New Hard Drive and Windows 7 = slower?

[se7ensmatrix121]

Hello everyone,

I would first like to start off by saying that I do love Windows 7, but I seem to be having some issues with my new internal HDD for my computer. I'll start by giving specs on my computer to give everyone an idea what I'm dealing with here.

Custom PC:
MainBoard: MS-7388
Processor: AMD Phenom x4 9750 (2.4GHz)
RAM: 8GB DDR2
Video: ATI Radeon HD 4890 (1GB GDDR5)
Sound: Onboard Realtek HD Audio
HDD: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB (7200rpm, 32mb cache, SATA, 3GB/s Transfer)

Last Defragment: 11/09/09
Last Backup: 11/10/09

Prior to installing the WD Black, my computer was running a Samsung SP2014N (7200rpm, 200GB, 8MB cache, IDE). While using Windows 7, this HD was very fast at accessing information, but transfer rates seemed low (in my opinion), and I needed much more space since my External HD was crashing.

After careful consideration, I purchased the new WD Black. Brought it home, connected the new HD, installed Win7, updating all drivers and even updating the BIOS as of yesterday. This new HDD seems slower than my old one, and I cannot seem to find a way to speed it up.

In BIOS, I have to run the new HDD through IDE settings for it accept it, but the primary and secondary IDE controllers are still showing with nothing running in their place. This also transfers over to Device Manager, where the new HDD shows up under the IDE/ATA/ATAPI Controllers as "ATA Channel 1", with DMA checked under advanced settings.

All Drivers have been updated prior to checking in here. I know I am not getting anywhere near the 3GB/s transfer rates that WD claims this drive will perform up to.

If anyone out there has any suggestions at all, I would love to hear from you. I'm just running out of ideas...

Thanks!
-Michael

 

[Frostmourne]

Did you connect the hard drive via SATA to SATA_1 on your mobo or SATA_0 on your mobo? What is your psu? That seems to be a mobo problem.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

It's connected to the 3rd SATA Port, which I am willing to guess is a SATA_1 slot on the board. Device Manager states that it is a SATA_1 slot. I was forced to place this in the 3rd port because of the bulkiness of the GPU, which covers the top two SATA slots.

Running an 850W Thermaltake Black Widow, so Power is not the issue.

 

[Frostmourne]

Try to put it in the first slot. Look in the manual one for SATA_1 on the board or _0.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

I will attempt this, however, I have a feeling it's going to be a losing battle due to the PCI-E x16 slot covering these two ports. I will report back from my phone if there is any update.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

As suspected, the GPU placement prohibits use of the SATA 1 location, however, I did move the SATA cables for the BluRay player to port 4, moving the HDD to port 3. I'm testing now to see if there is improvement.

 

[SquonkSC]

I will attempt this, however, I have a feeling it's going to be a losing battle due to the PCI-E x16 slot covering these two ports. I will report back from my phone if there is any update.

Hi se7ensmatrix121,

I'm sorry to disappoint you but there's no way in the world you are going to get 3Gbit/s
That is a theoretical maximum for the Sata II standard, but that applies to the controller, not the disks themselves.

3gbit/s = 384 Mbytes per second and there isn't a "platter" disk in the world that can go that fast.

Somewhere between 60 and 80 Mbyte/s is the max sustained throughput you can get with a single platter disk. And about 128Mbyte/s bursts for very short periods when the disk's cache is read instead of the platters.


Why do they make a 3Gbit/s (384Mbyte/s) standard while no disk can reach that, I hear you think.

Well, for starters the controller standard always has to be ahead of the disk speeds,
so the disks have some headroom, and to allow development of faster disks.
there's no point in making a disk faster than the controller can handle.

Having said that,

The Sata II standard is created with SSD disks in mind.
The newest SSD disks are getting very close to that theoretical maximum.
The fastest to date reads and writes at 260 Mbytes/s.

It won't be long before SSD breaks the 384Mb barrier.
Therefore Sata III is already on it's way, that will be 6Gbit/s (768Mb/s)

Soon SSD will become more affordable and platter disks will die a slowly disappear, just like the floppy disk.

I hope this explains it.

 

[Frostmourne]

I'll buy an SSD when 1TB becomes affordable. Die out? Not for a looooong time.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

My main issue is not the theoretical 3GB/s, it's that my new HDD is not performing to the speed of the 4 year old IDE HDD that it was replacing. The new HDD is sluggish in spots the old HDD was not. Graphic design programs like Photoshop in 64 bit would load files in roughly a few seconds with swift, on the fly changes made instantly, where the new HDD stutters over itself to keep up on the same files.

On a side note, in slot 3, the HDD is now listed as ATA channel 0. I am still not seeing a change in the speeds. Slot 1 cannot be used as the GPU sits directly over it, and moving the GPU to the other PCI-E slot will drop it to an x8 performance.

 

[Frostmourne]

Try SATA_1 if its faster, temporarily.

 

[SquonkSC]

I'll buy an SSD when 1TB becomes affordable. Die out? Not for a looooong time.

