting everyone by implying that they are stupid and lack knowledge.

Your facts and electrical knowledge are suspect sir, and anyone reading them should take them with a grain of salt, because you clearly do NOT have the knowledge on this issue that some of the rest of the posters in this thread do.

[/Thread]
 

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Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
CPU
AMD FX 8350 Vishera @ 4200
Motherboard
ASUS M5A97 R2.0
Memory
16 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3-2400 @ 1866 (9-10-10-10-31)
Graphics Card(s)
XFX Radeon R9 280 Double D Black Edition
Sound Card
Realtek HD Audio on MB. Sounds great.
Monitor(s) Displays
Acer 24", Acer 22"
Screen Resolution
3840 x 1080
Hard Drives
1 x Mushkin Chronos 120 GB SSD (Win 10)
1 x Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB SSD (Win 7)
1 x WD 1TB SATA Blue
1 x WD 1TB SATA Green
PSU
Corsair TX-750
Case
CoolerMaster HAF 912+
Cooling
Coolermaster Seidon 240M Liquid AIO. 6 case fans
Keyboard
Logitech G710+
Mouse
Logitech G500s
Internet Speed
Much better since I got fiber, but still way overpriced.
Antivirus
MSE, Malware Bytes for scanning
Browser
Firefox
Other Info
Corsair VOID USB headphones.

A Mellon Labs X-1 - LCD Smartie driven system status display.

Brought to you by the letter E
I figured I'd let the posts speak for themselves ;)


Peace :cool:
 

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PC/Desktop
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Custom built by me.
OS
Windows 10 Pro
CPU
Intel Core i7-4770K (3.5Ghz)
Motherboard
Gigabyte G1 Sniper 5 (F10 Bios)
Memory
32 gig Corsair Dominator Platinum (4x8Gig)
Graphics Card(s)
Sapphire Tri-X R9 Fury
Sound Card
Soundblaster ZXR
Monitor(s) Displays
NEC PA242W 24" LCD Monitor
Screen Resolution
1920 x 1200
Hard Drives
Primary - Samsung 850 Pro (512gig), Samsung 840 Pro (256gig), 2TB WD Caviar Black.
PSU
EVGA Supernova 1000 G2
Case
Cooler Master HAF X
Cooling
Corsair H100i with Corsair Air Series SP120 Quiet Fans
Keyboard
Logitech Wireless Wave
Mouse
Logitech Performance MX
Internet Speed
High Speed Cable
Antivirus
Norton Security
Browser
IE11
Other Info
Memory Timings - 1866MHz @ 9-9-9-27-1T @ 1.5 volts
I figured I'd let the posts speak for themselves ;)


Peace :cool:
I got tired of his BS and reported him. Misleading people just isn't right.
 

My Computer

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Mellon Labs (custom build)
OS
Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
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AMD FX 8350 Vishera @ 4200
Motherboard
ASUS M5A97 R2.0
Memory
16 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3-2400 @ 1866 (9-10-10-10-31)
Graphics Card(s)
XFX Radeon R9 280 Double D Black Edition
Sound Card
Realtek HD Audio on MB. Sounds great.
Monitor(s) Displays
Acer 24", Acer 22"
Screen Resolution
3840 x 1080
Hard Drives
1 x Mushkin Chronos 120 GB SSD (Win 10)
1 x Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB SSD (Win 7)
1 x WD 1TB SATA Blue
1 x WD 1TB SATA Green
PSU
Corsair TX-750
Case
CoolerMaster HAF 912+
Cooling
Coolermaster Seidon 240M Liquid AIO. 6 case fans
Keyboard
Logitech G710+
Mouse
Logitech G500s
Internet Speed
Much better since I got fiber, but still way overpriced.
Antivirus
MSE, Malware Bytes for scanning
Browser
Firefox
Other Info
Corsair VOID USB headphones.

A Mellon Labs X-1 - LCD Smartie driven system status display.

Brought to you by the letter E
Sometime it's better to just let the record (posts) speak for themselves. Let's just move on.
 

My Computer

Computer type
PC/Desktop
Computer Manufacturer/Model Number
Custom built by me.
OS
Windows 10 Pro
CPU
Intel Core i7-4770K (3.5Ghz)
Motherboard
Gigabyte G1 Sniper 5 (F10 Bios)
Memory
32 gig Corsair Dominator Platinum (4x8Gig)
Graphics Card(s)
Sapphire Tri-X R9 Fury
Sound Card
Soundblaster ZXR
Monitor(s) Displays
NEC PA242W 24" LCD Monitor
Screen Resolution
1920 x 1200
Hard Drives
Primary - Samsung 850 Pro (512gig), Samsung 840 Pro (256gig), 2TB WD Caviar Black.
PSU
EVGA Supernova 1000 G2
Case
Cooler Master HAF X
Cooling
Corsair H100i with Corsair Air Series SP120 Quiet Fans
Keyboard
Logitech Wireless Wave
Mouse
Logitech Performance MX
Internet Speed
High Speed Cable
Antivirus
Norton Security
Browser
IE11
Other Info
Memory Timings - 1866MHz @ 9-9-9-27-1T @ 1.5 volts
Sometime it's better to just let the record (posts) speak for themselves. Let's just move on.
Agreed. Enough from me on this one.