It will go faster than you think.

Prices are already a quarter of what they were the same time last year.
It's like how it went with VHS, CD, DVD etc..

First you have the early adopters who buy them at exorbitant prices.
Then they get a bit cheaper, and more people buy them, they get cheaper yet again, and even more people buy them.
It's an accelerating process.

SSD is in fact much cheaper to produce than regular disks.
The only reason they are more expensive is because they are produced in smaller numbers.

A turning point will soon be reached, where the SSD will be so affordable, nobody will want to buy the regular disks, but rather pay 50 bucks more for a SSD.

That will be the nail on the coffin of the platter disk.

By the end of 2011, platter disks are a thing of the past.

Mark my words.

Greetings,

Michel

 

[SquonkSC]

My main issue is not the theoretical 3GB/s, it's that my new HDD is not performing to the speed of the 4 year old IDE HDD that it was replacing. The new HDD is sluggish in spots the old HDD was not. Graphic design programs like Photoshop in 64 bit would load files in roughly a few seconds with swift, on the fly changes made instantly, where the new HDD stutters over itself to keep up on the same files.

On a side note, in slot 3, the HDD is now listed as ATA channel 0. I am still not seeing a change in the speeds. Slot 1 cannot be used as the GPU sits directly over it, and moving the GPU to the other PCI-E slot will drop it to an x8 performance.

Hi again se7ensmatrix121,

You haven't told how fast or how slow it is in Mb/sec.
That makes it hard to judge what;s the problem.

I have a ton of experience with harddisks and a few things I can tell you.

First, Samsung disks are faster than WD, about 8 to 10%.

Even if it's an IDE or Sata makes no difference, because like I said the fact the disk is Sata, doesn't make it faster.

IDE UDMA 6 or otherwise named ATA 133 can handle up to 133mb/s

Since the construction properties of a platter disk limits it's maximum output,
the method of connecting won't magically make it run faster.
An average platter disk will always deliver between 60 and 80Mb/s, period.

Having said that, you say it's sluggish.
It shouldn't be sluggish.

It might be some driver or setting holding it down, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if the disk is just a Monday morning drive.

About 5% of all new disks are badly constructed, and die in the first three months.
About 2% are DOA. Dead on arrival.

It could be the drive has some bad sectors that have to be read multiple times to get data from it.
It could be a rotten cache chip.

But it could also be windows accessing the disk excessively.
Try to find out if some process or service is accessing the disk constantly.


Good luck.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

As requested, I managed (just barely) to slide the cable into the top, SATA_1 slot. I'm noticing minimal performance differences from the way it was before, and slightly faster speeds with Photoshop.

Boot up times are minimal as always with my settings, so I do not see a change with this. I suppose this will be as good as it gets. I'll keep messing around with other programs to see if I notice a difference.

 

[Frostmourne]

Can you test the hard drive on another pc?

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

Hi again se7ensmatrix121,

You haven't told how fast or how slow it is in Mb/sec.
That makes it hard to judge what;s the problem.
-I'm unsure what the Samsung HDD MB/sec, however, from the last run of HDTune, I can tell you the info on the WD Black. Min: 43.3 MB/Sec, Max: 103.7 MB/Sec, Average: 79.9 MB/Sec with Access Time: 12.6 ms, and Burst of 132.1 MB/Sec


Having said that, you say it's sluggish.
It shouldn't be sluggish.
It might be some driver or setting holding it down, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if the disk is just a Monday morning drive.
-I have checked into all of the drivers, making sure they are all correct, up to date, and viable for Win7, but these are all the same drivers that where used with the previous HDD as well.


About 5% of all new disks are badly constructed, and die in the first three months.
About 2% are DOA. Dead on arrival.
-Ironically, the first WD Black that I purchased was DOA. Refused to format by any means what so ever. I guess that should have been the first sign that I should have went to a different HDD huh?

It could be the drive has some bad sectors that have to be read multiple times to get data from it.
It could be a rotten cache chip.
-I was going to run WD's DLG program to see if there where bad sectors on the HDD. Perhaps the next step I take?


But it could also be windows accessing the disk excessively.
Try to find out if some process or service is accessing the disk constantly.
-Unsure on how to find this information, but hopefully you can steer me that direction?


Good luck.

Responses are in red. Thank you for taking the time to respond to me.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

Can you test the hard drive on another pc?

This is the only PC that I have at the moment. My GF's PC is back at the shop for a manufacturer defect on the MoBo.

 

[Frostmourne]

Update your chipset driver which will most likely update the controller drivers.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

Update your chipset driver which will most likely update the controller drivers.

Update the Chipset again? I recently (yesterday) installed the BIOS update for my computer, jumping it up to 1.A0 from 1.70. MSI is indicating that 1.A0 is the most recent.

 

[Frostmourne]

Its not the BIOS, its the chipset of your mobo.

 

[se7ensmatrix121]

How will I do this? I'm good with computers, but not all aspects.