Onward...
 

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Mellon Labs (custom build)
OS
Win 7 Pro x64/Win 10 Pro x64 dual boot
CPU
AMD FX 8350 Vishera @ 4200
Motherboard
ASUS M5A97 R2.0
Memory
16 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3-2400 @ 1866 (9-10-10-10-31)
Graphics Card(s)
XFX Radeon R9 280 Double D Black Edition
Sound Card
Realtek HD Audio on MB. Sounds great.
Monitor(s) Displays
Acer 24", Acer 22"
Screen Resolution
3840 x 1080
Hard Drives
1 x Mushkin Chronos 120 GB SSD (Win 10)
1 x Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB SSD (Win 7)
1 x WD 1TB SATA Blue
1 x WD 1TB SATA Green
PSU
Corsair TX-750
Case
CoolerMaster HAF 912+
Cooling
Coolermaster Seidon 240M Liquid AIO. 6 case fans
Keyboard
Logitech G710+
Mouse
Logitech G500s
Internet Speed
Much better since I got fiber, but still way overpriced.
Antivirus
MSE, Malware Bytes for scanning
Browser
Firefox
Other Info
Corsair VOID USB headphones.

A Mellon Labs X-1 - LCD Smartie driven system status display.

Brought to you by the letter E
Well, to all and including the differences of opinion, I think I have come to the answers I wanted to find out about. Differences make the world go round. I certainly didn't wish to create havoc. Thanks once again to all those who shared their opinions based on their understandings of the issues. I have learned a lot and feel more confident with the UPS and how to use it properly. Good stuff.
glennc
 

My Computer

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PC/Desktop
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Self-Built
OS
Windows 7 Ultimate
CPU
AMD Phenom-II X4 965
Motherboard
Gigabyte GA-MA785GM-US2H
Memory
8192 MB DDR2-SDRAM
Graphics Card(s)
ATI Radeon HD 4200
Sound Card
ATI Radeon HD 4200 High Definition Audo
Monitor(s) Displays
LG Electronics W1943
Screen Resolution
1360 X 768
Hard Drives
C: 500 GB Caviar Black SATA
E: 500 GB Caviar Black SATA
PSU
Ultra LSP 750
Case
Ultra XBlaster
Cooling
2 Fans, CPU Fan, PS Fan
Keyboard
Acer
Mouse
Logitech
Internet Speed
6 MB
The HowStuffWorks article that was linked does a pretty good job of explaining how surge protection works in layman's terms. It is talking about the lower end of available surge protection, and I suspect the article is a couple of years old.
Two types of protectors exist. Protectors that connect surges harmlessly to earth - energy not inside the building. That protect from the few surges that cause damage - ie direct lightning strikes. Another is a $3 power strip with ten cent protector parts selling for $25 or $150 - a profit center.

Posted back in Aug 2002 is a description of that HowStuffWorks article that was even removed as a citation in Wikipedia for being bogus.

From HowStuffWorks:
> A more common cause of power surges is the operation of high-power
> electrical devices, such as elevators, air conditioners and refrigerators.

If refrigerators and air conditioners were creating destructive
surges, then all would be trooping daily to hardware stores to replace
damaged dimmer switches, electronic timers switches, X-10 remote
controllers, and touch on-off lamps. Surges created by refrigerators,
et al are urban myth because you don't replace those other appliances
daily.

Furthermore if refrigerators, et al created those surges, then surge protectors must be installed in those surge creating appliances - not on every other appliance.

If refrigerators created those voltages in excess of 330 volts (as clearly listed on surge protector boxes), then we must remove those appliances as a threat to human life. We don't remove those appliances because they don't create 'urban myth' surges.

MOVs have limited life expectancy as defined by joules. If refrigerators and air conditioners were creating destructive surges, then those plug-in surge protectors would be degraded in weeks or months without any indication of failure. What good is a $50 surge protector that must be replaced every month? Ineffective.

In summary, HowStuffWorks on surge protectors has numerous technical errors. It begins accurately, but then makes serious errors. It preaches what plug-in surge protectors promote rather than the principles of surge protection proven in the 1930s. The author probably did not have sufficient knowledge to see through half truths of his information source - plug-in protector manufacturers. Therefore HowStuffWorks is riddled with errors and misrepresentations.

Because plug-in surge protectors don't claim protection from direct lightning strikes, then instead HowStuffWorks claims most surge damage comes from refrigerators, et al. But we have demonstrated that such surges don't exist. In reality, lightning is the most common source of surge damage - in direct contradiction to plug-in manufacturer claims and to text in HowStuffWorks.


UPS protectors parts are as tiny as possible. Near zero joules. Just barely above zero so that a majority can be told it does 100% surge protection. All appliances already contain major protection. Only rare surges overwhelm that protection. If it does not protect from lightning, then it is protecting only from something that typically causes no damage.

UPS has only one function. Provide temporary (and 'dirty') power during a blackout.
 

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